Anyone shooting the 22-6mm ?

[acelungger]

Howdy All,
Just so everyone knows up front that I am disabled so I can't do Big Game hunting ect. Since I have a lot more time than I have money I search and read and post questions. 99 percent of my shooting is benchrest and by that I mean shootinf off a bench under a shade tree. So most of my stuff is just plinking around. I still love shooting my pistol's but I can't stand up for over 10 seconds, so that takes akk the fun out of it!!

Here we go, Because of my back I can't take much recoil ! I built a AR target rifle in 5.56/223 that is a tack driver, I have also built a 243WSSM
on the AR platform (still tuning it) and a 6.5 Grendel on the AR plat.

I have 3 places that I have keep any of the mauser action and parts for me. A couple month's ago I bought a 95 SR mauser action all most complete for $40.00. My plans was to build a long range low recoil rifle! I have been shooting and reloading since 1972 and I have got into studing P.O. Ackley wildcating, I couldn't believe that there was a new 22-6mm barrel threaded for a SR mauser, I hate auctions! But I watch and couldn't believe I got it bouight!! I sure would like to hear from those that have or shooting the 22-6 at this time?
Thanks
greg

[cpttango30]

You do know that a 22-6mm is going to be buring barrels out at about 1000 rounds MAX. It is way over boar and really you are burrning a ton of powder for nothing more than a big boom.

I think a 6mm PPC or 6mm Dasher or any of the other 6mm wildcats based on the ppc or BR case would do you much better.

[acelungger]

CP,There are 2 sides of this, and I wanted to gather all the info.I can on the 22-6mm, Lonnie Hummel is still shooting 1000yds matches and shooting a rifle that is chamber 22-6mm and it has 3500 rounds down the pipe and he is still wining and he did a bore scope on it and it showed very little at the throat. You are not the only one that has told me they were barrel burners, I think it is all to do with how and what you reload with, seating deth, there are so many varibles that can cause a barrel to burn up! Because I have shot a barrel out!
Thanks
Greg

[Bindernut]

Welcome to TFF!

I had a .22-6mm (30° shoulder, straight-wall...like the Ackley Improved except only 30 on the shoulder) several years back. It was one heckuva long-range prairie dog rifle!
It went down the road a few years back to a friend who rebarreled it to .220Swift.
I put about 1500 rounds through it on prairie dogs and coyotes with loads approximating max Swift loads (55gr pills just under 4000fps). I know I overheated the barrel quite a few times since I only had two dog rifles at the time and the shooting would get hot-n-heavy every now and then.
Not sure how many rounds the previous owner had put through it but I know he loaded it hot because he was one of those "let's try for another 100fps" types of loaders.
I never did have the throat scoped or cast but accuracy with it's pet load dropped off drastically (from sub-MOA to 3" @ 100yds) and it was time for me to build a new toy anyways. My friend was just itching to get his hands on the action & stock for a new build so I let it go. He's still shooting it with that new Swift barrel 12 years later...mild loads.

As tango said, these big overbore cartridges can be very hard on the barrel throat even if you keep the loads mild. As you surmised, I'm pretty sure it has a lot to do with your powder selection, how hard you push it, and oodles of other things.

What twist is your new barrel?
If I remember right, my barrel had 1:12" twist. It would start to "blue-streak" 50gr Hornady or Sierra SP bullets at 3800fps. It was perfectly fine with 55gr Winchester or Hornady SPs at 3900-4000fps though.

And also being you're building around a small-ring I would keep pressures on the mild side as well.

Sounds like a neat build! Be sure to keep up posted with pics and details!

[acelungger]

Thanks Bnut,
The twist is 1-8, going to push the big boys (79gr) Yes and as you stated, there are a lot of different things that can cause a barrel to burn up! I have high hopes for this cartidge I think it is also called The Texas Thunder?? I hope so, I like having all the details I can. If a person allready having data to worth with saves a lot of time and money! I have all the time in the world, but my good time is very limited!! You and Lonnie are the only guys I know that have owned one of the 22-6mm and saying that makes me feel life I bought a 3 legged Goat!!!!! I hope that someday when I get rich and famous I will buy me a copy of Quick Loads ($165.00)so I will have some thing to play with. I have search every place on the net that I might find a used one??There has to be someone that has bought the program and didn't like it????????
I sure home some others will reply.
Later
Greg

[JLA]

Originally Posted by acelungger

CP,There are 2 sides of this, and I wanted to gather all the info.I can on the 22-6mm, Lonnie Hummel is still shooting 1000yds matches and shooting a rifle that is chamber 22-6mm and it has 3500 rounds down the pipe and he is still wining and he did a bore scope on it and it showed very little at the throat. You are not the only one that has told me they were barrel burners, I think it is all to do with how and what you reload with, seating deth, there are so many varibles that can cause a barrel to burn up! Because I have shot a barrel out!
Thanks
Greg

Spot on ace. I have been told a million times that 6.5-284 is a barrel burner. But I am gonna shoot one anyway.

