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Unknown Break Action

3K views 35 replies 7 participants last post by  CTRJR 
#1 ·
Hey all,
Just recently received a rifle from my grandfather with the request that I research it and find out what the history of it is. It's a single shot break action and it's stamped on the side and bottom of the receiver with "F Copeland Stirling Mass." Doing a little digging, I learn that a Frank Copeland used to work for Allen and Wheelock and afterward, began to make his own guns in Worcester county, Massachusetts.

"Mr. Frank Copeland, 17 Hermon Street, established a manufactory for fire-arms in 1863 ; he was formerly in the employ of Allen & Wheelock, at their old shop at the Junction. He first manufactured revolvers, and in 1876 devised a single-shot breech-
loading sporting gun, called "The Champion."

Mr. Copeland's second gun is a single-barreled sporting gun, called the " F. Copeland Gun," which is more strongly constructed, better in action and capable of standing heavier charges, and altogether more durable."
From a book on the history of Worcester county. Starts me in the right direction but doesn't give me all the details I'm looking for.

I've also seen that he is more well known for his pocket revolvers and have found mention of them in a couple books but nothing about his rifles. The gun has no other markings so I can't determine patent dates, model names, caliber, etc. I've ordered a book that supposedly has information on Mr. Copeland but in the mean time, anybody have any information on this guy and his guns at all?
Pictures to follow in the next post.

Thanks,
Corey
 
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#4 ·
My goodness...what an unusual and interesting piece!!! I'm sorry I can't tell you a thing about it but do have a couple questions. Does the action open by swinging the trigger guard extension or, does it open at all? Do you know if the barrel has been cut? The false muzzle for loading from the muzzle, the heavy barrel, aperture type sights and the Schuetzen style butt plate seem to make for a target rifle. However, given the apparent era from which that rifle is from the barrel is entirely too short.
 
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#5 ·
The trigger guard swings to the right to open the action. I don't know if the actions been cut but I definitely think something was done to it because of the funky sight arrangement.

I would definitely go shoot it except I can't even look up what this thing shoots! Plus the butt plate is one of the most uncomfortable plates I've ever felt.
 
#6 ·
That might fall into a category called a "Buggy Rifle" They were much shorter (to make it easier to carry in a buggy) and intended for casual shooting matches when taking a tour of the countryside.
Most buggy rifles I have seen were pure muzzle loaders but this one may have been made during the transition to cartridge. The false muzzle indicates that the designer felt that you got more accuracy from paper patching and "pre-engraving" the bullet to the rifling by ramming the bullet from the muzzle and could control the powder charge better by using a case loaded at the breech.

I've always liked the ways that the "handle" on the false muzzle blocks the sight picture so you won't try to fire the gun with the muzzle in place.....
 
#7 ·
I'm at work right now so I can't check but either the false muzzle isn't removable on this specific rifle or its just really stuck on there from decades of sitting in my grandfather's basement. I'll have to take a look when I get back home.

So seeing as this is a cartridge gun (it has an extractor that's actuated when you open the action), if you were to load this from the muzzle as intended by the false muzzle, you would press a bullet down into the barrel and load a "blank" cartridge in the breech?

I have almost no experience with firearms from before the 20th century so this is all brand new to me. I appreciate all the information you guys have given me so far!
 
#8 ·
If you're trying to shoulder the rifle as you would a modern hunting rifle I'm sure it is uncomfortable. If you shoulder it as an offhand Schuetzen rifle should be shouldered the hooked buttplate is both highly functional and comfortable.

That is a false muzzle and it must be stuck. deadin is "dead right" about the loading and the false muzzle. The handle is there blocking the sight so the rifle wasn't fired with it in place, sending the false muzzle into oblivion. There should be 3 or 4 pins in the "false" part corresponding to holes in the end of the rifle barrel.

I would really like to see the action open. When I saw the extended trigger guard I suspected the action was either a direct copy or a variation of the Henry Jones underlever of British and German use and fame. It could also be a case of parallel development but that seems really unlikely to me as the Jones action was used all over the world. The Jones underlever was/is a strong action and is a variation of the much earlier Lefaucheux action which dates from the 1830's and was originally pin fire.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casimir_Lefaucheux

The way they were loaded was from the muzzle with usually a long bullet with a paper patch, just as deadin described. The ramrod was cut to an exact length so the bullet stayed in the bore just in front of the throat. A charged cartridge was then inserted into the chamber and the rifle was ready to fire.

