Political attacks upon religion

[45Auto]

Not long ago, some Republicans said they were not going to consider Romney for president in the primary because they thought his Mormon faith was a "cult." (I'm not a Morman.)

Was this political jab at Romney's Morman faith acceptable?

[Python]

Originally Posted by 45Auto

Not long ago, some Republicans said they were not going to consider Romney for president in the primary because they thought his Mormon faith was a "cult." (I'm not a Morman.)

Was this political jab at Romney's Morman faith acceptable?

Only if you care that the person you elect as President is a "Born Again" Christian. Personally, I couldn't vote for anyone for President that doesn't have enough "intelligence" to know who Jesus Christ "IS" and believes a different "GOSPEL". "But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned". The Mormons preach a "different" gospel (Book of Mormon) making them a "cult". However,the Mormons are not unique. The majority of "so called" Christian churches of today, even the worlds largest denomination, teaches a different gospel. It's called "Apostasy" (falling away). For instance, churches that ordain homosexuals as pastors, etc., or teach that Jesus is not the only "mediator" between God & man, any church adding or subtracting from the original teaching/scripture of the "GOSPEL" (Good News) is considered a "cult" and eternally condemned.

[carver]

+1

[hunter29180]

Originally Posted by Python

".[/U] The Mormons preach a "different" gospel (Book of Mormon) making them a "cult". .

beg Pardon... the Book of Morman with in the Morman church is not diffrent as you seem to think. to Mormons it is a record of their church a referance to be used as a extention to the OFFICAL BIBLE of the church..the KJV Bible. in fact the KJV is the only Bible reconnised as ligimate in the mormon church in, but All gospel based on a printed word should be Prayed on to GOD because Man has such a history of changing and interpenting the Word of GOD to suit what he wants it to say. This includes the Book of Mormon.

How do I know this? It is what I was taught as I embrased the Mormon theology. Yes I am a Mormon. I was raised Babtist, became Pennycostol, embraced Methosist, found a kindred home in Mormanism, AND yes was Baptised in each one.

in each there is truth..but each is corrupted by MAN, in each except for the Mormans, I have been told HELL has a reserved place for me because I do question, I dont blindly follow. In reading the Bible i came to believe as the mormons do that all so called Gospel should be Prayed on and over, asking only that God say if it is the true teachings. then to wait for the "still small voice within" to show me Gods will. So far only Mormonsism teaches this and encourages its members to do so. TO question a ANNOINTED PREACHER in all the others seems to have COMDEMED me to hell.

So until you have read the Book of Mormon and if you find any thing that teaches anything that goes against what the Bible (KJV) teaches. Please dont BLINDLY accept what the rest of the regligions shout, that we are a cult. I have read the Book of Mormon from front to back and found nothing that goes against anything in the KJV BIBLE within its pages. in fact it supports the Bible in every way.

for any who wish to research the Book of Mormon, drop me a PM and I will gladly get you one..NO STRINGS ATTACHED. no "visits" from the church unless you decide you wish them either.

[ampaterry]

Anyone who would make such a remark should not be in public office.
The definition of "cult" is a group that follows a MAN instead of GOD.
Mormons are not "The Church of Joseph Smith" or "The Church of Brigham Young".
They are "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints".
I have attended their services, I have been through their evangelistic program twice, I have had extensive conversations with over a dozen of their missionaries, and I have one nephew and one neice that are members. Not one of these professed Joseph Smith (or any other leader) above Jesus Christ. Not one of them prayed to Joseph Smith or any other mortal, but only to Jesus Christ.
My first Bible, after getting saved, was printed by the Mormon Church in Salt Lake City. It was even a King James Version.

Do I accept all of thier doctrin?
Absolutely not.
Neither do I accept all of the doctrin of Jehova's Witnesses, Seventh Day Adventists, Church of Christ, Catholics, Presbyterians, Church of God, Assembly of God, Lutherins, or ANY OTHER denomination.
There is no Christian denomination on earth that has everything 100% right.
And there is none that has everything 100% wrong, either.

Calling a Christian Denomination a "Cult" is unacceptable in a leader, because who knows which group he will decide is a "Cult" NEXT year?
Catholics?
Baptists?

