Winchester may be going away - The Firearms Forum

lead · 01-17-2006, 02:23 PM

I have seen a report that Winchester is seriously considering closing it's U.S. plant for good. It was on a nynewsday.com story but I lost the complete address. A 140 year old institution going down the tubes. It's a sad day.

Marlin · 01-17-2006, 03:32 PM

Here is the link to the full article for those who might wish to see it.

http://www.nynewsday.com/news/local/...,2840187.story

Deputy Dawg · 01-17-2006, 04:06 PM

It is just like loosing part of America.

Tracker · 01-17-2006, 05:47 PM

Like loosing part of America, and an Icon in American firearms history---sad, very sad. The name Winchester brings to mind the old west, and a high quality firearm we have relied on for many years---sad, very sad.

flopshot · 01-17-2006, 06:44 PM

sad. named one of my best pups Winchester years ago. never could scrape together the cash for one.always had my eye on the high end stuff is there a Winchester O/U in the 1000.00 - 1200.00 range i might pick up ?

polishshooter · 01-17-2006, 09:59 PM

Well, Winchester isn't the Winchester of 140 years ago, either...it's changed hands MANY times in the past...at least after Ol' Ollie bought the farm!

Just remember, Oliver Winchester was a BUSINESSMAN and a SALESMAN, not a GUN DESIGNER.

He took OTHER people's designs and marketed them, sometimes well, sometimes not. And along the way he took OTHER people's designs he could not beat, or were TOO much competition, and BURIED them and their company (Spencer Firearms, anyone?) So as much as I love CERTAIN "Winchesters", I never really shed a tear for Old Oliver OR "Winchester,"as a name. He was good at what he did, and died a rich man. And he of ALL people would understand getting "bought out." That's life in the jungle...

SO after Oliver died, not much changed in the firearms world, as opposed to when John Moses Browning died...

I LOVE my heirloom Winchester 1897...and would NEVER part with it. I also WILL own a Model 12 someday... But in my heart I KNOW they are "Brownings..."

On the other hand a few years ago I paid $20 at a knife show for the first "Multi-Tool" I ever saw etched with "Winchester," thinking it was a quality piece and when it BROKE, I noticed "Made in China," which was also right AFTER I saw Walmart selling them for $10, and I coulda' got the SAME quality at Big Lots for $4.99!

My point? Whether it's Winchester, WW, WRA, USRA, or whatever, the GOOD guns they still market will live on, even if produced elsewhere by someone else...

...and if THEY are smart, they will either immediately or soon enough, cash in on the 'Winchester" name... There will ALWAYS be a Winchester, just not like there was in 1900 or 1963...

...and I hope they DON'T make cheap multi-tools...

LDBennett · 01-18-2006, 08:07 AM

I wonder if closing the plant means "Winchester" is really going away. Browning has managed to survive as a design organization with guns made all over the world for them. Since FN, Browning, and "Winchester" have a common owner what is to say that Model 70's and Model 94's (etc.) can not be made in Japan or Portugal or Belguim. I don't think the fat lady has sung yet.

The problem with any manufacturer in the USA today is the cost of labor. Any of these foreign manufacturers (now including China) can beat the manufacturing costs of US made products. Why would a company designed for profit (shareholders) put up with high US labor costs when there are other options. Only privately owned companies can choose to limit profits to keep manufacturing in the US. Stock companies are bound by their share holder to maximise profits. Unfortunately this new "World" based thinking will in the end pull the USA's population down as it elevates the third world. No way to stop it now!

The press release is from the city and the unions who probably don't know the real "plans" of Winchester. Besides the Japanese Winchesters and Brownings are worlds better made than anything that normally comes out of the US plant. It may be bad for the city and the unions and good for the gun buyer.

I think we have to get used to a reduced manufacturing sector in the USA and all the consequences of it, until our labor costs get reduced to match the rest of the world or the rest of the world's labor force their labor cost up. It will be a long hard struggle either way. None of this is good for the USA!

LDBennett

Pistolenschutze · 01-18-2006, 08:17 AM

It is a sad commentary on gun manufacturers in the U.S., and unfortunately true of all too many other traditional "American" corporations. I read not long ago that Levi-Srauss no longer manufactuers its clothing line in the U.S. At this rate pretty soon Colt will sell out its operation to the Chinese and the only 1911s you can buy will be cheap plastic knock-offs. Now that is a horrible thought!

berto64 · 01-18-2006, 03:05 PM

Hey PS, I have one of those "cheap" multitools. I just don't try and use it for anything and break it.

The only Winchester I have these days is an old Mod 1911 12 gauge shotgun. Also known as 'the widowmaker'.

Unique firearm.

01-17-2006, 02:23 PM	#1
lead Advanced Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,522	Winchester may be going away I have seen a report that Winchester is seriously considering closing it's U.S. plant for good. It was on a nynewsday.com story but I lost the complete address. A 140 year old institution going down the tubes. It's a sad day. __________________ The best things in life, are not things. -->

01-17-2006, 03:32 PM	#2
Marlin TFF Admin Staff Chief Counselor Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: At SouthernMoss' side forever! Contributor Posts: 13,853	Re: Winchester may be going away Here is the link to the full article for those who might wish to see it. http://www.nynewsday.com/news/local/...,2840187.story __________________ *The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing.* *The only criminal class native to the United States is Congress.*

01-17-2006, 04:06 PM	#3
Deputy Dawg Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Central Texas Gulf Coast Posts: 2,229	Re: Winchester may be going away It is just like loosing part of America. __________________ LOCK and LOAD................................... GOD, GUNS,GUTS the three that keep us FREE!!!!

