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About to get into Casting and need a few suggestions

895 views 10 replies 8 participants last post by  res45 
#1 ·
First off I don't have alot of first hand experience with cast bullets, so I'm really worried about leading the barrel up! My 1st question is I have a decently steady supply of roof lead since a friend of mine owns a roofing co, I know that roofing lead is way too soft to cast as is so what ratio should I add to it to harden it up a bit? 2nd question is to gas check or not? I plan on casting 250 grain Keith style or 240 grain semi wad cutters for my .44 mag and 158 grain semi wad cutters for my mom's .357 mag and I plan on getting a .357 mag for myself in the near future. At over $40.00 per k of 44 cal Hornady gas checks if I go this route I plan on getting a Pat Marlin Checkmaker in 44 and 357/38.
 
#2 ·
Might be of a little service here. I cast for both .38s and .44s, and have done so since the ealy 1970s. Like all reloading questions, the first thing is to ask yourself "what am I going to use these for?"

For me, cast bullets are for practice and target shooring. Of course, a chunk of lead from a .357 or a .44 mag will do a great deal of damage on a real target if necessary. So here's my input:

I like to keep it simple. At velocities that most handgun loads work with, I don't consider a gas check design important. Some folks may disagree, but I firmly believe that while gas check bullets are a must with most rifle velocities, you are wasting time, money and effort with gas checks on a pistol bullet. My pistol bullet moulds are all 'plain base'. Keep it simple.

As far as leading - of course you don't want to use pure lead for anything except blackpowder minies or round balls - or shotgun slugs. Being a keep it simple guy, when I get soft lead, I mix it with hard lead 50-50. Again. this is for pistol loads. I flux it well and often to enure that I mix it as well as I can.

In my experiance, 4 things cause bore leading: Undersized bullets; bullets driven too fast, too soft of lead or a rough bore.

If you are loading for rifle or competition shooting, of course you would wan't to get complex and cast with hardness testers and "the whole nine yards". You should slug the bore and get the diameter of both pistols. I like to size my bullets about one thousand - or even two -over the bore measurement. I still use alox lube, but that is only because it's worked for me for almost 50 years. There are better lubes on the market today.

There are many bullet casters here - so somebody will have a different take than me, and that's fine. Just telling you what I do.
 
#4 ·
can i tag on to this.. because i'm a closet cast thread watcher. I think I plan on getting into it one day.

are there any places that sell lead projectiles for rifles, pre sized and gas checked?

or is it just easier to buy plated projectiles ( berrys ) ??
 
#5 ·
Soundguy - I did a very quick search for outfits that sell cast rifle bullets with gas checks and here are 2 - Hunter's Supply, Rim Rock Bullets. I know nothing about them, so this isn't an endorsement from me.

This is pure opinion: The main reason to cast rifle bullets is to save money on reloading, with a second reason of having an unlimited supply of at least one of your components. Most rifle bullets do use a gas check, so the 'unlimited supply' part goes away. You have to buy those.

Plated projectiles are a second-best thing to a jacketed bullet, being less costly and not in the same performance scale as factory jacketed bullets. They are a great practice and plinker bullet.

Anbody has a different view, please jump in on this! I'm only shareing an opinion, and it isn't any better than anyone else'.
 
#7 ·
For the first question, roofing lead is pure lead, while hard lead suitable for bullets contains 2 - 5% Antimony by weight. A bit of searching led me to one supplier of Sb metal:

http://www.rotometals.com/Antimony-s/1.htm

I'm sure you can find others, and I'd recommend finding a source that sells powder. I've never tried it, but I think you'd have a hard time dissolving a chunk of antimony (MP 1200F) in melted lead (MP ~ 600F). With the powder, you could melt the lead, stir in the antimony, then raise the temperature slowly to about 1200 while stirring. I wasn't able to find the melting point of the alloy, but it should be somewhere in between these extremes. Both metals will oxidize readily, so you'll need some kind of flux - charcoal, perhaps. And both are quite toxic, so wear the proper protective gear and work outdoors.
 
#8 ·
If you are using "roof lead" , don't forget to collect the seams that join the lead panels together. The seams contain a lot of tin and when mixed together , the resulting hardness is just about perfict for handgun cast bullets. Of course every lead roof is different and you may have to add tin or sometimes you have to add pure lead to get the right hardness for your aplications.
A lead hardness tester is a must for casting.

I do have all the equipment for making cast bullets using gas checks. Over time I have found them useless for handgun and more often than not for rifle.
Using gas checks will ultematly be decided on the bullet application. (velocity ect.)

Good luck and don't forget to save the lead panel seams.

PS .I myself only use roof lead for casting.
 
#9 ·
I'm certainly no expert, but it is my understanding that you can drive at a higher velocity with gas checks. My cast pistol bullets don't exceed anything over 1000 FPS. If I need more power than that I'll use a rifle. Just in my experiance, my loads work best for me if I keep them well under maximum.

JFWIW, my brother has cast bullets - especially for the .30-30 and 8mm - and he has used gas checks extensively. He has switched from cast rifle bullets in that caliber to plated or jacketed bullets due to leading problems. I only cast .45-70 rifle bullets now, but still cast .38/9mm/ .44/.45ACP and .45 Colt. Still set up for .58 mines, but I haven't shot those in years.
 
#11 ·
One thing I have learned over the years of casting and shooting is that fit is king followed by a good lube and powder choice. If the bullet doesn't fit properly it's going to lead no matter what. For revolvers I always size the bullet to fit the cylinder throats since there suppose to and should be larger than the groove dia. of the bore.
There are occasions when a gas check is warranted such as when you want to shoot a softer alloy bullet at a higher velocity and pressure than the alloys BHN could normally withstand for expansion purposes or if your rifle or pistol has a new but slightly rough bore that hasn't had the tooling marks polished from shooting enough jacketed bullets.
I routinely shoot pure lead bullet out of rifle and handguns at around 1100 fps. range or lower with no leading issues in plain base or with bullets designed to take a gas check with them left off. If I'm going to push the bullet a bit faster an at slightly higher pressure I just use 50/50 Lead.wheel weight alloy or wheel weights straight up. Those bullets can be water quenched or oven heat treat to add extra hardness if necessary,mostly for magnum handgun and high velocity rifle loads where expansion is not desired.

Besides the Cast Boolit Forum you can find so good info here as well http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Contents.htm

Some other gas check options
http://www.sagesoutdoors.com/index.php
http://vulcanchecks.com/
 
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