Dont have any experience with the .22-6mm but im sure i will sooner or later.

[Bindernut]

3 legged goat? Might be...but it can still run pretty darn good for only having six hooves on the ground!

For some dumb reason, I got the .22-6mm stuck in my head back when I was in grade school. I read an article in Shooting Times by Rick Jamison on his .22-6mmCJ wildcat.

Found my rifle at a gunshow and bought it complete with dies and about 200rounds of formed brass. When I tore it down to clean it, I found the name of the last owner on a card under the buttplate.
He only lived about 40miles away from me and was a regular in the local coyote hunt contests so I kinda knew him already. I gave him a call & got a bunch of his data so I did have a starting point. Good thing too, since that rifle was my first experience working with a wildcat. I was young n dumb when I bought that thing but I still had fun with it!


I've never messed with the fast-twist heavy bullet .224 bores but I like the high sectional density concept so it oughta work just fine.

[cpttango30]

I personally don't see a reason for it it is way over boar so you are going to waste a lot of powder making smoke and fire out the end of the barrel. Unless you get some crazy 34 to 36" long barrel. You are not getting much more velocity out of this over the swift or 22-250.

243 and many other 6mm (BRX Dasher, BR, PPc) will all work are all low recoil and offer. much over the 22-6mm. That is just me though. It is kind of like buying an 18 wheeler to go to the store and buy enough food to fit in a minivan. Sure you can do it but why?

If you are shooting an 80gr 224 or a 80gr 6mm recoil will be about the same. I would put more time and money into a precisely fitted stock with a recoil reduction system and a top end recoil pad.

[Bindernut]

Originally Posted by cpttango30

If you are shooting an 80gr 224 or a 80gr 6mm recoil will be about the same.

Yup, the felt recoil will be about the same. BUT...retained velocity & energy will be greater with the smaller bore if the projectile weight is the same. High sectional density is your friend when talking long range.

Actually, a 22-6mm Improved case is good for 250fps faster than a Swift with 55gr bullets when pushing the max pressure barrier out of 24" barrels. With it backed off a little bit to Swift velocities, pressures are VERY mild with no measurable case head expansion and no primer flattening. That's how I ran mine.
Not sure of the exact math for heavier pills but I would expect it's worth 150-200fps over the Swift.
Expect about 50-100fps if using a standard, tapered .22-6mm wildcat. That one has already been done with the 5.6x57mm RWS. It runs at Swift velocities with a lower max pressure than the Swift.


Yeah it's overbore, but so are lots of popular calibers including the parent 6mmRem, the .243Win, and both the .22-250 & .220Swift. The .25-06 is even worse but you don't hear too many folks condemning it because it's overbore...and Neider's creation wouldn't have stuck around as many years as it has if it didn't work.
Now, if you were talking a .22-06 then I would definitely say that's too far over the line too.

[JLA]

over the line? What about this fugly little bunny duster???

[acelungger]

I like it!! BD, I wished you still had that rifle and would sell it. Okay guys, I shot a Ruger #1B 243 for over 20 years and it was the last rifle that I sold when I decided that I was done hunting! I would of never bought another H.P. Rifle untill a friend of mine brung me over some shooting magizens when I was lying flat on my back. I had read about 3 of them when I ran acrossed the OLY. Arms ad about a 243WSSM some thing I had never heard of, but it had been 10 years since I sold my 243! So I started looking and I couldn't sell thing's fast enough to get the money to order that upper! I wasn't worried about the lower because if I couldn't find the parts to put a lower togher I could use the one off of my A1 I put toghter in the ealy 80's. Since my back tell me when I can do things and when I can't I have not got the 243WSSM to shot as good as I want.
My life is 80% in bead 10%maybe going to the Doctor ect, and MAYBE 10% playing!!
So you see, No matter what I do , it will not make any differnce to anyone in the world except me! I am very great full to all that have posted and I hope to hear from others that have owned a 22-6mm or the Texas Thunder (I Think)
BD., Do you still have your 22-6?
JLA, if it shoots like I have been told it will, as soon as it proves that, I will have another one waiting!