The only way you can know what cartridge the rifle takes is to make a chamber cast and slug the bore. Even then it is entirely probable you won't be able to identify the cartridge. That doesn't mean you can't shoot it, you can, but to do so may take some interesting case work and quite possibly a custom mold and some lengthy load development using black powder. Conversely there is a small possibility it might be chambered for a cartridge readily available....but you cannot know until you cast the chamber and slug the bore. There is no other way....and you can ask me how I know that...:D

Again, deadin could be "dead on" about it being a buggy rifle. I'm going to have to plead ignorance as I've never seen either a Schuetzen rifle cut as a buggy rifle or a buggy rifle in Schuetzen guise. It's certainly entirely possible.

Sure would like to see a picture of the barrel lugs and the inside of the receiver.....:D
 
#10 · (Edited by Moderator)
Sure would like to see a picture of the barrel lugs and the inside of the receiver.....:D
Worry not, baby bird. I'll feed ya. When I get home (won't be for another 9 or so hours) I'll take a few more pictures in better light.

I didn't think much of this rifle at first but the more I learn, the more interesting it gets. Much more interesting from a design standpoint than the Winchester 94 I also got from him.

They didn't always have to be loaded this way, you could load the bullet into the cartridge just as we do today but when they were shooting in competition that's how they loaded it to squeeze the utmost accuracy out of it.
Makes sense. Now, are they actually useful or are they one of those things that we thought was beneficial but really didn't do much other than look cool?
 
#9 ·
Lol' I was going to type in a long post describing how and why these rifles were loaded as they were but Sharps beat me to it. ;)

They didn't always have to be loaded this way, you could load the bullet into the cartridge just as we do today but when they were shooting in competition that's how they loaded it to squeeze the utmost accuracy out of it.
 
#11 ·
Back in the day they were shooting dead soft lead bullets and the base of the bullet did get some damage on being fired as it came out of the cartridge and shooting soft lead leaded up the barrel.

Loading the bullet from the front via a false muzzle allowed the use of cross paper patching preventing both the damage to the bullet base and lead fouling.

The false muzzle prevented damage to the crown during loading and cleaning as well as pre engraving the rifling and guiding the bullet squarely into the bore.

So to them it was deemed useful when shooting in long range competition.

Today we have jacketed bullets or alloyed lead and a better understanding of how to manufacture ammunition so it doesn't deform the bullet base when it's fired.

Are there two shallow grooves cut at right angles to each other about the same width as the bore on the face of the false muzzle?
 
#13 ·
That's going to depend on the condition of the bore, if it's still in good shape and the action is still capable of locking up tight, it very well could still be safe to fire with an alloyed lead bullet and black powder, that's something that needs to be determined by a hands on examination by a qualified gunsmith. None of us, no matter how much of an expert we might be, can tell you this from looking at pictures on line.

P.S., if it is still safe to fire and you can determine what cartridge and bullet it is chambered for, be careful, be very careful, these things are highly addictive and there is no known cure. ;)
 
#14 ·
Of course. I meant as just a general rule, would shooting something like that be safe? My plan is to take the Winnie 94 my grandfather gave me to get reblued as the finish has mostly worn off so perhaps I'll end up bring this rifle along for the ride for him to take a look at.
 
#15 ·
As a general rule you should never have an antique or collectable rifle refinished, it will destroy much of the collectors value, just have your gunsmith give them a safety check up and please start a new thread showing off your '94, we all like gun porn :)
 
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#16 ·
Valid point. I do intend on using the 94 as my grandfather did. He actually showed me a mounted buck the other week that he had taken with that rifle who knows how many decades ago. It's a takedown chambered in .30-30 with a pretty low S/N (65xxx). Pictures of that will be inbound at the end of the day as well (boy this shift can't move any slower now).

Once I get my gunsmith to take a look at this mystery gun, I'll probably be back for advice on black powder and determining loads for this rifle. I've got little experience with antique/curio firearms in general, but even less with black powder.
 