01-17-2006, 05:47 PM	#4
Tracker V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Lake County Ohio Posts: 202	Re: Winchester may be going away Like loosing part of America, and an Icon in American firearms history---sad, very sad. The name Winchester brings to mind the old west, and a high quality firearm we have relied on for many years---sad, very sad. __________________ "Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same, or one day we will spend our sunset years telling our children and our children's children what it was once like in the United States where men were free." -- Ronald Reagan "We The People" "The Pro Gun Blog"

01-17-2006, 06:44 PM	#5
flopshot V.I.P. Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: North Carolina Posts: 294	Re: Winchester may be going away sad. named one of my best pups Winchester years ago. never could scrape together the cash for one.always had my eye on the high end stuff is there a Winchester O/U in the 1000.00 - 1200.00 range i might pick up ? __________________ take a kid shooting... they are the next vote

01-17-2006, 09:59 PM	#6
polishshooter Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Indiana Contributor Posts: 7,860	Re: Winchester may be going away Well, Winchester isn't the Winchester of 140 years ago, either...it's changed hands MANY times in the past...at least after Ol' Ollie bought the farm! Just remember, Oliver Winchester was a BUSINESSMAN and a SALESMAN, not a GUN DESIGNER. He took OTHER people's designs and marketed them, sometimes well, sometimes not. And along the way he took OTHER people's designs he could not beat, or were TOO much competition, and BURIED them and their company (Spencer Firearms, anyone?) So as much as I love CERTAIN "Winchesters", I never really shed a tear for Old Oliver OR "Winchester,"as a name. He was good at what he did, and died a rich man. And he of ALL people would understand getting "bought out." That's life in the jungle... SO after Oliver died, not much changed in the firearms world, as opposed to when John Moses Browning died... I LOVE my heirloom Winchester 1897...and would NEVER part with it. I also WILL own a Model 12 someday... But in my heart I KNOW they are "Brownings..." On the other hand a few years ago I paid $20 at a knife show for the first "Multi-Tool" I ever saw etched with "Winchester," thinking it was a quality piece and when it BROKE, I noticed "Made in China," which was also right AFTER I saw Walmart selling them for $10, and I coulda' got the SAME quality at Big Lots for $4.99! My point? Whether it's Winchester, WW, WRA, USRA, or whatever, the GOOD guns they still market will live on, even if produced elsewhere by someone else... ...and if THEY are smart, they will either immediately or soon enough, cash in on the 'Winchester" name... There will ALWAYS be a Winchester, just not like there was in 1900 or 1963... ...and I hope they DON'T make cheap multi-tools... __________________ The problems we face today are there because the people who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living. Last edited by polishshooter; 01-17-2006 at 10:03 PM..

01-18-2006, 08:07 AM	#7
LDBennett Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Hesperia, CA Posts: 5,711	Re: Winchester may be going away I wonder if closing the plant means "Winchester" is really going away. Browning has managed to survive as a design organization with guns made all over the world for them. Since FN, Browning, and "Winchester" have a common owner what is to say that Model 70's and Model 94's (etc.) can not be made in Japan or Portugal or Belguim. I don't think the fat lady has sung yet. The problem with any manufacturer in the USA today is the cost of labor. Any of these foreign manufacturers (now including China) can beat the manufacturing costs of US made products. Why would a company designed for profit (shareholders) put up with high US labor costs when there are other options. Only privately owned companies can choose to limit profits to keep manufacturing in the US. Stock companies are bound by their share holder to maximise profits. Unfortunately this new "World" based thinking will in the end pull the USA's population down as it elevates the third world. No way to stop it now! The press release is from the city and the unions who probably don't know the real "plans" of Winchester. Besides the Japanese Winchesters and Brownings are worlds better made than anything that normally comes out of the US plant. It may be bad for the city and the unions and good for the gun buyer. I think we have to get used to a reduced manufacturing sector in the USA and all the consequences of it, until our labor costs get reduced to match the rest of the world or the rest of the world's labor force their labor cost up. It will be a long hard struggle either way. None of this is good for the USA! LDBennett

01-18-2006, 08:17 AM	#8
Pistolenschutze Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 13,094	Re: Winchester may be going away It is a sad commentary on gun manufacturers in the U.S., and unfortunately true of all too many other traditional "American" corporations. I read not long ago that Levi-Srauss no longer manufactuers its clothing line in the U.S. At this rate pretty soon Colt will sell out its operation to the Chinese and the only 1911s you can buy will be cheap plastic knock-offs. Now that is a horrible thought! __________________ --Pistolenschutze (Pistol Shooter)

01-18-2006, 03:05 PM	#9
berto64 VMBB Admin Staff Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Owyhee County, Idaho Contributor Posts: 7,388	Re: Winchester may be going away Hey PS, I have one of those "cheap" multitools. I just don't try and use it for anything and break it. The only Winchester I have these days is an old Mod 1911 12 gauge shotgun. Also known as 'the widowmaker'. Unique firearm. __________________ Be who you are & say what you will, Those that matter won't mind and those that mind don't matter. I'm a bitter clinger, One Nation Under God.