Why won't we buy American?

[Bobitis]

My point was, you should get paid for what you contribute.

No contribution? No reward.
Work to protect and save lives? Better pay.

Put a part in a machine, and read a book for an hour? Priceless???
No. That's a 10 dollar an hour job at best. Yet they get $35 plus benefits.

My last Kia had a problem of dieing at intersections. I took it to the dealer, it got 'plugged in', and they couldn't find anything wrong. The 'technician' scolded me for not haveing the oil changed often enough.

I picked up the car, and on the way home stopped at a light. The car died. It was gloomy and raining. I turned off the headlights and it started right up. I turned on the headlights and it died. Hmmm... Electrical? Ya think?

A new battery solved the problem.

So... I gave up my car for a day, and paid some 'certified technician' 60 bucks an hour to hook it up to a machine, and sit back until the tool couldn't diagnose the problem.

Sorry, but I'll no longer pay for hacks that make 3 times my pay in order to get nothing in return.

I learned my lesson. Capitalism and 'sucker' go hand in hand.

Caviat emptor.

[CampingJosh]

Originally Posted by Bobitis

Caviat emptor.

Agreed.

That an American is serving my needs does not mean that I owe him more for his services.

I know I'm in the minority on this, but it's what I believe, so I don't have a problem saying it. American workers are complaining about $35/hour not being enough. Workers overseas are excited to be making $2/hour.

Without those factory jobs, the people in China/Honduras/India/wherever starve. They're happy to be working at all.
Without the factory jobs here, Americans can't afford that bass boat that they use 6 weekends per year.

I personally would rather reward the man who wants to work, no matter his nationality, than the man who chooses not to. "Content of character," you know?

Wanting to reward Americans simply for being Americans seems a bit like a new type of racism to me. You can call it patriotism if you want, but I have my doubts.

ETA: I'm not certain on this opinion. It's just thoughts in my head. Please disagree if you need, but bring a strong argument. I would love to be convinced that I'm wrong. Seriously.

[Bobitis]

I'd just like to add...

In our country today, the people will shell out the bucks for a quality product.
It no longer matters where it was made. It's all about the best return on my investment.

After having been ripped by Chevy (on more than one occasion), I turned my sights on KIA. It was the 1st year in the US, and I picked the bottom of the line car. Why? 5 year 100,000 mile warranty. Double that of any other auto manufacturer out there. All of them. I figured if they were willing to do that, I'd give it a shot.I drove that car mercilessly into the ground. I abused it far beyond its abilities. And I drove it in for a trade on a new KIA. I didn't get anything for it, but it ran very well that day.

5 year warrantys are now the norm. Why? Because the rest of them realized they had to compete.

Competition is a wonderfull thing. Build a better widget, make it less expensive, and the people will come.

So shame on us for our greed. We made this mess. Why should I support its continuance?

[Willie]

Originally Posted by Bobitis

I'd just like to add...

In our country today, the people will shell out the bucks for a quality product.
It no longer matters where it was made. It's all about the best return on my investment.

After having been ripped by Chevy (on more than one occasion), I turned my sights on KIA. It was the 1st year in the US, and I picked the bottom of the line car. Why? 5 year 100,000 mile warranty. Double that of any other auto manufacturer out there. All of them. I figured if they were willing to do that, I'd give it a shot.I drove that car mercilessly into the ground. I abused it far beyond its abilities. And I drove it in for a trade on a new KIA. I didn't get anything for it, but it ran very well that day.

5 year warrantys are now the norm. Why? Because the rest of them realized they had to compete.

Competition is a wonderfull thing. Build a better widget, make it less expensive, and the people will come.

So shame on us for our greed. We made this mess. Why should I support its continuance?

That is what I am coming to understand. But we started making this mess a long time ago and the battle to just buy American is undoubtably lost. Americans will never do that for all the reasons this thread has in it. The generation before ours started buying foreign and never stopped. But......we are seeing a time of huge unthinkable debt for our country,billions more leaving every day, and we still have no answer. I wonder if we will become like England some day? Broke and just a shell of the country we were. I know the battle is lost I just wanted to rage against the dying of the light one more time. I feel pity for our childrens children. They will never know the greatness that was.

[CampingJosh]

Originally Posted by Willie

But......we are seeing a time of huge unthinkable debt for our country,billions more leaving every day, and we still have no answer. I wonder if we will become like England some day? Broke and just a shell of the country we were.

