Hello Forum, Iver Johnson question - The Firearms Forum

BlackFlag · 05-04-2012, 07:53 PM

Hello to all on this forum. This is my first post after I have been trying to find out information on a Iver Johnson 38 Caliber pistol I have. This was passed down to me from my father. I have never shot this specific pistol before, and have been trying to find information on it. So far the best I can find is that is was built between 1915 and 1941 due to the 'H' on the serial, and I believe it is a 3rd generation pistol. I measured the Chamber, and it is 0.388 inches, so I know this is a 0.38. If there is anyone who knows more about this pistol, any help is greatly appreciated.

on top of the barrel it reads "Iver Johnson's Arms & Cycle works" the second line on the barrel reads "Fitchburg. Mass. U.S.A"

a serial number on the trigger guard reads "20410"

On the left side of the frame of the handle, underneath the grip there is a double stamp of either "H 20400" or "H 20410"

Since the trigger guard reads 20410, I assume the grip serial number is H20410.

I have attached some pictures of the pistol in question. I have cropped the picture in GIMP (opensource program) to reduce the size of the attachment.

Again, any help will be greatly appreciated in the Identification of this pistol.

Thank you

(Edit 1: for silly typos)
(Edit 2: attached smaller pictures for bandwidth)

BETH · 05-04-2012, 08:05 PM

welcome to the forum someone will be here to help don't worry

gvw3 · 05-04-2012, 11:21 PM

Wow this comes up all the time. If this gun was made after 1908 it will shoot the 38 S&W round. You can still get this ammo but it is very hard to find. A good gun shop can order it for you. There are others on this forum that can tell you the year from the serial number.

This gun is not a very good shooter as the trigger pull is like 10 pounds. You can buy them in good working order for $150 to $200. I know all this as I have this same gun. It was my wife's grandfathers city of Chicago issue weapon in 1922

RJay · 05-05-2012, 01:28 AM

Large frame Safety Automatic ( it ejects the shells automatically when you open it. ) The H prefix was used on the large frame automatic from 1918 unstill 1941, Serial numbers H11401 through H24700 was used in 1919. The serial number is in three places, on the frame ( have to remove cylinder to see ), bottom of the trigger guard and on the grip under the left grip plate. The history of Iver Johnson is long and involved, far longer than I care to type, if you use the search feature and read all the post about the Iver Johnson you will gain a wealth of knowledge on the subject. If the gun is tight and in good condition it would be safe to fire , using the 38 S&W cartridge, NOT the 38 Special, which is much higher pressure. If there are any doubts about the revolvers condition please take it to a gun smith and have it checked out. best I can do, hope that helps, shoot safe.

Lanrezac · 05-05-2012, 12:05 PM

Thanks for putting up such good pictures, BlackFlag. Your Iver Johnson looks like a good example of the type. Those grips are much more practical than the usual small hard rubber grips found on these guns.

Jim K · 05-05-2012, 01:30 PM

That style of grip is usually seen on IJ .22 revolvers, but they appear contemporary with the gun and the fact that the frame had to be drilled and tapped and the locator pin removed to install them makes me thing they are factory, on special order.

Jim

RJay · 05-05-2012, 06:37 PM

The picture was so large ( very clear picture ) that I didn't even slide it over to look at the grips

Yes, those are special order grips.

BlackFlag · 05-08-2012, 04:34 PM

Thank you for the replies folks! After looking at the pictures the second time, I should have made them a bit smaller to conserve bandwidth. I do appreciate the confirmations on this pistol, and I need to look further into the wood grips. I do know that this was not typical of the pictures I have located around the internet, which is why I had doubts from my findings.

Since I have never fired this pistol, and the barrel does feel a little loose, I have decided to locate a gunsmith in my area and at least have it checked out before I load any 0.38 S&W rounds in it. I don not have a time frame on that though. in the mean time I will be using my Rimfire.

Rocketman1 · 05-08-2012, 08:19 PM

BlackFlag,

Welcome to the forum.
I have this same revolver with the same grips. The grips were special order Wester Walnut.

The ammo is hard to find, as someone else mentioned. The round is sometimes refered to as "short" 38 S&W. Cheaper Than Dirt" just got some in and it isn't a bad price either. usually it is $8.00 tp $10.00 bucks more, when yu can find it. I think Remington is the only manufacture that still produces it. Link below:

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/66257-5.html

Lanrezac · 05-09-2012, 05:22 PM

Rocketman1, in another recent thread someone said they had found new 38 S&W ammunition for sale made by PPU, also known as Prvi Partizan, the Yugoslavian/Serbian ammo maker. It cost something like half as much as the Remington ammo.

Their question was if it was any good. I said Prvi Partizan was fine in my experience (mainly with their 32 Auto ammunition), but another poster thought it was mediocre stuff. My Internet connection is bad today, or I would find and link that thread here. I think it was in the Centerfire Pistols subforum.

