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Questions for safe placement

6K views 50 replies 29 participants last post by  Sugarfoot 
#1 ·
Hi all,

I have purchase my 1st safe and have a question about where to place it.
It would be much easier to place it in my garage and bolt it down, but the garage temp fluctuates in the winter.
Generally it is between 40 and 64° during the winter. I have a pellet burner out there to keep stuff from freezing. Would a Golden Rod put out enough heat to keep my guns from rusting?

Or I can put it in the house. Just easier placement in the garage and my wife would probably prefer it out there also.

About the Golden Rod. The safe's outside dimensions are 59"H, 40"W, 20"D. Will one actually raise the temp inside by much? How big should I go with the Golden Rod?

Thanks,
Sugarfoot
 
#3 ·
You want to put your safe in the most temperature stable place you can. The master bedroom is usually a good spot if logistically possible. Don't put it near sources of humility, bathroom, laundry room etc....Ideally the best spot for your safe would also be hidden if you are lucky enough to be able to pull that one off. SWMBO didn't care for my plan to steal 8' from a room to create a hidden safe room so mine sadly is not hidden.
 
#4 ·
Congratulations on getting a safe. As already mentioned, everything else being equal, it is always preferable to put your safe where the temperature and humidity will be the most consistent. However, there are a couple of other important considerations.
First -- weight. What does the safe weigh after you put all of your stuff in it? I've seen more than one safe destroy a house. Sometimes you can see the problem right away, like when the stairs collapse while you're taking it in the front door or up to the second floor. Today most houses have reinforced floors just to support the weight of a bathtub full of water.
Second -- alarm. If you have an alarm system, put the safe someplace that is alarmed. Some folks have alarms but the garage or the basement isn't covered by the alarm. If you can extend your alarm to the garage or basement, then those places are contenders.... maybe.
Third -- concrete. Bolting it to the floor is always a good idea, but keep in mind that if the floor is concrete, water moving through the concrete will start doing it's dirty work. If you put it on a concrete floor, in a garage or a basement, make sure there is some sort of water barrier and preferably an air space between the concrete and the bottom of the safe.
Fourth -- drain. Lots of folks put a safe in the garage or basement and bolt it down securely with a vapor barrier/air space, but then the water pipes break or the hot water tank springs a leak or the washing machine overflows. One fellow had his house burn down and was telling the firemen about his concern over the guns in the safe in the basement as they were putting out the fire. Well, they saved the safe and the guns from the fire, but then sitting in three feet of water for two weeks until he could get the safe open wasn't real good for them.
Fifth -- sump pump. If the safe is below grade, then a sump pump with a battery back up is a good idea. You don't want to come home after a few days away and find there were no burglars, but a broken pipe filled the basement with water.
Best of luck and let us know what you decide.
 
#5 ·
One thing a lot of folks don't think about when buying a safe is getting it in your house without everyone knowing about it. when I bought mine, I bought it in another town, paid cash for it, loaded it on a trailer, brought it home and had my son, son in law and grandson help me bring it into the house, at night, without any of the neighbors prying eyes. I keep the closet where we put it locked, so even the pest control people don't see it.

Several years ago there was a home invasion locally where a man and his wife were killed because they had a safe the bad guys knew about and thought it had several thousand dollars in it. As it turned out the safe had very little money in it, but the couple were still killed. Don't advertise the fact you have a safe to the neighbors.
 
#23 · (Edited by Moderator)
When a thief pry bars your safe the leverage the door and pry it. If you mount the safe in the corner of a rood where the door opening is closest to the wall then if a thief tries to use a pry bar the pry bar will be up against the wall. A better way to describe it is the way the safe is positioned in a corner, the hinges are furthest away from the wall and the opening closest to the wall. When the thief tries to use a pry bar their knuckles will be almost touching the wall.
With the safe bolted down and cornered into the room it just makes it that much more difficult.


This is one of the many reasons I have a gun on my side when I am at home. Also, very visible outside cameras and lots of them. Our monitors are set so we can see a person before they ever step foot on our property and the neighbors dog and our dog bark when people are walking two houses down.

Gotta stay safe.

Highboy
 
#7 ·
About the Golden Rod. The safe's outside dimensions are 59"H, 40"W, 20"D. Will one actually raise the temp inside by much? How big should I go with the Golden Rod?
A GoldenRod won't raise the temperature noticeably. They are very low-powered. The point is to raise the temperature just enough to prevent condensation, nothing more.

If you put the safe in your garage, put it on a piece of rigid foam insulation. You can run the bolts through the insulation into the concrete floor. If your garage floor gets some water on the floor, the insulation will keep your safe up off the wet floor.