The trade deficit doesn't bother me too much. We're still creating wealth faster than we're shipping it overseas. That is why we are able to have hundreds of billions in trade deficits each year; we still produce more than any other country by a factor of three.
Do we have issues? Yep. But I really don't think we're dire yet.

[Willie]

I hope you are right. I didn't know that we produce more wealth than we spend. Still, it would seem that our country's balance sheet should be more balanced if this is true. I always thought we were spending wealth that was created years ago and now borrow to finance our lives here.

[CampingJosh]

Originally Posted by Willie

I hope you are right. I didn't know that we produce more wealth than we spend. Still, it would seem that our country's balance sheet should be more balanced if this is true. I always thought we were spending wealth that was created years ago and now borrow to finance our lives here.

Government is borrowing, no doubt. The general public, though? Not nearly as much.
Sure, tons of people are still living on credit cards. But just look at our GDP (all wealth generated within the borders of a nation). It's really close to that of all of Europe put together. It's about 3 times that of China (2010 statistics, a down year for us and an up year for them).

China isn't outproducing the world. They're catching up. Remember, they have almost 4 times as many people producing only about 35% or so of what we do.

[Buckshot]

I have a '99 Suburban, made in Mexico with parts from all over the world. Biggest piece of junk ever built. I also have a '98 Explorer, built in the U.S. with parts from all over the world. 246,000 trouble-free miles and one of the best vehicles I've ever owned in terms of reliability. I think picking "American" vehicles is like picking a watermelon. You can look and smell and thump all you like. Some are great, some are rotten inside, and you're not gonna know which you got until it's too late. So most people tilt the odds. And for a long time that has meant Toyota and Honda instead of Dodge and Chevy. In recent years the foreign stalwarts have had some issues and lost a lot of ground. (The Honda Accord, a first place winner for YEARS, was recently ranked SEVENTH in mid-sized sedans by Consumer Reports. Wow.) And many domestic models have greatly improved. Unfortunately, they're ALL unbelievably freaking expensive. I WANT an "American" car, but I want one that's going to be in my driveway, not in the shop.

[jbmid1]

This is why we need to buy lots of American made guns and ammo. To help balance out the import/export imbalance.

[Gun Geezer]

My father bought his first Buick in the 20's and drove them most of his life. My first Buick was a '54 Super. I bought my last Buick in 1970 partly because I discovered that they shared most of their major parts with Chev. but at a much higher price and partly because I got tired of getting to know the service manager's by their first names. To date, I have owned 5 Honda's, none of which have ever had to go back to the dealer for anything except factory recall's. When anyone owning 5 so-called American car's can say that, I will by another. I want to purchase new cars because my driving habits or situations change, not because my present one spends more time at the dealer's than in my garage!

[jbmid1]

I guess I'm one of the exceptions here. I've been driving a 2001 Ford F-150 for over 7 yrs now. Over 130k on the clock. I've done nothing but routine maintenance. Most reliable vehicle I've ever owned and with millions on the road, parts are readily available and relatively inexpensive.

[graehaven]

Originally Posted by jbmid1

I guess I'm one of the exceptions here. I've been driving a 2001 Ford F-150 for over 7 yrs now. Over 130k on the clock. I've done nothing but routine maintenance. Most reliable vehicle I've ever owned and with millions on the road, parts are readily available and relatively inexpensive.

Yes the f-150 is a great vehicle, except, it's made in Mexico.

[Willie]

I've got a 10 year old Harley,Made in Milwaukee that has been just perfect. Needed one battery in all that time,nothing else.

[graehaven]

Originally Posted by Willie

I've got a 10 year old Harley,Made in Milwaukee that has been just perfect. Needed one battery in all that time,nothing else.

Mmmmm, yeah. Someday, I want a Harley.

[Willie]

Originally Posted by graehaven

Mmmmm, yeah. Someday, I want a Harley.

Today's Harleys are really well built and last a long time. But.....Harley is busy closing factorys and laying off people because sales are so bad in this economy. Figures.

[NGIB]

I'll chime in with my philosophy - I buy the products that give me the best value for the money I work for. I'm pretty sure that the catch phrase "Buy American" was probably coined by a union...

[graehaven]

Originally Posted by NGIB

I'll chime in with my philosophy - I buy the products that give me the best value for the money I work for. I'm pretty sure that the catch phrase "Buy American" was probably coined by a union...

Agreed. Same philosophy/approach here. And you're probably right on the origination of the "buy American."