#17 ·
Here's a picture of what your muzzle should look like if you can get the false muzzle removed..



This one is on a heavy barrel sidehammer target muzzleloader I have. Unfortunately I don't have the false muzzle and, as far as I know, there is no economical way to make one....
Some false muzzles were set up for the "cross" paper patch (a $1 bill is just about the right thickness and durability for the strips. You can get several out of each bill, depending on the caliber...), others were a continuation of the rifling and had to be made at the same time as the barrel was rifled. Another benefit was to keep ramrod wear away from the actual muzzle of the rifle
 
#18 ·
Yeah I can see how that would be a pain to manufacture one after the fact. Machining it to fit probably wouldn't be hard but making the rifling match is a whole 'nother story. What would you suggest would be a good, safe way to get the false muzzle off? A couple whacks with a soft mallet (plastic, wood, rubber)? Obviously the goal is to not damage either pieces.
 
#19 ·
You would probably want to stand it muzzle first in a container that has some penetrating oil in it and let it soak for a while ( several days at least ) before trying to remove it. then gentle taps with a non marring hammer might get it to come off.
 
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#20 ·
I've done a couple of false muzzled barrels from solid blanks and I had an old school gunsmith ( Al Osterman) explain to me how to do a false muzzle on an already rifled blank and get the riflings to mate up perfectly, but that's something I've never put into practice.
 
#21 ·
If you have the 94 refinished and re-blued you can immediately deduct about 50% of its value. As it's a take down perhaps more than that, especially given how early it is.

As far as shooting jacketed bullets in the old rifle no sir, I wouldn't. At that time barrel steels were a lot softer than today and a diet of jacketed bullets will wear it fairly rapidly. Lead or lead alloy would be fine.

As I understand it the false muzzles were made by drilling the locating holes first, indexing the false muzzle to the barrel then cutting off that section of the barrel. Cut the three or four troughs for the paper patch, install the pins and it was done. I would assume there would have to be at least some chamfer at the mouth of the false muzzle to facilitate loading. Occasionally one sees an old Wesson, Billinghurst, Brockway, Nelson or other match rifle for sale but holy cow....for what they bring I'd rather have another double rifle...and I can't afford that either!
 
#22 ·
The information you guys have provided has been invaluable.

But here comes the inevitable question on every antique gun owners mind. Taking into account how little we all know about the history of this gun, what kind of number can we attach to its value? It's pretty difficult to say since I don't know of any other rifle like this one but anybody have a reasonable guesstimate?
 
#24 ·
Some more pictures for your viewing pleasure.



Upon further inspection, it looks like the firing pin may be broken as even when the back is depressed, it does not poke through into the receiver, or even come close for that matter. I'm not confident enough in my gunsmithing skills to go taking it apart to try and see the broken piece so it may just have to stay hidden.
 
#26 ·
The trigger guard swings to the right to open the action. I don't know if the actions been cut but I definitely think something was done to it because of the funky sight arrangement.

I would definitely go shoot it except I can't even look up what this thing shoots! Plus the butt plate is one of the most uncomfortable plates I've ever felt.
It could be a childs gun.
 
#27 ·
Interesting gun!!
Several things..
First, the false muzzle is not for paper patched bullets but rather for regular slugs and is designed to assure they enter the bore and rifling true and square. (It would have been used with a short starter..)
Second, it appears to be a center fire of some sort, so there is hope if you ever decide to try to get it fireable. (replacing the firing pin shouldn't be much of a task.)
Third, the breech appears to have some pretty bad "black powder cancer". Is there any bore left?

Sooner or later, someone will show up here with an idea of just what you have.
You might forward your pictures to Jim Supica at the NRA National Firearms Museum in Washington DC. I'm sure someone there will know about it.
 
#28 ·
The bore and rifling actually look pretty decent. I'm trying to take some decent pictures of it but i seem to have misplaced my third arm and trying to take pictures with my cell phone without it is a bit of a chore.

I'm sure replacing the firing pin wouldn't be too difficult however its still a task i have to take to my gunsmith as it would have to be custom made. $10 says there are no spare parts floating around for something like this.

Thanks everybody for your input. This is already tons more information than I could have discovered all by myself.
 
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