New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load - The Firearms Forum

FTK87 · 02-27-2010, 10:19 PM

I picked up a new rifle at the gunshow this morning, then got to try it out this afternoon.

Rifle: Howa M1500 .308 22" barrel
Scope:Nikko Sterling 3-10X42mm

3 shot 7/8" group @ 100yds, heres the kicker, with PMC Bronze 147gr FMJ(Cheapest brass cased ammo I could find)

I'll be starting to work out a load next week, to bad my options are so limited, I only have 165gr Hornady SST bullets, and only RL-15 or Varget. Anybody have a clue where to start?

CampingJosh · 02-27-2010, 10:51 PM

That's not a bad problem to have! A gun that is too accurate with cheap ammo?

Sorry, but I'm no help on your question. Congrats on your find, though.

The_Rifleman · 02-27-2010, 11:08 PM

Nice group, beautiful rifle! I own a Howa myself and love it and the Nikko Stirling scope!

My Hornady manual says:

VARGET starts at 32.6 at 2100fps, max load at 44.0 at 2600fps.

RL-15 starts at 35.2 at 2100fps, max load is 44.3 at 2600fps.

Remember to start low checking for pressure signs every shot.

Have you ever tried the Audette Ladder Test?

Make sure you report back to display your hand-loaded groups.

Be safe!

312shooter · 02-27-2010, 11:22 PM

Varget is going to be a great, if not the best powder for your load. I use 44 gr of Varget, 168 BTHP with a CCI standard LR primer and get outstanding results. I think Speer shows a tad more than 44 gr for your max load on the 165's but trust only the data you read with your own eyes. Good luck

FTK87 · 02-28-2010, 12:02 AM

What is the Audette Ladder test?

Yes, I have high hopes for the varget as well, thats why I bought a pound of it over the RL 15, it seems to be a little more finiky about accuracy, I couldn't get it to group in my .223, but it groups great with my '06. I've had great luck with varget in my .223 and '06.

funny thing is, I had a Howa M1500 in .223, traded it for a pistol and some cash, sold the pistol and bought another howa. lol

The_Rifleman · 02-28-2010, 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FTK87

What is the Audette Ladder test?

Audette Ladder Test

I use this method every time I load develop. Only a few times did it take me more than 10 shots to find my load.

Suicide*Ride · 02-28-2010, 02:54 AM

Nice rifle & nice grouping FTK!

It's fun to find a firearm that shoots well right out of the box.

On a side note; I never understood why some folks think PMC isn't worthy just cuz they're less expensive than most....

.... I've burned through several thousands of PMC fodder over the years, (mostly small arms ammo) & even use their brass for heavy reloads & have never had any issues @ all. I haven't bought any lately, so maybe their level of quality has gone down over the years.... who knows.

@ the Rifleman; thanks for the link to the Audette ladder test. Anything that might help to reduce the number of rds. it takes to sight in a firearm is a plus.

SR

JLA · 02-28-2010, 10:34 AM

I second the ladder test. Since finding it out, its the only load development method i use...

oldreliable45120 · 04-14-2010, 07:52 PM

you cant go wrong with Varget.I use 44.5 with a 168 bthp in all of my tactical rifles with good results. If you can get your hands on some IMR-4064 give that a try.That is my go to powder for 308.I can get 10 shot 1/2" or less groups @100 yrds.

zkovach · 04-14-2010, 08:16 PM

i shoot imr 4320 outta my howa and had great groups. Enjoy the howa its a great gun.

bntyhntr6975 · 04-20-2010, 01:25 AM

My .308 favors 150g Nosler Ballistic Tips ahead of Win 748 over everything else. Close behind it is 168g Nosler BTHPs with IMR 4895. It also shoots Fed Gold Medal Match (clones) pretty well. Very few rifles seem to dislike the Fed GMM so you might want to try those out too. Black Hills Match (I have that recipe as well) is a little too much for some rifles, but its a fairly hot load. Personally, I wasn't impressed with it, but you may have good luck with it.