The remark was way out of line, and will ensure he is not elected.

[Double D]

There are worms everywhere.....

[tcox4freedom]

I do think the remark was out of line.

I have read the Book of Mormon. I once considered joining the Mormon church after I was ostrisized by other denominations.

I agree with Terry 110% when he says ALL denominations have faults and tenets that aren't necessarily "Biblical".

Thus far, I find the EPC denomination as the one who most line up with what I believe true "Christian" faith. But, that doesn't mean believe all their tenets; or that other religions and "christian" denominations don't have some "valuable" things to teach.

I know Mormons, Jehova Witnesses, Catholics and Jews that I believe to be "christians". Like me, these people recognize that salvation is NOT about any religion. Salvation is about a relationship with Jesus Christ.

They all recognize themselves as sinners in need of grace.
They all believe in the diety of Christ, His virgin birth, death and resurrection.
They also believe that one must know HIM if they are to receive eternal life.

So, I really don't have any problem with a persons religion. I want to know about his relationship.

[Gun Geezer]

Another example of "windbag" politicians who will do anything, say anything to get elected or stay in office. Sometimes they just forget who's listening to them. " Shucky darn, this isn't the Klan rally, oops wrong speech."

[Python]

Mormons believe that God has not always been the Supreme Being of the universe, but attained that status through righteous living and persistent effort. They believe that God the Father has a "body of flesh and bones as tangible as man's". Brigham Young taught that Adam was actually God and the father of Jesus Christ. Mormon leaders have taught that Jesus incarnation was the result of a physical relationship between God the Father and Mary. Mormons believe that Jesus is a god, but that any human can also become a god. Mormonism teaches that salvation can be earned by a combination of faith and good works. And lets not forget the message of the "angel Moroni" preaching "another gospel" and the "magic spectacles" to read the "other gospel".

Suggested Mormon reading... The Pearl of Great Price, Journal of Discourses, Teachings of Joesph Smith, Doctrine and Covenants, Articles of Faith, and Mormon Doctrine. Then read "The Gospel of Jesus Christ"(The BIBLE). Eternity is too long to be wrong.

[Airdale]

Far be it from me to cast aspersions upon any church. But...let me relate my one and only experiance with the Latter Day Saints. I want to first say thatI respect the Mormons for the way they take care of their own and how they lead their lives. And now the rest of the story....

Long ago (we're talking decades) when I was a teen I attended Mormon services with my girlfriend. All was going well up to the point the leader of the service started talking about how all Christians can attain their place in heaven but Mormons would reach a higher plateau than all others. It was at that point I was getting very uncomfortable with the tone of this service. As he rambled on about why, as Latter Day Saints, they would inhabit a more exhaulted place in heaven I fought the urge to leave the service so as not to embarrass my girlfriend.

I fought my urges well up to the point the speaker layed the proverbial straw upon what remained of any restraint I had left. As they were about to offer communion the leader warned that anyone not of the Mormon faith was not welcomed to participate. That was it, I excused myself and departed as fast as I politely could. I listened to good old fifties (it was '58 or '59) rock and roll 'til the service was over and Robin (GF) got in the car. Told her I'd never go to that church again. To this day I've never entered a Mormon house of worship.

Sorry for the long winded rant. Guess it had been stewing inside all those many years. No insults or inferences intended. Sadly just a true story.

[Airdale]

BTW, the "CULT" remark wasn't made by a politician. It was made by a Pastor friend of Perry's that introduced him at some event or other. It was not made during the introduction. It was made off stage when the Pastor was questioned by a reporter on his opinion (not Perry's) of the Mormon faith. Perry has stated he does not consider the Mormon faith a "cult".

[carver]

And just what does the Morman Church teach you if you happen to be a black person?

[ampaterry]

We are getting off into tons of doctrine here, guys, and interpretations of LDS doctrine by those that are outside the LDS church.
We have LDS in this forum -
Let us agree that they DO worship God, that they DO pray to and through Jesus Christ, and they do NOT worship Joseph Smith or any other mortal human, which removes them from the status of "cult".

