I was talking to my dad this weekend, and he admitted to me he never graduated high School. He went to college and became a C.P.A. he was Vice President of a company that made all the moulding for G.M. in the 60's. He was head of the board of education in East Detroit as well as served on the City Council in the 70's, while managing his own accounting firm. In 1972 he moved to KY bought a farm and opened a small Gun Store. He did this until retirment.
He was embaressed to tell me that he lied on his College Application and claimed he was a high school graduate. (Back then they didn't check to thouruoghly.) He quit school and lied about his age at age 16 without his parents permission to join the Navy and fight in WWII.
I told my Dad what he did was noble. I told him that for what he did for our country he desirved to get into college. He still feels guilty about this.
What do you guys think about this. I want to make him feel better. I can tell it truley bothers him.
Do you guys think he did a bad thing. Or just did what he had to to get by.
He was a great Dad. That is what I told him. I said no matter how you feel you have always been a good person, and have always put others before yourself.
"From my cold, dead hands"-- Charlton Heston 2000
Last edited by KyBlaster; 01-14-2006 at 11:04 PM..
Diplomas and degrees are merely pieces of paper. ALL that counts is what one has LEARNED, and much more importantly, what one DOES with what he has learned. Seems to me your Dad qualifies on all counts, Ky.
i think what he feels most guilt about is lying , not that he didnt go to h.s. the major diff i see here is , he lied about h.s. becuase he wante dto fight in ww2. he did not lie to get out of trouble, or cover something up bad, that he or someone else did. i don't know what to tell you , but i would start by telling him the above, also that many young boys back then left their whole lot in life back then , if not to serve their country, but to seemingly start life with whole new options , they never would have gotten staying where they were. Most men who joined ww2 could not read , write, had rotten teeth, no glasses, etc. after the military taught them and fixed them up both physically and mentally, they went on to build great things into this country for which we still are reaping the benefits. even if all they did afterwards was to go ahead and start a great new generation(s) of family. i see no fault here.
this is going to sound weird, but in the third hannibal movie he tells clairice, you don't need all these documents and awards and pats on the back to feel " good " about yourself, and to feel validated, all she need to do is look in the mirror.
my Father grew up in the great depression, by 6 he was selling apples and shoeshines to help feed the family. by 15 he was a great baseball player, and was offered a contract to play minors for the indians, but he turned it down because he didn't want to leave his mom and 2 sisters without guarranteed money, so he stayed. At 17 , he decided he had to join the marines, and did , and served in the Island hopping campaings in the Pacific. got shot for it.
i don't know what changed in the family situation for him to go, he has never really said. Thinking back on it now, I realize that there is no way he grad H.S. either. In my opinion and that of others he has met along life's way , there is no doubt he is still a great man. it seems that your father considers his life to have begun, and to get good when he went to college, and that started because he got in on a lie. i would say his life did not start there, and that he did thing sthat touched people's life even before he joined the military. much like the movie it;s a wonderful life, his life had importance and meaning, since the time he was a boy im sure.
If his lie teaches us anything, it is the value he places on beeing a truthful person, and maybe feels he is not , and is a hypocrite every day he wakes up , and talks to people throughout the day, as if he was saying to himself, if you only new about me, how terrible i am. tell him that this much worrying about it show s the exact opposite, that a dishonest man would not be bothered by such minor things.
Last edited by rangerruck; 01-15-2006 at 12:49 AM..
While my Dad also did not graduate from high school (made it through the 11th grade) the times were really different then. Your dad went through the depression as a teen ager. My dad must have been about ten years older and had yet to see the depression when he quit school. School then was about learning enough to be able to get and hold a job. It was not about the esoteric study of history, poetry, religion, black studies, political science. If your skills were with your hands, as my Dad's was, he only needed minimal general education and a lot of experience, which he could not get while in school.
College then was a rarety at least in the mid-west where my Dad was raised.The mere fact that your dad got through college with a degree said that he stopped late enough in high school that he had already gained the required knowledge to succeed in college.
Today with all the peacenik fools, war is a choice, at least to them. When your Pacific fleet has been wiped out and funny looking little man in Germany has "plans" for America, the country looks at war a little differently. I would bet millions of teenagers left high school early, lied about their age, and joined in defending the USA. The GI bill is what saved your dad as it allowed him to go to college. I'll bet he was the only one at college that knew he didn't finish high school. Worldly experience has to be worth something and in your dad's case it allowed him to get through college without a problem. Be very proud of him. I know I would be. I'm proud that my Dad was able to always adequately provide for his family, education or not.
kyblaster---one small lie that harmed no-one does not matter, what matters is what he has achieved, and how he helped people on the way.
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't
pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for,
protected, and handed on for them to do the same, or one day we will spend
our sunset years telling our children and our children's children what it
was once like in the United States where men were free." -- Ronald Reagan
Please tell your dad this for me;
"IF you where perfect it would be your picture hanging in the church, since it isn't your picture then you are just a normal American Hero and we have all made a mistake or two in our life. Ask that the good lord forgive you for that small mistake and go on and enjoy your life."
Then give him a hug from all of us and tell him thanks for being the person that he is.
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And after thinking about this overnight, KY, there are two other thoughts I have...
#1 - There is probably NO better illustration of the difference between "the Greatest Generation" and "Bill Clinton's Generation" than this "moral dilemma......"
#2 - From the RELIGIOUS aspect...the "Big 10" actually has NOTHING about "lying" per se, but is SPECIFIC about "Bearing False Witness..." so Pistolshootzen is CORRECT, technically AND spiritually! What did he DO with the "lie.....?"
The problems we face today are
there because the people who work
for a living are outnumbered by those
who vote for a living.
I agree so much with what has been said. I'm a college student, and to me a college degree doesn't even look like a big accomplishment because college isn't about getting an education, it's about playing a game. (Didn't Mark Twain say something to the effect of "Never let your schooling interfere with your education"?) I know it's important, and a high school diploma is important too. Basically what I'm saying is that I would never encourage someone to drop out of school to work, or join the military, but what your father did in the past was a noble thing, and if he can just look back on his life and see all of the good that came from his life, then nothing else matters.
I did not go to college. I taught a Masters course in electronic equipment design. None of my kids have graduated (officially) from high school. My daughter was the first daycare operator to be licenced for newborn in the tri-county area. #3 son maxed the high school tests when in 7th grade.
Having taken a regular course of studies and stayed the course is important information on which many personnel managers judge your potential worth to their company. Having achieved excellence without the formal training is placed just as high on the scale by any personnel manager who knows anything about people.
Having lied on his college entrance papers places him on par with many achievers. If I remember correctly, Edison had a similar situation. Having lied to join the military in time of war places him on par with many other admirable people.
I don't think he has anything of which to be ashamed.