JAL, That is some awesome photo shop, but if not I got to know what it is and get one!!
Later
Greg

[jack404]

i've a plan to build a 22/06 everyone tells me the similar you have ..

gonna build it anyway , just time to do it as it wont be a paying rifle

but when its done i hope it'll mean some long range crow blasting

[acelungger]

Howdy Jack,
I feel the same as you!! I have a AR 15 that I put together that is a one wholer with a good shooter behind it? Like I said, if the round does as I have been toldit will, I will put together!
Thanks for posting Jack!
Keep them coming!
Greg

[JLA]

Hey ace. I have a small baggie full of 70 gr TSXs that I pulled from my FILs .223 loads. Theres prolly 40 of them in the bag. I told him when he bought em 9 twist wouldnt stabilize that bullet at .223 velocity, but he bought em anyway and I loaded em anyway knowing id be pulling them later. But they oughtta do great in your 8 twist at .22-6 velocities. Yours if you want em. PM me your mailbox.

[BETH]

Josh what is that bullet? Welcome aboard Ace

[JLA]

http://www.barnesbullets.com/products/rifle/tsx-bullet/

The .224 70 grain bullets are intended for fast twist .22 centerfires.

[TRAP55]

Ace, the .22-6mm is something old made new again. The 5.56x57 Mauser round is the old.
That's a lot of chamber pressure for an 1895 small ring Mauser!
I would worry more about locking lug setback, before I'd worry about burning a barrel. Use the 95 action for a .257 Roberts, or 6.5x55 Swede.
A Turk K. Kahles large ring 98 action has a small ring thread that barrel would thread into, and be much safer.

[Bindernut]

Originally Posted by TRAP55

Ace, the .22-6mm is something old made new again. The 5.56x57 Mauser round is the old.
That's a lot of chamber pressure for an 1895 small ring Mauser!
I would worry more about locking lug setback, before I'd worry about burning a barrel. Use the 95 action for a .257 Roberts, or 6.5x55 Swede.
A Turk K. Kahles large ring 98 action has a small ring thread that barrel would thread into, and be much safer.

Actually, the .22-6mm wildcats pre-date the 5.6x57 by a few years. Folks started necking down the .244 pretty much as soon as it was introduced in '55. And there are a couple of .22-7x57 versions (at least one by Charles Newton) from back in the '20/'30s.
The 5.6x57 didn't come about until the early 60s. Some sources say '61, others '63 or '64.


I do agree that a large-ring or a modern action would be a better action to build a "hot-rod" rifle around.
But I wouldn't have a problem with using a small-ring for that particular cartridge either though. Just keep the pressures on the mild side...like .257, 6.5x55, 5.6x57, etc. levels.



In fact the more I think about this project, acelunger's plan to utilize fast-twist and heavy bullets pretty much sums up the 5.6x57mm right out of the box.
It was originally developed as a deer cartridge in Germany (little deer compared to what we've got over here mind you) and like the .22 Savage Hi-Power it was designed with a 1:10" twist for 70gr bullets.
Thanks to all the fast-twist .224"/5.56mm AR15/M16 components from recent years this should make the concept a lot easier to work with these days.



Dangit anyway...this fast-twist stuff has got ideas floating around in my head again.
I've still got my .22-6mm/30°Imp dies. Wonder if I could find a reamer to match anymore?

[JLA]

Originally Posted by acelungger

I like it!! BD, I wished you still had that rifle and would sell it. Okay guys, I shot a Ruger #1B 243 for over 20 years and it was the last rifle that I sold when I decided that I was done hunting! I would of never bought another H.P. Rifle untill a friend of mine brung me over some shooting magizens when I was lying flat on my back. I had read about 3 of them when I ran acrossed the OLY. Arms ad about a 243WSSM some thing I had never heard of, but it had been 10 years since I sold my 243! So I started looking and I couldn't sell thing's fast enough to get the money to order that upper! I wasn't worried about the lower because if I couldn't find the parts to put a lower togher I could use the one off of my A1 I put toghter in the ealy 80's. Since my back tell me when I can do things and when I can't I have not got the 243WSSM to shot as good as I want.
My life is 80% in bead 10%maybe going to the Doctor ect, and MAYBE 10% playing!!
So you see, No matter what I do , it will not make any differnce to anyone in the world except me! I am very great full to all that have posted and I hope to hear from others that have owned a 22-6mm or the Texas Thunder (I Think)
BD., Do you still have your 22-6?
JLA, if it shoots like I have been told it will, as soon as it proves that, I will have another one waiting!


