300 wsm on AR Platform

Zhurh · 01-06-2012, 03:58 PM

Got the wife to agree I need another AR with the income tax refund; say it ain't so. Been looking at P-308 made by Patriot Ordnance Factory in Arizona. Several friends have purchased them and rave about being sub moa out of the box. 308 win gives me a little more distance over my AR-10 in 338 fed, but only a couple hundred yards actually.

So I called the POF to find out their dealers and ask some questions and it turns out they are developing a 300 wsm on a AR platform and should be available come Spring. I think it might be one heck of an AR for hunting. They said it would have a 20-22 inch barrel, but similar to their 308 version.

Just food for thought. What do you all think?

http://www.pof-usa.com/p308/P308-20-MRR-H.htm

woolleyworm · 01-06-2012, 04:28 PM

I think I'd wait to see what the 300WSM version looks like. I think that would be a wicked hunting rifle for the Yukon.

StoneChimney · 01-06-2012, 08:47 PM

We can do it in .300 Short Action Ultra Mag right now.

reynolds357 · 01-06-2012, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zhurh

Got the wife to agree I need another AR with the income tax refund; say it ain't so. Been looking at P-308 made by Patriot Ordnance Factory in Arizona. Several friends have purchased them and rave about being sub moa out of the box. 308 win gives me a little more distance over my AR-10 in 338 fed, but only a couple hundred yards actually.

So I called the POF to find out their dealers and ask some questions and it turns out they are developing a 300 wsm on a AR platform and should be available come Spring. I think it might be one heck of an AR for hunting. They said it would have a 20-22 inch barrel, but similar to their 308 version.

Just food for thought. What do you all think?

http://www.pof-usa.com/p308/P308-20-MRR-H.htm

22 inch barrel kind of puts the brakes on the .300 WSM. Makes it perform way under its potential.

Zhurh · 01-06-2012, 10:19 PM

Woolleyworm, You can't imagine how much I like hunting with ARs. We do most of our hunting off 4 wheelers & snowmachines; riding way back in on trails up on our summit. These trails go back in 25 miles, narrow, and snake above & below tree line; and have small lakes that are right off the trail. It's often dry up on the summits so water holes & licks are hot spots and the better lakes have overlooks from the trails; excellent places to kill moose, caribou, and bear following them around. An AR across my chest with 2 point sling is the ticket and we get quick shots quite often; no time to stop atv and pull rifle outta gun boot on 4 wheeler. Anyway, why I want something that has more range and yet up around 3000 outta the barrel. I think most 308s top out around 2500.

My concern is from what I have heard from old friends that are gun smiths. They seem to think the AR is undersized for any short mags. One buddy has 15-16 ARs, all 556's. He won't even consider a 6.8, 6.5, 308, anything other than a 556 for an AR; real purist. MY Armalite AR-10 feels about like a M-14 but not much of a kick in 338 fed due to it's weight I believe. The guy I talked to at POF said they are near the end of design process for this 300 wsm and will be soon taking orders & have some by Spring. I'm just wondering about what problems I might experience with a new gun from POF. Thanks.

Zhurh · 01-06-2012, 10:30 PM

StoneChimney, Will look at your site tonight, thanks. From what my Barnes book claims, the RSAUM & WSM with 165 X bullets in 300, the difference is a little over 100 fps. I wonder why you don't hear more about the RSAUM or at least I don't?

reynolds, ya I know but AR-10 is 22 inches and about the limit without getting myself knocked off the 4 wheeler so I'm resigned to losing some fps. I've even thought about getting a custom stock for my 30-378, like a youth size and then mounting 2 point sling, but still that 26 inch mark V barrel is too long for riding.

reynolds357 · 01-06-2012, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zhurh

StoneChimney, Will look at your site tonight, thanks. From what my Barnes book claims, the RSAUM & WSM with 165 X bullets in 300, the difference is a little over 100 fps. I wonder why you don't hear more about the RSAUM or at least I don't?

reynolds, ya I know but AR-10 is 22 inches and about the limit without getting myself knocked off the 4 wheeler so I'm resigned to losing some fps. I've even thought about getting a custom stock for my 30-378, like a youth size and then mounting 2 point sling, but still that 26 inch mark V barrel is too long for riding.

