I just inherited a new drilling that I know nothing about. I have tried to research it but mostly I find guns that are different than this one. I know this was a bring back from ww2. I would love to know the year it was built. What do you think the value would be and how is the best way to clean it? Thanks keith
Ahhh....an old side lever drilling with a "right" name on it! Unless there is other proof marks, which from your pictures I doubt, the best that can be done is a date range. To the best of my recollection date codes were not used until right after WWI. Another clue is the side lever and the dolls head extension. By the 1890's and earliest 1900's they were both pretty much on their way out as the top lever and Greener cross bolt were replacing them. I also don't see any Nitro proofs which were fairly common by 1900. While light, smokeless powder loads, IF loaded correctly, can be ok it is basically a black powder cartridge drilling. My best guess is late 1880's/early 1890's up to maybe the beginning of WWI.
The 118/35 indicates the bore diameter and usually that size is for the 9.3 X 72R cartridge of which there was basically 4 different versions and not all are interchangeable. The shotgun barrels are 16 bore and the circled 16 indicates the chambers are 2 1/2 in. I don't see it but if there is a crown over a W that bore is choked, degree unknown.
As you have probably learned the top lever is for selecting the right shotgun barrel or the rifle barrel. The front trigger is most likely a single set trigger and if there is a screw between the triggers it definitely is. The screw is for adjusting sear engagement. The front trigger is set by pushing it forward until it clicks. The lift up tang sight was usually not actually for a tang sight as we in the US consider them. It was more for use to sharpen the sight picture of the open sights much as those of us who wear glasses and use either the Merrit optical device or the Lyman diopter or, in my case, a piece of tape with a hole punched in it stuck to my glasses lens.
Depending on the condition of the bores and providing you have the forearm, I don't see it in the pictures, drillings of that vintage and action type are usually somewhere south of $2,000.00. The old drilling appears to be in pretty good condition as in tight to face. If the locks function correctly and the ribs are tight I'd be putting that one back to work.
Drillings are cool and old drillings even more so. Congrats on your acquisition!!!
Eduard Kettner was founded 1884 in Coeln am Rhein ( up to 1919 it was written Coeln, later Koeln). Kettner has had factories in Coeln and Suhl. This Drilling was proofed in Suhl past 1902 and before 1912. Crown over G, S, U, E and W (on the left barrel under crown over S) are the proof marks. Crown over E stands for proof with Express load. The gauge marking 118.35 stamped on many early 9,3 x 72R rifle barrels. Rifles marked this way usually have a groove diameter of .357 - .359". This makes common .35" bullets useable. The barrels are made from Krupp Stahl (steel). The top lever is to open the gun, the side lever is to cock the rifle barrel. When it's cocked, the front trigger is for the rifle barrel. This system was invented by Henry Pieper.
D.R.G.M. 169054 is a registered and protected design from Ernst Kerner, Suhl in Thuringia from 27.January 1902. Translated from German:
Three hammer locks with upright mainsprings mounted on the trigger plate of a self locking three-barrel gun (Drilling). The central (rifle barrel) lock is automatically put on safe (blocked), when setting on fire sear and trigger are connected.
Marble, I've seen them also but never with back action side locks or with the lever hinged and operating the bites in front of the trigger guard. The one you linked to is a hammerless, trigger plate action with the side lever entering the action body. Is it Sauer, Krieghoff or Merkel who sold a drilling with the rifle barrel cocking on the top tang? Maybe it wasn't any of them, I don't remember who but I have seen it.
On that drilling when the top lever is moved to either the right or left, left I believe, there is a block that is moved out of the receiver to a position beneath the right hammer and over the rifle barrel firing pin. On the inside of the right hammer there is a shoulder that contacts the block driving it into the rifle barrel firing pin and on to the primer. The block which transfers hammer motion to the firing pin also serves as a block preventing the hammer nose from reaching the right shotgun barrel firing pin. If you cock the right hammer and look beneath where it rests when down you can see the block working if you move the top lever back and forth. You should also be able to see the shoulder on the right hammer. A method simple, safe and effective. Three of my hammer drillings are so made.
I cannot see a crown over N which means it was not Nitro proofed. That still makes it a black powder cartridge drilling. Marble, I can't find the crown over E either so I don't see how it can be a 9.3 X 72R Express unless I'm mistaken in that the Express cartridges were all smokeless.
Marble is exactly correct, don't clean it much, just knock off the crud, which appears to be very little, thankfully. If you want to put it back to use RST has 2 1/2 in. shot shells loaded light for our old pieces like this. Sellior & Belloit still offer 9.3 X 72R ammo of suitable pressures however, be advised they may or may not fit your chamber. It seems to be a 50/50 crap shoot if they will. That situation can be remedied fairly easily if you're a bit of an advanced hand loader or have a friend who is. If someone advises you to re-chamber the rifle barrel and open up the shotgun chambers I would beg you to ignore them. They're only original once and there is no difficulty that cannot be overcome to make ammo fit.
All in all it appears to be a fine old drilling by a highly respected maker. Given the bores are in good condition and I see you have the fore arm I would revise my opinion up to maybe $2,250.00 It's pretty much a niche market for the old hammer drillings. Many who want a drilling also want a scope and those willing to work with the old piece in its original guise, like me..., are few. There is also a few around who would Bubba and hack it up in an attempt to make it something it isn't. Fortunately those kind usually want something newer and usually hammerless.
I cannot see a crown over N which means it was not Nitro proofed. That still makes it a black powder cartridge drilling. Marble, I can't find the crown over E either so I don't see how it can be a 9.3 X 72R Express unless I'm mistaken in that the Express cartridges were all smokeless.
Crown over N is missing, not usual before 1912, no nitro proof. Crown over E is on the right side of 118/35. With Schultze powder it was possible to make an express load.
Marble, I still can't find it, the crown over E. Did you blow up the picture and see it? I don't know how to do that. I see what I believe is the Schilling Forge stamp to the immediate right of 118/35 but the others to the right of that I cannot make out. Oh well....turning 64 today I suppose I'm allowed some demise in vision....
I don't know one mark from another. When I "click" right on the picture it triples in size but the marking to the right of that 118/35 is almost impossible to see as it is terrible blurry.
Now that I know it is your birthday (not in your profile, BTW) I will start the HB thread for you!!
Yes, you must blow up the picture. Make a download than you can blow up the picture with Windows photo.
The Schilling forge is over 118/35, crown over E is on the right side of 118/35 (on the last picture in this thread under 118/35 in direktion to the left barrel.)
Ok...got it to blow up as George described. I could make out the crown but not what was beneath it. It was as George described, pretty blurry. I defer to your superior computer skills........and your better informed knowledge of these fine old guns.
For me it's pretty tough to learn then remember all the little things about proof marks that happened over 100 years ago. What I have learned is that proof marks back then, and not just in Germany, seem to follow the same rules as loading for rifles, ain't nothin' always so.
George, I suppose a thank you is in order.....for pointing out my birthday.... At least I'm still here and still learning!!!
Man, that IS a lot better picture!!! I can see clearly now, thanks Jk!
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