JAL, That is some awesome photo shop, but if not I got to know what it is and get one!!Later
Greg

Originally Posted by BETH

Josh what is that bullet? Welcome aboard Ace

I just realized yall are talking about the 17/50 BMG wildcat. Its not a photo shop. Somebody really has wildcatted the .50 BMG case to .17 cal and made 4 different sizes. The largest one is simply a .17 cal neck on a full length BMG case, then they go incrementally shorter. The one pictured is one of the 2 in the middle. I read an article on them a week or 2 ago. Muzzle velocity isnt what you might think it should be. I think the long case only runs them just over 5K, and barrel life is measure in the hundreds of rounds. Not thousands..

[JLA]

Theres very little info on the subject of the 17/50 BMG magnum concept. I ran across a couple threads on THR forum about reloading for it. It just isnt practical, but cool as hell lookin.

[acelungger]

Hi All,
I apoligies for being late to post on the subject, I got some BAD food Sunday and been sick! JLA I really thought that pic was photo shoped
I look at Wildcatting like those that really did it! P.O. Ackley I think is the most know for his Wild Cats and then his use of the 40 degree shoulders, I am sure that there has been a lot of Wild Cat data thrown away after the passing of several home gunsmiths that spent several years working on some Wild Cat caliber that never were ever brought out to the public. I think there are several reason's for the Wild Cat's cartidge's, I don't have the talent to ever be a devoleper of a Wild Cat cartidge, so I just play around with those cals. that have slipped out of sight!
I hope in some way we can keep this going I thank each one of you guy's for your info.
Greg

[Inthewind1976]

One of the best things about being a gun nut is the fact that you can conjure up all sorts of little custom projects, and over time, without a huge expenditure, you can actually built it. Ace, sounds like youve found one! While I am certainly not a huge wildcat expert by ANY stretch of the imagination, I would offer a few thoughts from "general experience" that might be of consideration. First of all, you are apparently not in a position to be working on developing a "crash bang magnum shoulder buster" and as such, your interest in barrel life seems to be the perfect mind set and reasoning to want to build a 22-6 and develop loads using your plethora of knowledge youve developed from your research of wildcatting if you have accuracy as the primary goal, not FPS. I have tons of experience with the 22/250 and the 25-06 and can tell you that if your not looking to set FPS records, you can certainly develop loads that will please you without making the project into a cause of unreasonably short barrel life. I have always had some (probably deranged, lol) affinity for building rifles on the old/soft "small ring" platform, and as such have always had to consider caliber choices because they are NOT acceptable for high pressure development. The suggestion of using a Turk to build your rifle MIGHT be a good one, but if you keep in mind the pressure considerations you should be in a reasonable position. I wish you luck with your project, and I know I speak for EVERYONE when I say POST LOTS OF PICTURES of the rifle when its together, and even some targets if you will, once youve loaded for it and fired it.

[acelungger]

Inthewind1976,
Right off, thanks for the kind words! At the speed I have been working on it I will be dead and gone and it still won't be finished I have allways been a person that took on about any kind of job as long as it was do able, and that is how I have lived my whole life, and that is why I am in the shape that I am in!! I have allways made my money to play with the guns doing 2 and 3 jobs at a time. If I wasn't so hard headed and tight with the cash, this rifle would be done! I have allways been a lover of the Colt 1911, and started shooting them in 1972, so back in Feb. I made up my mind that I could buy Capains frame and slide and build a 1911 that would shot as good if not better than Wilson's intro model at $1995.00 and have less than $600.00 in it!
The Pistol is shooting better than any 1911 I have ever owned, but I don't have it feeding right, but I will Someone told me how to test my SR Mauser to see how hard it was, but I think I was told to run a file acrossed it and if the file dug in then it was soft?
After all the talk about how soft the SR's are I think I will work up loads that show no sign's of pressure and shoot it that away and then build one up on a better action! If anyone has a 98 action that is a SR thread and they want to sell it, please get a hold of me.
I am allways open to any advice, so please feel free to post!
One other thing, I need some Help, ealier in the week I ran acrossed a guy posting that he was wanting to buy a 1911 slide, I got a hold him and took pic's of it and for the life of me, I can't find the guy If anyone has seen that post, could you please email me or pm me and me know what site it is on?
Thanks for taking the time to read and post the help!
Greg