WARS AND RUMORS OF WARS. - The Firearms Forum

rooter · 11-10-2003, 05:11 AM

Tomorrow, November 11th, will be a federally declared holiday. Now it is called Veteran's Day---in my boyhood, it was called Armistice Day. I recall that the peacemakers then must have had a flair for theater, because as serious a conflict as it was, it was declared to have gone done on the 11th month of the 11th day of the 11th hour. The songwriters of Tin Pan Alley composed a lot of patriotic songs after the American Forces entered the already violent war---songs like MY BUDDY, OVER THERE, A LONG WAY TO TIPPERARY---old George M. Cohan did his numerous musical scores that always included, I'M A YANKEE DOODLE DANDY. Today, if there are any of the WWI veterans still alive, they are indeed approaching/exceeding the century mark. The other day I watched the History Channel and stories about that violent time in the worlds history. I was astounded that the German chemist who introduced chemical warfare agents onto the field of battle won the Nobel prize for chemistry a couple years after the war. Some noted person declared it was the 'war to end all wars'---. A score of years later another World War was visited upon the plant---lots of us remember that one, not only the warrior participants but we younger ones waiting in the wings to step forward if needed. Lots of American school children don't know about these wars---why do you suppose it is more important to teach about the French/English and the Battle of Hastings in 1066 than WWII in the mid 20th century? Oh yes, we have had other police actions and brush fire wars---Korea and Vietnam being the more notable ones. Had I chose to make these remarks a short year ago, I would not have been cognizant of the war we are now engaged in---seems like it has been longer than that---probably to the Americans in the field, it seems like an eternity---for those lives already sacrificed, it is an eternity. There was a new concept in this war whereby the news medial personnel was 'embedded' with the troops on the ground. It got close up and personal at times---I believe for the most part, it served its purpose---the term 'firefight' took on a new meaning for most observers---live ammo was being used, not on a Hollywood sound stage, but right there in the boondocks---those litter bearers, when they were hustling off with a wounded warrior, was really tending a 'sucking chest wound', severed limbs, and invaded entrails. That black smoke was not from a bunch of orchard smudge pots used for filming effects, but a T-34 Iraqi tank incinerating its 'reluctant to abandon ship', crew----and too, the grimy oil smoke of those burning Bradley Fighting Vehicles of the Americans--- holes punched thru the armor plate by a Russian/Chinese RPG, killing or wounding the Americans inside with molten metal fragments generated by the detonation. It sure seems to me that it has been a longer war than what it has---rotation dates are being established---I believe Field Commanders like General Sanchez, are afraid or at least reluctant to request more "BOOTS ON THE GROUND". The SECDEF and his cohorts including Paul Wolfowitz, fired a General at the beginning of the conflict when that general remarked 200,000 troops would be needed---. Yes my fellow Americans, we must not forget---each time a day is set aside to remember our Veterans, just don't make it a 'day off' but a day of real dedication---tell your children and grandchildren about these terrible wars and those who had to step up to the line in the sand---they will listen to you and ask you questions---lots of times when they might ask, "why did we have to go to war", tell them if you know the answer--some of those answers might even include the response, "BEATS THE HELL OUT'A ME"!!!! Wilborn

Marlin · 11-10-2003, 09:51 AM

Couldn't agree more, Chief.

When I was a kid in Kensington, Connecticut, Armistice Day was a very solemn affair with a parade, Fife & Drum Corps, and much prayer at the bewitching hour, 1100, at a fine memorial near my home church. Armistice Day was not only a day off from school, it was a day of remembrance and prayer and each was expected to show the proper respect for its true meaning.

It will always be Armistice Day to me and I have never gotten used to Veterans Day, although I do realize why it was changed by name. However, the name change should not have changed the solemnity of the day nor the reason for celebrating the day. Unfortunately, this has come about with the destruction of values that started after WWII and continues on a fast moving rush today.

Thanks for reminding us.

Hope 69/70 · 11-11-2003, 12:14 AM

Chief, perhaps the reason the children don't know about such history is.............maybe the teacher doesn't either.

Hope

rooter · 11-11-2003, 04:12 AM

Your statement of the teachers not caring is well deliberated at times---more than just a few of the colleges have professors teaching who are decidely 'left' and 'liberal', calling the shots. To hear some of them rant and rave, you can't help but wonder how much rubs off on their students. Every time Chris Matthews takes his HARDBALL program onto the campus, and you listen to these students, one cannot help feel the failling of any degree of patroitism or sense of loyalty to the young students country. Chief