For temperature control, you will need a more powerful heater, but I would not put one inside the safe, because it will get too warm and possibly dry out your wooden stocks. Build a three-sided enclosure out of non-flamable materials large enough for the safe and a small heater. Get one with a thermostat, and set it pretty low so nothing gets too hot.
 
#9 ·
Our 2 safes are in our attached garage which has a sheetrocked/insulated interior. The temp fluctuates between 40 and 80 deg year around. The low end, 40 deg is when our temp outside is between 0-32 deg.

One is bolted down (Liberty Franklin)and it has all the firearms except what is in the SUV with me, and a shotgun in the closet in the master walk in closet. The other is simply an ammo safe.

The bolted one sits on a piece of indoor/outdoor carpet and has a dehumidifer (electric) inside.
My only issue is that the safe can be seen without my SUV in the garage, from the street when I pull out. I never leave the door open unless I'm washing the vehicle.

I have 4 layers of security though.
I have Active Motion Sensor camera on the exterior that alerts me to movement in the driveway via text message and email.
I have garage door alarms and side door alarm (Side door is BEHIND a 6' cedar fence)
I have dogs that are not nice if we're not around, but they are not in the garage.
I have nosey, stay-at-home-moms all around us.

If they attempted to break in through garage, first I'd be alerted to movement in the driveway.
Secondly, the horn in the attic is going to be blaring like a SOB, alerting nosy neighbors.
Thirdly, it's going to take some time to wrap a chain around the safe, yank it out of the foundation.
I think if this scenario went down, it would take them some time. They can't just go down the road dragging the safe, too many houses to go by, too many witnesses.
 
#14 ·
My advice is to put it in a corner, the bed room, or a closet. That gives you two walls, and the floor to bolt it to.
 
#15 ·
Good Morning from Arizona Sugarfoot...I read your question with more concern about the
rust than the temperatures...For years in the navy I worked in the refrigeration shop and
anytime we'd open up a system for repair or replacement of parts, moisture was our big
concern inside the closed system...This was in a high humidity area (Philippines) so we
would install shop rigged 'driers' into the high-side (pressure side) tubing lines
to trap the moisture ...those shop made driers contained silca-gel for the moisture trapping...even today one may get sealed up merchandise with packets of the silca-gel
contained therein....proper tmt of the guns with recommended types of oils would/should
prevent the rusting...Good Luck...Chief
Bulk Silica Gel - AGM Container
www.agmcontainer.com/products/desiccants/bulk-desiccant/bulk-silica-gel.html
  1. Cached
Whether you are using bulk silica gel to minimize the negative effects of moisture, ... AGM's offerings include indicating and non-indicating silica beads, as well as custom mixtures ranging from 0.08 mm to 8 mm in bead size. ... Stock Status.
 
#16 ·
Mines in my bedroom. I'd never put a safe in a garage. The temp fluctuations would always be a problem. The missus wasn't to excited about it being in there but she got over it.
 
#17 ·
Here in Florida, putting a safe in the garage would be a disaster. Temperatures vary from 90's during the day to 40's overnight with 100% humidity. Every morning the streets, my deck & even the siding looks like we had an inch of rain. If I had a gun safe & I would if all my guns weren't lost in a boating disaster, I would figure out a way to keep it in the house & install a humidistat to override the thermostat in case the humidity gets too high regardless of temp. If I ever get any guns that's what I'm gonna do!
 
#18 ·
Gun Geezer, personally I believe that all depends how you got your safe set up, and what type of safe it is.

I have a Liberty safe. When you close it, it seals up good enough to hold a 1200 deg fire from damaging the internal residents for 60 min. A Peet M10 dehumidifier plugged into to a 110v outlet through a little hole keeps the humidity down to 30% on an average (Less than the Arizona desert!) This picture was just taken moments ago and current weather is 98% humidity outside (it's raining like hell, typical WA state winter weather) Garage door is OPEN! (temporarily, hey gotta get the mail!)

This Airguide is VERY accurate, if I stuck it outside the safe for about 10 min it would read about 80% humidity, even with the sheet rocked garage.

Bottom line is, don't buy the hype of humidity, it depends on the type of safe (quality) and dehumidifier (heater) you have. There are a lot of mitigating factors that affect the contents of the safe besides geographical humidity.
 

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#19 ·
Mine are in my home office right behind me. I would never put a safe in my garage. I have a problem with my tools rusting out there.

My son has his in the basement. We have cameras on the house and one big dog left.
 
#21 ·
Mine are in my home office right behind me. I would never put a safe in my garage. I have a problem with my tools rusting out there.
Don't buy the hype of humidity, it depends on the type of safe (quality) and dehumidifier (heater) you have. Your tools aren't as well protected as a good safe and humidifier.

