Originally Posted by Alpo
So you set up a trust, and the Trust owns the machinegun. With a Trust there is no CLEO signature, there are no pictures or fingerprints.
If you own a machinegun, and want to let your buddy Frank go shoot it, you gotta go with him. If you just hand it to him, saying, "Here. Go play. Bring it back when you're done", you've made an illegal transfer of an NFA item. But if Frank is listed on the Trust documents, it's just as much his as it is yours, and he can go play with it whether you are there are not.
When you croak, the guns get held up while the court plays with your will, before it/they can be transferred to your beneficiary. If your kid is part of the trust, the gun(s) can go straight to him. I'm not sure if new paperwork has to be made, taking your name off the Trust, since you are now dead, but the kid has the gun(s) without going through probate. And since it did not go through probate, there is no official court record, somewhere, saying that young Tommy Jones now owns three machineguns. Yes, they know that at the ATF, but they don't know it at the local courthouse, where any bored clerk thumbing through the files could find it.
As I say, that's the way I UNDERSTAND it to work (I could be completely wrong). None of my stuff was done with a Trust. Both sheriffs I've had dealings with have not had any problems with signing off.
Not quite right.
The trust does own the items ( if bought under the trusts name ) and it does negate the Cleo sign off the fingerprint cards and photo. This is ONE reason for a trust. NFA items can be passed to IMMEDIATE family ONLY without re-stamping so if you have step children grandchildren and such the trust makes it easy to leave it tot them.
Only the CO-TRUSTEES can have the items and it is nto just machine guns but any NFA item in the trust SBS SBR AOW suppressor or MG. The beneficiaries listed ARE NOT owners and can not have the items with one of the trustees being there.
If the children or whoever the beneficiary is as long as there are no more trustees left has to file form 4's for ALL the items they are keeping from the trust but does NOT have to buy a new stamp.
The local court has no standing when it comes to a NFA or other trust unless it is contested but as most truest are done long before death the chance of contesting one are nill. There is NO legal requirement to tell ANY local LE or court that a person has NFA items in a trust UNLESS it is a local law and there are only a few states that require registering NFA.
My grandson is 4 and he is a CO-trustee on my/ our trust as well as many other family members.
If you want or think you need a trust then any good SOT will be able to help you. You can do a Quicken trust for under 100 bucks or go all out for a lawyer to draw one up for 500 to well over a grand. Make sure the lawyer knows what NFA is and make sure he has done them before. Most all big lawyers will say you should do a trust with them and not a Quicken one or other low budget ones because theirs are able to stand up. If the trust is no
then the ATF will DENY it! If they accept it then it is FINE...