05-04-2012, 07:53 PM	#1
BlackFlag Member Join Date: May 2012 Location: Eastern PA Posts: 4	Hello Forum, Iver Johnson question Hello to all on this forum. This is my first post after I have been trying to find out information on a Iver Johnson 38 Caliber pistol I have. This was passed down to me from my father. I have never shot this specific pistol before, and have been trying to find information on it. So far the best I can find is that is was built between 1915 and 1941 due to the 'H' on the serial, and I believe it is a 3rd generation pistol. I measured the Chamber, and it is 0.388 inches, so I know this is a 0.38. If there is anyone who knows more about this pistol, any help is greatly appreciated. on top of the barrel it reads "Iver Johnson's Arms & Cycle works" the second line on the barrel reads "Fitchburg. Mass. U.S.A" a serial number on the trigger guard reads "20410" On the left side of the frame of the handle, underneath the grip there is a double stamp of either "H 20400" or "H 20410" Since the trigger guard reads 20410, I assume the grip serial number is H20410. I have attached some pictures of the pistol in question. I have cropped the picture in GIMP (opensource program) to reduce the size of the attachment. Again, any help will be greatly appreciated in the Identification of this pistol. Thank you (Edit 1: for silly typos) (Edit 2: attached smaller pictures for bandwidth) Attached Images --> Last edited by BlackFlag; 05-08-2012 at 04:40 PM.. Reason: Edit 2: attached smaller pictures

05-04-2012, 08:05 PM	#2
BETH Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: naugatuck,Ct. Contributor Posts: 6,676	Re: Hello Forum, Iver Johnson question welcome to the forum someone will be here to help don't worry

05-04-2012, 11:21 PM	#3
gvw3 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Chicago IL Area Contributor Posts: 3,305	Re: Hello Forum, Iver Johnson question Wow this comes up all the time. If this gun was made after 1908 it will shoot the 38 S&W round. You can still get this ammo but it is very hard to find. A good gun shop can order it for you. There are others on this forum that can tell you the year from the serial number. This gun is not a very good shooter as the trigger pull is like 10 pounds. You can buy them in good working order for $150 to $200. I know all this as I have this same gun. It was my wife's grandfathers city of Chicago issue weapon in 1922 __________________ Criminals advocate stronger gun laws to foster a safer work environment. This limits their exposure to risk.

05-05-2012, 01:28 AM	#4
RJay Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Arizona Posts: 3,487	Re: Hello Forum, Iver Johnson question Large frame Safety Automatic ( it ejects the shells automatically when you open it. ) The H prefix was used on the large frame automatic from 1918 unstill 1941, Serial numbers H11401 through H24700 was used in 1919. The serial number is in three places, on the frame ( have to remove cylinder to see ), bottom of the trigger guard and on the grip under the left grip plate. The history of Iver Johnson is long and involved, far longer than I care to type, if you use the search feature and read all the post about the Iver Johnson you will gain a wealth of knowledge on the subject. If the gun is tight and in good condition it would be safe to fire , using the 38 S&W cartridge, NOT the 38 Special, which is much higher pressure. If there are any doubts about the revolvers condition please take it to a gun smith and have it checked out. best I can do, hope that helps, shoot safe. __________________ RonJames Last edited by RJay; 05-05-2012 at 06:39 PM..

05-05-2012, 12:05 PM	#5
Lanrezac Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 687	Re: Hello Forum, Iver Johnson question Thanks for putting up such good pictures, BlackFlag. Your Iver Johnson looks like a good example of the type. Those grips are much more practical than the usual small hard rubber grips found on these guns.

05-05-2012, 01:30 PM	#6
Jim K Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 6,408	Re: Hello Forum, Iver Johnson question That style of grip is usually seen on IJ .22 revolvers, but they appear contemporary with the gun and the fact that the frame had to be drilled and tapped and the locator pin removed to install them makes me thing they are factory, on special order. Jim

05-05-2012, 06:37 PM	#7
RJay Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Arizona Posts: 3,487	Re: Hello Forum, Iver Johnson question The picture was so large ( very clear picture ) that I didn't even slide it over to look at the grips Yes, those are special order grips. __________________ RonJames

05-08-2012, 04:34 PM	#8
BlackFlag Member Join Date: May 2012 Location: Eastern PA Posts: 4	Re: Hello Forum, Iver Johnson question Thank you for the replies folks! After looking at the pictures the second time, I should have made them a bit smaller to conserve bandwidth. I do appreciate the confirmations on this pistol, and I need to look further into the wood grips. I do know that this was not typical of the pictures I have located around the internet, which is why I had doubts from my findings. Since I have never fired this pistol, and the barrel does feel a little loose, I have decided to locate a gunsmith in my area and at least have it checked out before I load any 0.38 S&W rounds in it. I don not have a time frame on that though. in the mean time I will be using my Rimfire.

05-08-2012, 08:19 PM	#9
Rocketman1 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 1,100	Re: Hello Forum, Iver Johnson question BlackFlag, Welcome to the forum. I have this same revolver with the same grips. The grips were special order Wester Walnut. The ammo is hard to find, as someone else mentioned. The round is sometimes refered to as "short" 38 S&W. Cheaper Than Dirt" just got some in and it isn't a bad price either. usually it is $8.00 tp $10.00 bucks more, when yu can find it. I think Remington is the only manufacture that still produces it. Link below: http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/66257-5.html __________________ There is no such thing as a gun accident. Irresponsible gun owners cause so-called gun accidents.

05-09-2012, 05:22 PM	#10
Lanrezac Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 687	Re: Hello Forum, Iver Johnson question Rocketman1, in another recent thread someone said they had found new 38 S&W ammunition for sale made by PPU, also known as Prvi Partizan, the Yugoslavian/Serbian ammo maker. It cost something like half as much as the Remington ammo. Their question was if it was any good. I said Prvi Partizan was fine in my experience (mainly with their 32 Auto ammunition), but another poster thought it was mediocre stuff. My Internet connection is bad today, or I would find and link that thread here. I think it was in the Centerfire Pistols subforum. Last edited by Lanrezac; 05-09-2012 at 05:24 PM..