[lawdawg]

Originally Posted by jbmid1

This is why we need to buy lots of American made guns and ammo. To help balance out the import/export imbalance.

How sad is it that the vast majority of sidearms issued by our military and police forces are foreign made? Namely Beretta, Glock, and Sig. Even a lot of "American" guns with names like Springfield and Smith & Wesson are actually foreign made. This was once an industry that we owned, but we have sit on our behinds and let foreign companies out innovate, out produce, and out price us to the point that our own military and police are buying foreign made products to protect their lives. American ammo is still of the highest quality, at least for now. Much like the fabled tortoise and hare, I think we jumped so far ahead in the industrial race that we decided to take a nap while the rest of the world caught up, and then they passed us.

[cutter]

It was coined from the 70's "buy the union label" I remenber those adds very well..

[ckill1]

The f-150 does rock. Just bought a 90 f-150 with a flatbed, 4wd, & 237k on the clock for 900.00. Runs like a top, a/c & heat both still work. ANY 4wd vehicle that runs is worth a grand around here, so I didnt feel like I could lose. Put a new midmount gas tank in it & drive it all over. Its ugly as sin & gets poor mileage, but it had 4 new tires on it & my girls immediately christened it the "big brown turd"! How could I not buy it?

[jim brady]

Kind of funny - I am old enough to remember when all those little foriegn made cars were called 'Death Traps' by EVERYONE. There was an accident with a 1959 Pontiac and a 1965 Renault, guess who walked away and who was covered up and carried away? Then the 1970s 'Gasoline Crisis' hit and everyone dumped their American made cars and started buying those little death traps.

Same thing with American factories and steel mills. Most of us were 'Middle Class', then the envioromentalists demanded that we stop polluting, so our aluminum, copper and steel mills closed down here, and re-opened up in Germany and Japan. The crap was still pumped into the air - just not HERE - and the foriegn companies and governments scooped up the cash that we used to earn here.

Factories could close down Unionized shops here and have wash machines, refrigerators and cook stoves produced more cheaply in Tiawan and Japan. Same thing with our TVs and stereos. Most Unions went belly-up. A lot of 'middle class' neighborhoods just boarded up, or became 'Hoods'. (East LA and even Compton, California were pretty decent places to live at one time....)

My step-father worked in construction back in the 1950s and 1960s. Him and our neighbors were all 'middle class', even though Mom also worked. They made good wages during the summer, but when the bad weather hit there was little work in construction, so the 'good wages' carried us through the lean-times. In the mid 1960s, most construction companies 'busted' the Unions and began hireing illeagal alliens. Their labor costs went down, but the costs they charged for building houses sure didn't drop at all......

What is it now? Something like 7% of workers today are unionized. Kind of hard to blame them for our current economic mess. How about all the jobs shipped off-shore to foriegn factories? Our middle class today is just about non-existant. Big money still flows to folks running for political offices. Kind of like pigs slopping at the trough.

[jbmid1]

Well, wish us luck here. One of the main purposes of us advisors being here in Iraq is to try to convince the Iraqi govt. to go through with their plan to purchase a number of F-16 aircraft.

[jbmid1]

Originally Posted by graehaven

Yes the f-150 is a great vehicle, except, it's made in Mexico.

https://www.fleet.ford.com/maintenan...fs/VIN2001.pdf

Not so fast, Grae, the VIN code( FTR) indicates a factory in the good ol' USA. So, mostly American made. 75-80% if I remember right from googling
"most American parts content".

[graehaven]

Originally Posted by jbmid1

https://www.fleet.ford.com/maintenan...fs/VIN2001.pdf

Not so fast, Grae, the VIN code( FTR) indicates a factory in the good ol' USA. So, mostly American made. 75-80% if I remember right from googling
"most American parts content".

Well, that's still hopeful then.

I'd consider a Ford, now, for my next car. There was a time when I wouldn't. As for Chevy and Chrysler, they can go pound sand.

[Willie]

Originally Posted by graehaven

Well, that's still hopeful then.

I'd consider a Ford, now, for my next car. There was a time when I wouldn't. As for Chevy and Chrysler, they can go pound sand.

I agree here. GM and Chrysler filed bankruptcy to rid themselves of legacy costs such as promises made to workers,pensions and med help etc. Ford did not and still has to pay much more than either on of the others. Still they survive maybe because they care about people. And they make a good car or truck.