Plated Berry's wadcutters AND speed - The Firearms Forum

ozo · 06-20-2012, 05:14 PM

I just find this odd and even called Berry's
to see if sumpin' was specific due to a failure of some nature.....
although I can't imagine what.
Only the .38/.357 DEWC and the HBWC plated projectiles
have a 'warning' so to speak:

".38 Cal 148gr DEWC

QUALIFIES FOR FREE FREIGHT ON ORDERS OVER $50.00

w
When loading for these bullets, you need to use data that will attain 800 fps as a minimum. Most of the data for this bullet weight was created using a dead soft lead projectile with velocities under the 800 fps and will not work for a this bullet at those lower velocities."-per Berry's website

These are plated lead, not jacketed.
Nominally wadcutters are seated deeper than other projectiles, so a difference in inside combustion than a HP or SP or whatever.
When I load 'cowboy loads' let's say, at 750fps with a lead wadcutter,
675fps or 725fps etc. are fine......why would 'these' NEED to
be at a minimum of 800fps......
somehow I can't grasp the reason......
Technical reason.......not guesses please.....'cause my brain doesn't grip
on this one, unless 'someone' had a problem, some dumbass failed on his part, and tried to blame Berry's for something.........and they are just CYA and not
going in to detail when asked......
OR.....it is simple.....and senility has set in on me [and then, how would I know]

todd51 · 06-20-2012, 08:45 PM

I don't know is as technical as I can get. I was thinking of ordering some of these but Midway was out and figured on going straight to Berry's but will wait to see what you discover. I just looked in some of the manuals and not surprising starting loads are all over the place velocity wise. Lyman doesn't list a starting load under 800fps., Speer shows any where from 690 to 754 depending on powder and most of their listing max out before getting to 800, Hornady as usual is on the low side with starting velocities as low as 550 and all max out before getting to 800fps. Interesting.

These listings are for the regular type wc and not for Berry's

Skipper · 06-20-2012, 10:00 PM

They don't want them to stick in the barrel

LDBennett · 06-21-2012, 09:17 AM

Pure lead bullets (think swaged bullets) and even hard cast bullets slide through the barrel with less friction than jacketed bullets. The plated bullet have a copper flashing on them that effects the friction of the bullet going through the barrel. While not as much friction as jacketed bullets the plated bullets have more friction than lead bullets. Berry's Bullets does not want you to stick a bullet in the barrel.

This not so much from the problem of getting the stuck bullet out but you may not realize the bullet never made it out of the barrel and shoot another behind it. That can cause the barrel to bulge and maybe even split open. Very dangerous.

If low velocity Cowboy loads are your desire then use swaged or cast bullets not plated or jacketed bullets. Plated bullets are for reducing the leading of the barrel at load levels above "Cowboy" and below "Jacketed" load levels and to keep the lead dust to a minimum in indoor ranges. In general, plated bullets reduce or eliminate leading at velocities at or around 1000 FPS and should NOT be used at Cowboy load levels. Berry's says load to 800FPS minimum to avoid a problem.

So follow their directions. They have been there, done that.

LDBennett

06-20-2012, 05:14 PM	#1
ozo Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Nashville TN Posts: 2,770	Plated Berry's wadcutters AND speed I just find this odd and even called Berry's to see if sumpin' was specific due to a failure of some nature..... although I can't imagine what. Only the .38/.357 DEWC and the HBWC plated projectiles have a 'warning' so to speak: ".38 Cal 148gr DEWC QUALIFIES FOR FREE FREIGHT ON ORDERS OVER $50.00 w When loading for these bullets, you need to use data that will attain 800 fps as a minimum. Most of the data for this bullet weight was created using a dead soft lead projectile with velocities under the 800 fps and will not work for a this bullet at those lower velocities."-per Berry's website These are plated lead, not jacketed. Nominally wadcutters are seated deeper than other projectiles, so a difference in inside combustion than a HP or SP or whatever. When I load 'cowboy loads' let's say, at 750fps with a lead wadcutter, 675fps or 725fps etc. are fine......why would 'these' NEED to be at a minimum of 800fps...... somehow I can't grasp the reason...... Technical reason.......not guesses please.....'cause my brain doesn't grip on this one, unless 'someone' had a problem, some dumbass failed on his part, and tried to blame Berry's for something.........and they are just CYA and not going in to detail when asked...... OR.....it is simple.....and senility has set in on me [and then, how would I know] __________________ http://www.nranews.com/#/nranews, "ozo. you're off your rocker sir." -johnlives4christ http://www.prisonplanet.com/ -America,Bless GOD- -->

06-20-2012, 08:45 PM	#2
todd51 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Central, Ohio Contributor Posts: 2,571	Re: Plated Berry's wadcutters AND speed I don't know is as technical as I can get. I was thinking of ordering some of these but Midway was out and figured on going straight to Berry's but will wait to see what you discover. I just looked in some of the manuals and not surprising starting loads are all over the place velocity wise. Lyman doesn't list a starting load under 800fps., Speer shows any where from 690 to 754 depending on powder and most of their listing max out before getting to 800, Hornady as usual is on the low side with starting velocities as low as 550 and all max out before getting to 800fps. Interesting. These listings are for the regular type wc and not for Berry's __________________ Retired Praefectus Vigilum NRA Endowment Member Last edited by todd51; 06-20-2012 at 08:47 PM..

06-20-2012, 10:00 PM	#3
Skipper V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: People's Republic of Kalifornia Posts: 335	Re: Plated Berry's wadcutters AND speed They don't want them to stick in the barrel

06-21-2012, 09:17 AM	#4
LDBennett Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Hesperia, CA Posts: 5,710	Re: Plated Berry's wadcutters AND speed Pure lead bullets (think swaged bullets) and even hard cast bullets slide through the barrel with less friction than jacketed bullets. The plated bullet have a copper flashing on them that effects the friction of the bullet going through the barrel. While not as much friction as jacketed bullets the plated bullets have more friction than lead bullets. Berry's Bullets does not want you to stick a bullet in the barrel. This not so much from the problem of getting the stuck bullet out but you may not realize the bullet never made it out of the barrel and shoot another behind it. That can cause the barrel to bulge and maybe even split open. Very dangerous. If low velocity Cowboy loads are your desire then use swaged or cast bullets not plated or jacketed bullets. Plated bullets are for reducing the leading of the barrel at load levels above "Cowboy" and below "Jacketed" load levels and to keep the lead dust to a minimum in indoor ranges. In general, plated bullets reduce or eliminate leading at velocities at or around 1000 FPS and should NOT be used at Cowboy load levels. Berry's says load to 800FPS minimum to avoid a problem. So follow their directions. They have been there, done that. LDBennett