11-10-2003, 05:11 AM	#1
rooter VMBB Senior Chief Of Staff Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Marty Robbins old hometown, Glendale Arizona--a suburb of Phoenix. Contributor Posts: 9,272	WARS AND RUMORS OF WARS. Tomorrow, November 11th, will be a federally declared holiday. Now it is called Veteran's Day---in my boyhood, it was called Armistice Day. I recall that the peacemakers then must have had a flair for theater, because as serious a conflict as it was, it was declared to have gone done on the 11th month of the 11th day of the 11th hour. The songwriters of Tin Pan Alley composed a lot of patriotic songs after the American Forces entered the already violent war---songs like MY BUDDY, OVER THERE, A LONG WAY TO TIPPERARY---old George M. Cohan did his numerous musical scores that always included, I'M A YANKEE DOODLE DANDY. Today, if there are any of the WWI veterans still alive, they are indeed approaching/exceeding the century mark. The other day I watched the History Channel and stories about that violent time in the worlds history. I was astounded that the German chemist who introduced chemical warfare agents onto the field of battle won the Nobel prize for chemistry a couple years after the war. Some noted person declared it was the 'war to end all wars'---. A score of years later another World War was visited upon the plant---lots of us remember that one, not only the warrior participants but we younger ones waiting in the wings to step forward if needed. Lots of American school children don't know about these wars---why do you suppose it is more important to teach about the French/English and the Battle of Hastings in 1066 than WWII in the mid 20th century? Oh yes, we have had other police actions and brush fire wars---Korea and Vietnam being the more notable ones. Had I chose to make these remarks a short year ago, I would not have been cognizant of the war we are now engaged in---seems like it has been longer than that---probably to the Americans in the field, it seems like an eternity---for those lives already sacrificed, it is an eternity. There was a new concept in this war whereby the news medial personnel was 'embedded' with the troops on the ground. It got close up and personal at times---I believe for the most part, it served its purpose---the term 'firefight' took on a new meaning for most observers---live ammo was being used, not on a Hollywood sound stage, but right there in the boondocks---those litter bearers, when they were hustling off with a wounded warrior, was really tending a 'sucking chest wound', severed limbs, and invaded entrails. That black smoke was not from a bunch of orchard smudge pots used for filming effects, but a T-34 Iraqi tank incinerating its 'reluctant to abandon ship', crew----and too, the grimy oil smoke of those burning Bradley Fighting Vehicles of the Americans--- holes punched thru the armor plate by a Russian/Chinese RPG, killing or wounding the Americans inside with molten metal fragments generated by the detonation. It sure seems to me that it has been a longer war than what it has---rotation dates are being established---I believe Field Commanders like General Sanchez, are afraid or at least reluctant to request more "BOOTS ON THE GROUND". The SECDEF and his cohorts including Paul Wolfowitz, fired a General at the beginning of the conflict when that general remarked 200,000 troops would be needed---. Yes my fellow Americans, we must not forget---each time a day is set aside to remember our Veterans, just don't make it a 'day off' but a day of real dedication---tell your children and grandchildren about these terrible wars and those who had to step up to the line in the sand---they will listen to you and ask you questions---lots of times when they might ask, "why did we have to go to war", tell them if you know the answer--some of those answers might even include the response, "BEATS THE HELL OUT'A ME"!!!! Wilborn __________________ -->

11-10-2003, 09:51 AM	#2
Marlin TFF Admin Staff Chief Counselor Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: At SouthernMoss' side forever! Contributor Posts: 13,853	Couldn't agree more, Chief. When I was a kid in Kensington, Connecticut, Armistice Day was a very solemn affair with a parade, Fife & Drum Corps, and much prayer at the bewitching hour, 1100, at a fine memorial near my home church. Armistice Day was not only a day off from school, it was a day of remembrance and prayer and each was expected to show the proper respect for its true meaning. It will always be Armistice Day to me and I have never gotten used to Veterans Day, although I do realize why it was changed by name. However, the name change should not have changed the solemnity of the day nor the reason for celebrating the day. Unfortunately, this has come about with the destruction of values that started after WWII and continues on a fast moving rush today. Thanks for reminding us. __________________ *The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing.* *The only criminal class native to the United States is Congress.*

11-11-2003, 12:14 AM	#3
Hope 69/70 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 2,549	Chief, perhaps the reason the children don't know about such history is.............maybe the teacher doesn't either. Hope __________________ WAC - HQ. USARV / G1, Long Binh - Feb 69 - Feb 70

11-11-2003, 04:12 AM	#4
rooter VMBB Senior Chief Of Staff Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Marty Robbins old hometown, Glendale Arizona--a suburb of Phoenix. Contributor Posts: 9,272	Your statement of the teachers not caring is well deliberated at times---more than just a few of the colleges have professors teaching who are decidely 'left' and 'liberal', calling the shots. To hear some of them rant and rave, you can't help but wonder how much rubs off on their students. Every time Chris Matthews takes his HARDBALL program onto the campus, and you listen to these students, one cannot help feel the failling of any degree of patroitism or sense of loyalty to the young students country. Chief __________________