You dont hear about the SAUM's because Remington and Winchester brought out competing rounds at almost the same time and Winchester won the marketing war.

Zhurh · 01-07-2012, 12:37 PM

StoneChimney, Tried opening your site last night. I'm still on slow dial up out here in the sticks and I've noticed of late some sites don't work as well on dial up. So maybe I didn't see everything that's on your site.

Something that's been on my mind of late concerning ARs and all the new calibers. All that alum, how does it take the increased beating from more powerful loads? One of my old back east friends claims if you don't have custom stainless which ain't cheap & adds weight; you'll hammer the AR to heck & back in 1500 rounds and begin having problems. Do people use custom stainless actions on ARs or is that just more dreamin?

StoneChimney · 01-07-2012, 09:19 PM

The upper receiver is just a shell. It's all about the balance of gas port, buffer and spring.

436 · 01-08-2012, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StoneChimney

We can do it in .300 Short Action Ultra Mag right now.

Agree, I think {as an LR 1k user of the .300 RSAUM} it would a far better pick for the M110 SASS type rifles.
436

Zhurh · 01-09-2012, 01:19 PM

I've never owned a 300 RSAUM or WSM; have used a couple 270s, 7 mags, 338 mag, and four years back got a 30-378 Weatherby. When we moved out in the sticks along the Yukon, my style of hunting all changed. We hunt mostly off 4 wheelers & snowmachines; always get quick shots at game 100-200 yards off trails mostly right at tree line; so it's semi open. Ya get quick, a few second shots; if you have an AR & 10 round clip across your chest with a 2 point sling your success rate goes way up. Why I just luv ARs with acogs.

Bought a 6.8 and 338 fed last couple years and have killed bunch of caribou and last fall we got 3 moose with that AR-10 338 fed with 210 noslers; they all went right down. The 338 Fed is a 400 yard gun by my way of thinking just the same. So now I want to get an AR that will reach out to 800-900 yards, even if it has a 24 inch barrel so I don't even think about banging the 30-378 around on the 4 wheeler. Often I'll get back trails miles and end up above tree line glassing down canyons of willows for moose; and no joke long shots like you can't even imagine. I often see grizz feeding in blueberries that I can't get close as I'd like to, would like to have some type of 300 mag for them too. I wouldn't be putting an acog on this AR though, more traditional scope on my mind.

So don't mean to go on or get off track, but what are the pros & cons between a 300 RSAUM & 300 WSM shooting 168-180 grain bullets? I looked in a couple of my load books and they were talking 2900-3000 outta the barrel for both calibers. Why is the RSAUM is a far better pick? I got into reloading a couple years back, so I'll be loading everything myself.

I'm going to get one or the other with the income tax; I still can't believe the wifey ain't yacking about it either. She must have just given up after 26 years of marriage, ha.

Thanks again for the input and advice; greatly appreciated.

StoneChimney · 01-09-2012, 03:28 PM

The issue is not the AR10 platform as much as the cartridge case. The SAUM was picked over the WSM because it has a slightly thicker web at the case head. The WSM cartridge is more likely to have the case head pulled off during firing.

436 · 01-09-2012, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zhurh

So don't mean to go on or get off track, but what are the pros & cons between a 300 RSAUM & 300 WSM shooting 168-180 grain bullets? I looked in a couple of my load books and they were talking 2900-3000 outta the barrel for both calibers. Why is the RSAUM is a far better pick? I got into reloading a couple years back, so I'll be loading everything myself.

I'm going to get one or the other with the income tax; I still can't believe the wifey ain't yacking about it either. She must have just given up after 26 years of marriage, ha.

Thanks again for the input and advice; greatly appreciated.

Just think of it as a “fat" .308 Win'..., the cartridges neck, shoulder and length. It'll just push something like 190gr plus bullet faster & harder in an action that was build on a .308 Win scale.
The .300 WSM cartridges has “about” the same length of the .308 Win with a longer body but short neck.