Gearheadpyro · 04-20-2010, 07:06 PM

The biggest issue I have with the ladder test is you need more than 100 yards. Up until now (though this has recently changed) I only had 100 yards. At that 100 yards, I used this load development procedure. I'll give the ladder test another go round next time I need to work up a load (which will be soon =) ).

I shoot 165 gr SST's as my hunting load in my .308. My remmy loves the IMR 4320 with them.

JLA · 04-20-2010, 07:19 PM

I find the ladder test work exceptionally well with pistol load development

The_Rifleman · 04-20-2010, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gearheadpyro

The biggest issue I have with the ladder test is you need more than 100 yards.

I've actually never ladder tested beyond 100 yards; I want the difference in load to change my POI, not the wind.

After I ladder test then I will go for a group at 300 to see how well I did. I've never had a 3 shot test group with any rifle be above .68moa at 300 yards, after ladder testing at 100 yards, including my 30-30.

02-27-2010, 10:19 PM	#1
FTK87 V.I.P. Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Chouteau, Oklahoma Posts: 481	New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load I picked up a new rifle at the gunshow this morning, then got to try it out this afternoon. Rifle: Howa M1500 .308 22" barrel Scope:Nikko Sterling 3-10X42mm 3 shot 7/8" group @ 100yds, heres the kicker, with PMC Bronze 147gr FMJ(Cheapest brass cased ammo I could find) I'll be starting to work out a load next week, to bad my options are so limited, I only have 165gr Hornady SST bullets, and only RL-15 or Varget. Anybody have a clue where to start? Attached Images __________________ I NEED .22-250 BRASS!!! http://www.OklahomaSportsmen.com -->

02-27-2010, 10:51 PM	#2
CampingJosh TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Indiana Contributor Posts: 4,788	Re: New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load That's not a bad problem to have! A gun that is too accurate with cheap ammo? Sorry, but I'm no help on your question. Congrats on your find, though. __________________ Nothing posted on TheFirearmsForum.com constitutes legal, accounting, gunsmithing, or other professional advice. Readers are encouraged to consult with qualified professionals for real advice. Your life is lived at your own risk. Don't blame me for the dumb things you do.

02-27-2010, 11:08 PM	#3
The_Rifleman Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Ohio Posts: 872	Re: New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load Nice group, beautiful rifle! I own a Howa myself and love it and the Nikko Stirling scope! My Hornady manual says: VARGET starts at 32.6 at 2100fps, max load at 44.0 at 2600fps. RL-15 starts at 35.2 at 2100fps, max load is 44.3 at 2600fps. Remember to start low checking for pressure signs every shot. Have you ever tried the Audette Ladder Test? Make sure you report back to display your hand-loaded groups. Be safe! __________________ Debate isn't "uncivil" behavior. Pointing out illogical reasoning is a legitimate counter argument. That is the problem with internet forum mods, they rarely understand what constitutes legitimate, honest and civil debate. They reward the trolls and annoy the people genuinely trying communicate. I don't really like this place anyway, have fun with your power trip. ...nuff said.

02-27-2010, 11:22 PM	#4
312shooter Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Las Vegas NV Posts: 1,148	Re: New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load Varget is going to be a great, if not the best powder for your load. I use 44 gr of Varget, 168 BTHP with a CCI standard LR primer and get outstanding results. I think Speer shows a tad more than 44 gr for your max load on the 165's but trust only the data you read with your own eyes. Good luck __________________ "Democracy is based on citizenship- perhaps the greatest gift the United States has given to the world- Power is vested in the people themselves, and government flows from the people" James M Henslin

02-28-2010, 12:02 AM	#5
FTK87 V.I.P. Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Chouteau, Oklahoma Posts: 481	Re: New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load What is the Audette Ladder test? Yes, I have high hopes for the varget as well, thats why I bought a pound of it over the RL 15, it seems to be a little more finiky about accuracy, I couldn't get it to group in my .223, but it groups great with my '06. I've had great luck with varget in my .223 and '06. funny thing is, I had a Howa M1500 in .223, traded it for a pistol and some cash, sold the pistol and bought another howa. lol __________________ I NEED .22-250 BRASS!!! http://www.OklahomaSportsmen.com