I don't think it is necessary to insult other members beliefs here -

There was time, carver, that they taught that a black person could not achieve the same level of priesthood as a white person (Aaronic? I think - )
That doctrine has changed.
There were similar doctrines in a LOT of Christian denominations at one time -

And BTW, Airdale, I have been in SEVERAL main-line Christian churches that explained prior to communion that it was for MEMBERS ONLY.
I don't feel that way.
I figure that if Jesus Christ could share the last supper with Judas, no Christian leader on earth has the right to tell ANYONE they cannot share communion with them.

Thank you for the clarification of the "cult" remark -
That does shed a whole new light on the incident -

[Diamondback]

IF being a Mormon condemns one to hell, then so does being a baptist, or an episcopalian, a catholic, a luthern, oh shucks take your choice. I have attended services in virtually every religious persuasion that makes claim to christianity. I way too many of them I was told that I was condemned to hell if I didn't change my ways and become a convert to their version of christianity. I have found a home with a teacher of the Bible by the name of Pastor Arnold Murray of the Shepards Chapel. He does not preach, he does not condemn. He teaches the Bible and what it means. It is quite refreshing to listen to a man who wishes to lead me to right path instead of forcing me on to what he considers the path. BTW I finally realized that the ones who were condemning me were only mortal men who had not the right nor the power to condemn.
I, too have met and talked with Mormans and I believe that they are truly Christians who live their live far closer to the word of God than many others.

[ampaterry]

The truth is indeed - where you find it.

Did anyone follow Dr. Gene Scott?
Fantastic Bible scholar, unorthadox as heck but right on almost ALL the time -
No denomination.

My buddy told me that I was the only guy he knew that could not find a single church he agreed with, so started his own.
LOL!!!

[Double D]

Originally Posted by Diamondback

IF being a Mormon condemns one to hell, then so does being a baptist, or an episcopalian, a catholic, a luthern, oh shucks take your choice. I have attended services in virtually every religious persuasion that makes claim to christianity. I way too many of them I was told that I was condemned to hell if I didn't change my ways and become a convert to their version of christianity. I have found a home with a teacher of the Bible by the name of Pastor Arnold Murray of the Shepards Chapel. He does not preach, he does not condemn. He teaches the Bible and what it means. It is quite refreshing to listen to a man who wishes to lead me to right path instead of forcing me on to what he considers the path. BTW I finally realized that the ones who were condemning me were only mortal men who had not the right nor the power to condemn.
I, too have met and talked with Mormans and I believe that they are truly Christians who live their live far closer to the word of God than many others.

I think thats great, as long as he is teaching the things that are hard to hear as well as the things that "tickle" the ears. The gospel is full of words that "convict" man to repentance and if you never hear any words like that you arent hearing the full gospel. I am not saying it cant be presented in a way that is much easier to digest. But, it will still convict still the same.

[Airdale]

"And BTW, Airdale, I have been in SEVERAL main-line Christian churches that explained prior to communion that it was for MEMBERS ONLY."

Terry,

I have found the same thing but at the time I had only been to Baptist and a few Catholic services and denying somebody communion was new concept to me. As usual we agree.

[hunter29180]

Originally Posted by Python

Mormons believe that God has not always been the Supreme Being of the universe, but attained that status through righteous living and persistent effort.
umm been a member for over 20 yrs and never heard that bullcrap.

They believe that God the Father has a "body of flesh and bones as tangible as man's".
there is a basis in the KJV that would lead anyone to think this is possible.

Brigham Young taught that Adam was actually God and the father of Jesus Christ. Mormon leaders have taught that Jesus incarnation was the result of a physical relationship between God the Father and Mary.

anain bullcrap, dont know where you are getting this but I will pray for the Holy Ghost to open your eyes and lead you to greener pastures...cause the one you are grazing in is all crap.

Mormons believe that Jesus is a god, but that any human can also become a god. Mormonism teaches that salvation can be earned by a combination of faith and good works.

Yes Jesus is Gods son, and only that is taught. he is only a God as long as God the Father decrees it to be so. sort of like the Prodgil son..anly as long as his father decrees him to be.

as to salvation..there are a few things you must do, just as any other religon teaches. in fact the path to salvation is very much the same as any other religon claims it to be.

And lets not forget the message of the "angel Moroni" preaching "another gospel" and the "magic spectacles" to read the "other gospel".