.308 WIN
diameter 0.308 in (7.8 mm) Neck diameter 0.3433 in (8.72 mm) Shoulder diameter 0.4539 in (11.53 mm) Base diameter 0.4709 in (11.96 mm) Rim diameter 0.4728 in (12.01 mm) Rim thickness 0.0539 in (1.37 mm) Case length 2.015 (51.18 mm) Overall length 2.800 (71.12 mm) Case capacity 56 gr H2O (3.64 cm³)

.300 RSAUM
diameter .308 in (7.8 mm) Neck diameter .344 in (8.7 mm) Shoulder diameter .534 in (13.6 mm) Base diameter .550 in (14.0 mm) Rim diameter .534 in (13.6 mm) Case length 2.015 in (51.2 mm) Overall length 2.825 in (71.8 mm)

.300 WSM
diameter .308 in (7.8 mm) Neck diameter .344 in (8.7 mm) Shoulder diameter .538 in (13.7 mm) Base diameter .555 in (14.1 mm) Rim diameter .535 in (13.6 mm) Case length 2.100 in (53.3 mm) Overall length 2.860 in (72.6 mm)

436

01-06-2012, 03:58 PM	#1
Zhurh Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Upper Yukon, Alaska Posts: 1,807	300 wsm on AR Platform Got the wife to agree I need another AR with the income tax refund; say it ain't so. Been looking at P-308 made by Patriot Ordnance Factory in Arizona. Several friends have purchased them and rave about being sub moa out of the box. 308 win gives me a little more distance over my AR-10 in 338 fed, but only a couple hundred yards actually. So I called the POF to find out their dealers and ask some questions and it turns out they are developing a 300 wsm on a AR platform and should be available come Spring. I think it might be one heck of an AR for hunting. They said it would have a 20-22 inch barrel, but similar to their 308 version. Just food for thought. What do you all think? http://www.pof-usa.com/p308/P308-20-MRR-H.htm -->

01-06-2012, 04:28 PM	#2
woolleyworm TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: SW Fort Worth Contributor Posts: 4,882	Re: 300 wsm on AR Platform I think I'd wait to see what the 300WSM version looks like. I think that would be a wicked hunting rifle for the Yukon. __________________ . What are you gonna do, talk the alien to death? -- (on Sigourney Weaver's worry about Guns in Aliens) "Safety is something that happens between your ears, not something you hold in your hands." "I carry a small gun to compensate for my huge Blue press." .

01-06-2012, 08:47 PM	#3
StoneChimney Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 1,087	Re: 300 wsm on AR Platform We can do it in .300 Short Action Ultra Mag right now. __________________ Full service gunsmithing and firearm manufacturing shop. Licensed FFL 07/02 Manufacturer. Visit our website!

01-06-2012, 10:19 PM	#5
Zhurh Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Upper Yukon, Alaska Posts: 1,807	Re: 300 wsm on AR Platform Woolleyworm, You can't imagine how much I like hunting with ARs. We do most of our hunting off 4 wheelers & snowmachines; riding way back in on trails up on our summit. These trails go back in 25 miles, narrow, and snake above & below tree line; and have small lakes that are right off the trail. It's often dry up on the summits so water holes & licks are hot spots and the better lakes have overlooks from the trails; excellent places to kill moose, caribou, and bear following them around. An AR across my chest with 2 point sling is the ticket and we get quick shots quite often; no time to stop atv and pull rifle outta gun boot on 4 wheeler. Anyway, why I want something that has more range and yet up around 3000 outta the barrel. I think most 308s top out around 2500. My concern is from what I have heard from old friends that are gun smiths. They seem to think the AR is undersized for any short mags. One buddy has 15-16 ARs, all 556's. He won't even consider a 6.8, 6.5, 308, anything other than a 556 for an AR; real purist. MY Armalite AR-10 feels about like a M-14 but not much of a kick in 338 fed due to it's weight I believe. The guy I talked to at POF said they are near the end of design process for this 300 wsm and will be soon taking orders & have some by Spring. I'm just wondering about what problems I might experience with a new gun from POF. Thanks.