02-28-2010, 02:54 AM	#7
Suicide*Ride Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Golden, Colorado Posts: 1,340	Re: New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load Nice rifle & nice grouping FTK! It's fun to find a firearm that shoots well right out of the box. On a side note; I never understood why some folks think PMC isn't worthy just cuz they're less expensive than most........ I've burned through several thousands of PMC fodder over the years, (mostly small arms ammo) & even use their brass for heavy reloads & have never had any issues @ all. I haven't bought any lately, so maybe their level of quality has gone down over the years.... who knows. @ the Rifleman; thanks for the link to the Audette ladder test. Anything that might help to reduce the number of rds. it takes to sight in a firearm is a plus. SR __________________ "The price of FREEDOM can be seen here" ******(the sign outside every VA hospital)****** In an emergency, people don't rise to the occasion, but are reduced to their level of training. When something is trying to eat you, it is hard to get off a good shot! "If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Twain Last edited by SuicideRide; 02-28-2010 at 03:00 AM.. Reason: Ima Dumas :)*

02-28-2010, 10:34 AM	#8
JLA TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Heart Of Texas Contributor Posts: 17,319	Re: New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load I second the ladder test. Since finding it out, its the only load development method i use... __________________ It takes 43 muscles to frown, 17 to smile, and 3 for proper trigger squeeze. The latest caliber or gear is no substitute for experience and skill. Rifles and cartridges don't make hits -- shooters do. Fact of life: After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF!

04-14-2010, 07:52 PM	#9
oldreliable45120 Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 20	Re: New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load you cant go wrong with Varget.I use 44.5 with a 168 bthp in all of my tactical rifles with good results. If you can get your hands on some IMR-4064 give that a try.That is my go to powder for 308.I can get 10 shot 1/2" or less groups @100 yrds.

04-14-2010, 08:16 PM	#10
zkovach Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,005	Re: New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load i shoot imr 4320 outta my howa and had great groups. Enjoy the howa its a great gun.

04-20-2010, 01:25 AM	#11
bntyhntr6975 V.I.P. Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Wichita, Ks. Posts: 270	Re: New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load My .308 favors 150g Nosler Ballistic Tips ahead of Win 748 over everything else. Close behind it is 168g Nosler BTHPs with IMR 4895. It also shoots Fed Gold Medal Match (clones) pretty well. Very few rifles seem to dislike the Fed GMM so you might want to try those out too. Black Hills Match (I have that recipe as well) is a little too much for some rifles, but its a fairly hot load. Personally, I wasn't impressed with it, but you may have good luck with it. __________________ There is a fine line between paranoid and prepared.

04-20-2010, 07:06 PM	#12
Gearheadpyro V.I.P. Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Charleston, SC Posts: 110	Re: New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load The biggest issue I have with the ladder test is you need more than 100 yards. Up until now (though this has recently changed) I only had 100 yards. At that 100 yards, I used this load development procedure. I'll give the ladder test another go round next time I need to work up a load (which will be soon =) ). I shoot 165 gr SST's as my hunting load in my .308. My remmy loves the IMR 4320 with them. __________________ www.southernmarksman.com Owner of & Chief Instructor for The Southern Marksman, LLC NRA Life Member, NRA CRSO, Multi-Discipline NRA Certified Instructor

04-20-2010, 07:19 PM	#13
JLA TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Heart Of Texas Contributor Posts: 17,319	Re: New Rifle, may be a Challenge to find a load I find the ladder test work exceptionally well with pistol load development __________________ It takes 43 muscles to frown, 17 to smile, and 3 for proper trigger squeeze. The latest caliber or gear is no substitute for experience and skill. Rifles and cartridges don't make hits -- shooters do. Fact of life: After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF!