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h&r serial # q's

1K views 8 replies 3 participants last post by  schmike 
#1 ·
hi, i'm mike a new member:
i have been trying to figure out when two of my h&r top-break's were manufactured. I dont have the capability to post clear photos but i will try to be as descriptive as possible. i dont care about value just when made.
#1: a stainless or chrome revolver with H. & R. "AUTOMATIC" on the left of the barrel, 38 S&W CTGE. on the right. The top of the barrel says HARRINGTON & RICHARDSON ARMS CO. WORCESTER,MASSACHUSETTS U.S.A. no patent date and massachusetts is spelled out. the serial number is 504xxx and located on the bottom of the grip and also under the bridge of the barrel. the grips look to have been changed as they are mother of pearl. it has a 5 shot cylinder.
#2: also a chrome or stainless revolver. 6 shot this time. also a top break with: 32 S&W CTGE. on left of barrel and nothing on the right side. it has the same top of barrel markings except massachusetts is abbreviated MASS again no patent date. it has what i think is black plastic grips. the grips have the h&r diamond target logo on them. the serial number is: 377xxx and is located on the inside of the grip and under the bridge of the barrel.
#1 has a 3" barrel and #2 has a 4" barrel.
Any help you could give me would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks.
 
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#2 ·
#1: Massachusetts spelled out was in use from 1916-1942.
#2: Mass with no patent dates from 1914-1915.

These dates are roughly correct. Some overlapping of years is probable. Both are likely to be "Auto-ejecting Third Models" from 1905-1941. (AUTOMATIC)= automatic ejection of the shells when opened.

H&R used nickel plating on their revolvers.

Need to know
 
#3 ·
1. Automatic Ejecting 3rd Model. It is either a 4th or 5th variation depending on whether the grip frame has a step-down for the grip(4th variation, 1916-1924) or is the same width as the receiver(5th variation, 1925-1939). If it were made in or after 1940 the serial number would be preceded by a letter that corresponds to a year. The gun is nickel plated, not chrome or stainless.

2. Automatic Ejecting 3rd Model, 3rd Variation. It was made between 1913-1915. It should be chambered in .32S&W Long due to being a post-1905 .32 caliber gun. HOWEVER, there is the possibility that H&R did chamber an odd-ball large frame in .32S&W(the short one). It would be wise to cast/measure one of the chambers to compared to known measurements of those respective cartridges. The gun is nickel plated, not chrome or stainless.

Both guns are smokeless models.

Serial numbers before 1940 pretty much mean squat crap with H&R. Goforth and Hauff did make some inroads on some serial number runs prior to 1940, but they aren't reliable enough to be used as canon.
 
#4 ·
#1: Massachusetts spelled out was in use from 1916-1942.
#2: Mass with no patent dates from 1914-1915.

These dates are roughly correct. Some overlapping of years is probable. Both are likely to be "Auto-ejecting Third Models" from 1905-1941. (AUTOMATIC)= automatic ejection of the shells when opened.

H&R used nickel plating on their revolvers.

Need to know
Hey nj49:
thanks for the info it really helped!
I finally know how old these really are.
thanks
 
#5 ·
1. Automatic Ejecting 3rd Model. It is either a 4th or 5th variation depending on whether the grip frame has a step-down for the grip(4th variation, 1916-1924) or is the same width as the receiver(5th variation, 1925-1939). If it were made in or after 1940 the serial number would be preceded by a letter that corresponds to a year. The gun is nickel plated, not chrome or stainless.

2. Automatic Ejecting 3rd Model, 3rd Variation. It was made between 1913-1915. It should be chambered in .32S&W Long due to being a post-1905 .32 caliber gun. HOWEVER, there is the possibility that H&R did chamber an odd-ball large frame in .32S&W(the short one). It would be wise to cast/measure one of the chambers to compared to known measurements of those respective cartridges. The gun is nickel plated, not chrome or stainless.

Both guns are smokeless models.

Serial numbers before 1940 pretty much mean squat crap with H&R. Goforth and Hauff did make some inroads on some serial number runs prior to 1940, but they aren't reliable enough to be used as canon.
knight0334:
thanks for all the info. The first gun does have a step down grip, something i didn't notice before. the second is chambered in the .32sw(short) i brought it in to a gun shop and they measured it and they told me it was the short. the cylinder is 1.25" long, i'm pretty sure that makes it the short. and wouldnt the gun be stamped .32swl if long? does this make this gun more rare? or is it just an odd-ball caliber for the large frame?
thanks again for the insight it saved me tons of time trying to research on my own and i trust you guys more. been reading here for quite a while, just never joined, glad i did.
 
#6 ·
The chambering determined things. The small frame H&R .32cal were all .32S&W and had a 0.9" long cylinder.

The large frame .32 calibers prior to 1905 were .32S&W(and some .32H&R and .32H&R Long). After 1905 pretty much all large frames .32cal's were .32S&W Long.

H&R didn't always put "Long" on their older handguns. Sometimes they used the designation ".32S&W CTGE" because the "Long" chamber could also shoot the .32S&W. All the large frames used the same longer cylinder(.22, .32, and .38 calibers), they were just reamed to whatever cartridge they needed it for.

Thus is why the chamber itself must be measured
 
#7 ·
The chambering determined things. The small frame H&R .32cal were all .32S&W and had a 0.9" long cylinder.

The large frame .32 calibers prior to 1905 were .32S&W(and some .32H&R and .32H&R Long). After 1905 pretty much all large frames .32cal's were .32S&W Long.

H&R didn't always put "Long" on their older handguns. Sometimes they used the designation ".32S&W CTGE" because the "Long" chamber could also shoot the .32S&W. All the large frames used the same longer cylinder(.22, .32, and .38 calibers), they were just reamed to whatever cartridge they needed it for.

Thus is why the chamber itself must be measured
thanks for the extra info, i've learned so much. how do i measure the chamber, the guy at the gun store must not have known as much as he thaught. you're explanation makes much more sense.
thx
 
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