There are a lot of mitigating factors that affect the contents of the safe besides geographical humidity. As I said above, we have 98% humidity in the the months between Nov and April , sometime through June. Not an issue here with a good quality safe and dehumidifier.

You ever been to a museum and wonder why their artifacts don't age? Good protection and air dehumidifiers.
 
#31 ·
OK guys. Try not to laugh too hard, but I got a killer deal on a Sports Afield safe thru Costco.
It's 59"H, 40"W, 20"D. They had it on sale for $600. I signed up for Direct TV thru Costco a couple of months ago and got a $300 gift card that I used toward the safe. So, I pretty much got it for $300 before tax. Although it's a lesser safe, it's still more secure than my current glass front display cabinet.
Here's a link to a similar cabinet. They don't have mine on the site at the moment.

https://www.costco.com/Sports-Afiel...with-Theft-Alert-Alarm.product.100055234.html
 
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#24 ·
Okay, I'll share a safe theft in rural Sammamish county that was shared with me last year:
Victim had the safe mounted in the corner of his home office, their house was 1/2 mile off the main road, rural. Bolted to the wall behind and floor joyces (2x6) below.

The perps busted holes through the siding and drywall after breaking in, wrapped a chain around the safe, jerked that safe with a big 4x4 right through the wall, taking out a good portion of his flooring too. Dragged it BOUNCING down the road until the door snapped open, then stole the contents, left the safe, and took their chain. There was a witness to the event but 3/4 mile away.

Bottom line, if they want it bad enough, they'll get it.

Edit: I never did get the brand of the safe but it's "safe" to say it was a horizontal bolt shaft system and not Horizontal AND vertical bolt shaft system. You get what you pay for when it comes to safes.
 
#25 ·
If they want it bad enough, depending on who it is, they will get it. The typical gun safe really only stops two things, the unauthorized access to your guns from youngsters and "guests" and the smash and grab drug punk type criminal. The best insurance is if they never know it's there. While a hidden safe room is not practical for most of us we can still make effort to keep it low key. Hidden as best we can, closest behind the wife's wall o clothes etc, and doing what you can to keep youngsters and others with running mouth disease from blabbing to the guy down the street.
 
#29 ·
If they want it bad enough, depending on who it is, they will get it. The typical gun safe really only stops two things, the unauthorized access to your guns from youngsters and "guests" and the smash and grab drug punk type criminal. The best insurance is if they never know it's there. While a hidden safe room is not practical for most of us we can still make effort to keep it low key. Hidden as best we can, closest behind the wife's wall o clothes etc, and doing what you can to keep youngsters and others with running mouth disease from blabbing to the guy down the street.
Actually, there was an article where thieves in jail explained what their operative was, the first was the closet, they know most folks keep guns in the wardrobe closets!
 
#30 ·
Go to a driving range and invest in a couple of buckets of golf balls.
It's like ball bearings for gun safes.
Put it inside in a closet to minimize access to the side panels,which can be defeated with portable metal cutting tools
Bolt it down.
Make sure you've got a dog and/or burglar alarm
That's probably as good as it gets unless you're a millionaire.
 
#33 ·
LOL! I knew it wouldn't hold 40 guns, but damn, what did they do? Design it around 40 Marlin 39A rifles? If they actually got 40 long guns in there, they had to be damn skinny and un-scoped!
I may design my own rack board and see if the space can be used a little better.
 
#34 ·
Agree, an inferior safe is better than nothing! Especially with kids around.
When my collection of firearms went over $10k (which is peanuts to some of the collections that folks own here) I upgraded to a quality safe. Now my collection has grown to $18k (Still peanuts, but MY peanuts! :) ).

I watched this video called "Race to the bottom" and that convinced me to buy a new safe!
 
#37 ·
Agree, an inferior safe is better than nothing! Especially with kids around.
Up till now I've had a glass front cabinet. I've always liked the way it looked, but there have been some break-ins in my county over the last year or so. I figure it's at least a deterrent along with the dogs.
 
#35 ·
I've seen the vids on how easy it is for the bad guys to get into even an expensive safe. So I bought what is essentially a storage locker with a key lock to keep little fingers out. But the safe isn't in an obvious place, a dark location, and I've gotten boxes of stuff stacked between it and the quick viewing angle.
 
#38 ·
Most of those videos show the bad guys pushing the safe over onto its back and having plenty of room to get their big crow bars in and having good leverage. Now take that same safe and have it properly anchored to the floor whether it be a good wood or concrete slab. It would then take much longer.

Your average burglar is not going to try and tackle a well mounted gun safe, but a simple hammer or small crow bar will allow that same burglar to get into your Stack-On cabinet in seconds no matter where you have it or how you mount it.
 
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