Suggested Mormon reading... The Pearl of Great Price, Journal of Discourses, Teachings of Joesph Smith, Doctrine and Covenants, Articles of Faith, and Mormon Doctrine. Then read "The Gospel of Jesus Christ"(The BIBLE). Eternity is too long to be wrong.

and the first book you are requested (NOTE NOT SUGGESTED..REQUESTED)to read is.....THE KING JAMES VERSION OF THE BIBLE. THE REST YOU MENTIONED are to be used in conjunction to the KJV bible.

I figure you are like the 6 preaches and leaders of the other churches that have condemmed me to hell for not accepting their word as the gospel truth. I will not condem any person even you to that. God did not give me the RIGHT OR THE RESPONSIBILITY to do that OH SO HEAVY BURDEN!
instead he has stated that all our deeds and words shal be entered into the Book Of Life, and we each and every one shall be judged at the gates as to our worth to enter the presence of GOD. Of course you could say the Book Of Life is part of a cult teaching too. but EVERY Mormon I Know believes in that BOOKS EXSISTANCE.

[Archie]

To the original posting:

Was this political jab at Romney's Morman faith acceptable?

Acceptable in what context? From a doctrinal and theological standpoint, yes.

From a "Who are we going to elect as President?" standpoint, it is both un Constitutional and pointless. (For those who don't follow, the Constitution forbids "... a religious test..." for any public office. It is Article VI, clause 6 of the Constitution. However, this does not forbid a voter to vote as his or her conscience directs, for any reason.)

At the worst, Governor Romney is not a 'real' Christian. (Not a value judgement, just a basis for discussion.) However, he has some idea of how a national economy works, he knows how to act as the chief executive of a political body and he has a grasp of both domestic and international issues and affairs.

At best, President Obama doesn't conduct himself as a Christian. (Again, not a judgement, just an observation.) He has no clue how a national economy works, he does not know how to act as the chief executive of a political body and he has no grasp of neither domestic nor international issues and affairs.

If Governor Romney is the Republican Presidential nominee, I will vote for him for the Presidency. I am voting for neither Governor Romney nor President Obama as a Pastor.

Python, I somewhat understand your criteria, but just remember Jimmy Carter. He is a born again Christian and either the worst or runner up for worst President we've had in living memory.

It is interesting to note the man who started all this, Pastor Robert Jeffress, has also said he would vote for Governor Romney over President Obama.

The Democrat controlled mainstream media wants this internal conservative question to stay in everyone's mind. Revisiting this over and over is helping the Leftist Agenda.

[jack404]

ok , read your points , some from me

the dark ages where a Christian phenomenon, basically they pushed folks into doing everything for the church , you donated morning and night , you attended morning and night and where basically a slave to the church

the people brought the church out of the dark ages , God working through true believers brought the church out of its power trip ..

Mormon folks , heck name any Christian church , any one of them got it 100% straight ? i aint found one yet , so why jump over mormon folks ? yes i dont agree with the officialdom type teachings , just like many mormons dont agree ..

by their deeds shall ye know them and i see mormon folks helping out here in the outback , building homes and clinics for the Koori desert folks and heading home when done , i see catholics too and ya dont want to know what i think of the catholic church , but for the people i have not a lot but praise for their efforts

religion is one thing , religion as a word comes from two other words , reliana from which we get regal and royal meaning to lead or control and legion which means many..

look at the persons faith not the brand , you'll find good in all the churches and you'll find BS too

mainstream christians have a great submarine class ,


what do i mean?

they surface only on a sunday...

take a hard look now look at the persons morals and actions

by their deeds shall ye know them and its as true now as it was then

so before you jump all over something think of the person their faith and not his brand of faith , brands confuse folks , but a persons life will show you who and what they truly are ..

[rosierita]

only God can truly judge the heart... that's not my place & i dont want it to be.

as far as romney goes, i dont think much of him bc of his flip flopping. he appears to be too weak to take a stand. he's obviously a smart man, but weak in his convictions.

what will someone like him do to further run our country into the ground? if he's the nominee against obama, i'll vote for him, but PLEASE keep him away from the paper shredders... no telling what he'll run through it.