01-06-2012, 10:30 PM	#6
Zhurh Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Upper Yukon, Alaska Posts: 1,807	Re: 300 wsm on AR Platform StoneChimney, Will look at your site tonight, thanks. From what my Barnes book claims, the RSAUM & WSM with 165 X bullets in 300, the difference is a little over 100 fps. I wonder why you don't hear more about the RSAUM or at least I don't? reynolds, ya I know but AR-10 is 22 inches and about the limit without getting myself knocked off the 4 wheeler so I'm resigned to losing some fps. I've even thought about getting a custom stock for my 30-378, like a youth size and then mounting 2 point sling, but still that 26 inch mark V barrel is too long for riding.

01-07-2012, 12:37 PM	#8
Zhurh Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Upper Yukon, Alaska Posts: 1,807	Re: 300 wsm on AR Platform StoneChimney, Tried opening your site last night. I'm still on slow dial up out here in the sticks and I've noticed of late some sites don't work as well on dial up. So maybe I didn't see everything that's on your site. Something that's been on my mind of late concerning ARs and all the new calibers. All that alum, how does it take the increased beating from more powerful loads? One of my old back east friends claims if you don't have custom stainless which ain't cheap & adds weight; you'll hammer the AR to heck & back in 1500 rounds and begin having problems. Do people use custom stainless actions on ARs or is that just more dreamin?

01-07-2012, 09:19 PM	#9
StoneChimney Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 1,087	Re: 300 wsm on AR Platform The upper receiver is just a shell. It's all about the balance of gas port, buffer and spring. __________________ Full service gunsmithing and firearm manufacturing shop. Licensed FFL 07/02 Manufacturer. Visit our website!

01-09-2012, 01:19 PM	#11
Zhurh Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Upper Yukon, Alaska Posts: 1,807	Re: 300 wsm on AR Platform I've never owned a 300 RSAUM or WSM; have used a couple 270s, 7 mags, 338 mag, and four years back got a 30-378 Weatherby. When we moved out in the sticks along the Yukon, my style of hunting all changed. We hunt mostly off 4 wheelers & snowmachines; always get quick shots at game 100-200 yards off trails mostly right at tree line; so it's semi open. Ya get quick, a few second shots; if you have an AR & 10 round clip across your chest with a 2 point sling your success rate goes way up. Why I just luv ARs with acogs. Bought a 6.8 and 338 fed last couple years and have killed bunch of caribou and last fall we got 3 moose with that AR-10 338 fed with 210 noslers; they all went right down. The 338 Fed is a 400 yard gun by my way of thinking just the same. So now I want to get an AR that will reach out to 800-900 yards, even if it has a 24 inch barrel so I don't even think about banging the 30-378 around on the 4 wheeler. Often I'll get back trails miles and end up above tree line glassing down canyons of willows for moose; and no joke long shots like you can't even imagine. I often see grizz feeding in blueberries that I can't get close as I'd like to, would like to have some type of 300 mag for them too. I wouldn't be putting an acog on this AR though, more traditional scope on my mind. So don't mean to go on or get off track, but what are the pros & cons between a 300 RSAUM & 300 WSM shooting 168-180 grain bullets? I looked in a couple of my load books and they were talking 2900-3000 outta the barrel for both calibers. Why is the RSAUM is a far better pick? I got into reloading a couple years back, so I'll be loading everything myself. I'm going to get one or the other with the income tax; I still can't believe the wifey ain't yacking about it either. She must have just given up after 26 years of marriage, ha. Thanks again for the input and advice; greatly appreciated.

01-09-2012, 03:28 PM	#12
StoneChimney Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 1,087	Re: 300 wsm on AR Platform The issue is not the AR10 platform as much as the cartridge case. The SAUM was picked over the WSM because it has a slightly thicker web at the case head. The WSM cartridge is more likely to have the case head pulled off during firing. __________________ Full service gunsmithing and firearm manufacturing shop. Licensed FFL 07/02 Manufacturer. Visit our website!