Easier to shoot accurately? Tomcat vs. .45

[Woodman]

Hello, all.

My dilemma...I've wanted a .45 since getting a 40S&W, and I now have two. A Colt 01091 (1991 Gov't Stainless 5") and a Para CCW7 .

But the Tomcat .32 just acquired is shooting more accurately. Quick eight round groups right on target. It seems I can never miss with this little Beretta.

I would figure I'd be more accurate with the 5" and 4.25" barrels (of the .45's) vs. the 2.5" Tomcat.

Is it that I have not found the "sweet spot" in the sights of the .45's? The round is so much more powerful than the .32ACP that I have trouble seeing exactly where impact occurs, where as with the .32, everything seems an open book.

Just tell me, do I need to spend more time with my .45's? Or perhaps I found a gun/caliber combination that works well for me?

Also, what casual target ammo would you suggest for the .45's? FMJ is what I stick with on those guns.

R/

J.

[45Smashemflat]

Are we talking rapid fire here?

The diff may be your reaction to recoil - more accurately, your recovery from recoil. Stick with 230FMJ - it removes variables from the equation. Start with slow fire drills and get your basics down - accuracy first, speed will come on its own.

[Woodman]

I am just about through my American Eagle FMJ 230 gr. Some of the brass didn't seem to like the breech of the Para.
It is either break-in or slightly out-of-tolerance cheap ammo.

I'm not firing the .45 quickly, just poorly. It seems the Tomcat is easier to sight. Maybe what it is, is that the smaller caliber is easier to shoot...

[gpostal]

i have read several complaint lately about ae ammo ,with kimbers and wilsons

i have 3 .45's ,but i feel more deadly with my .22 buckmark ,at least for now anyway ,if i can get back to practice i will have no problem with doing with my wilson what i can do with my .22

[Woodman]

So, I'm not ready for reloading, but I don't want to spend a fortune on .45 ammo. And I still want to shoot a hundred rounds of it a week.

And I love my Buckmark, too. When I got it sighted in, after 1500 rounds, I was AMAZED at what it can do.

Ah, I'm starting to see...smaller caliber...easier to control...more relaxed?

But my Colt 40S&W shot way better than my .380...so, this analogy doesn't exactly stand up.

[Shooter45]

Woodman, have a friend watch you shoot to see if you are flinching.

Then let us know.

The 1911 should be more accurate than the Tom Cat.

[gpostal]

try this target

http://www.tackdriver.com/pix0703/correction.jpg

[Woodman]

I shot well at CCW "firearms safety class". In fact, the instructor asked if I shot a lot, which I do. I have a tendancy to drop the barrel halfway into the mag ; overall, I was shooting my best, since I know I had eight hours to kill, the targets and range time were "free", as included, and my Colt had just gotten a factory trigger job.

I need to "see" the target I am shooting, not the sights. Sometimes it seems the sights are blocking by view of the target.

[Woodman]

gpostal - that target is for real, right?

You are not pulling my leg, like the time someone was going bear hunting and asked me if I wanted to make some money as a "bear chaser"?

[inplanotx]

I learned on that target and it is very accurate in what you are doing wrong. Use it. You will improve 100%.

[Xracer]

Woodman......I think that you're trying to shoot the .45 the same way you shoot the .32.

With the .32, you can fight the recoil.....with a .45 you've got to let it recoil! If you're trying to fight the recoil of a .45, you're gripping it wrong and probably flinching.

Try this (I assume you're right handed).....aim your .45 with your right hand......grasp your right wrist with your left hand....we want to keep that right wrist absolutely locked and straight. Slowly squeeze the trigger. When the gun fires, let it recoil upward with the wrist locked and and using the elbows as a pivot point. Then, with the wrist still locked, lower it back to the target using the elbows as a pivot point, aim, and fire again.

Buy some snap caps and practice dry firing the .45 this way.

Remember.....locked wrist.....loose elbows.

After a while, this method will be second nature to you and you won't have to grasp your right wrist with the left hand.

My favorite shooting position with an M1911 is to cup my left hand under my right hand.......but remember, you've got to keep that right wrist locked and let the gun "rock and roll".

[Marlin]

I presume the opposite is true for southpaws?

SoMo and I both are left handed and that sounds like real good advice. We regularly shoot the Borwning Hi-Power Practical 9mm and will be doing the same with my new Springfield Mil-Spec. Even with her very small hands she is able to handle the Browning well and by comparison the Springfield grip is the same size so I suspect she'll handle it well, also.

[Woodman]

Alright, I will give it a try. Makes sense, and I know I have not used a consistent grip. And am probably fighting the recoil.

I'm just about out of American Eagle 230 gr. and am going to buy Fiocchi, S&B, and PMC FMJ 230 gr, 150 of each, and try those.

I've liked the AE in the other calibers, but they do not feed right in the Para. The case seems a hair...off? It might be the gun, and break-in, but I've been told before to move up to a better plinking ammo for the .45

[Woodman]

And Thank you All !!

[Txquadhunter]

theres also another thing to check out. how does the .32 fit in your hand vs. the .45? look to see where your trigger finger sets on the trigger of the .32 vs. the .45. your trigger finger should set between the ball of your finger and the first joint of your finger. if it sets to far to the left or right of your finger it'll cause you to pull more to the left or right as you pull the trigger.

[Woodman]

Thanks, gpostal for the target. I'm getting some success with single hand firing, arm out, feet one front, one back; after cleaning, I did some dry-firing.

It seems, at hammer drop, a pull a shade to the left.

Also, I notice I still can't figure out the correct way to look at-or-thru sights on a handgun. It always seems I shoot too low when using the sights on most guns, but sometimes I'll get the right pitch to pull the gun "up" a bit on the front, placing the front site a considerable amount higher than the rear sight. I always figured the sights would be "straight on", but I sometimes hear of people "filing their sights", perhaps lowering their front sight? Is this normal?

Are the sights set up for 50 yards or 50' when one commonly buy's a handgun? Any ideas out there? Some brands aim a little high? Others lower?

I'm target and point-shooting at 15' to 50' on the '45.

Thanks again!!

[gpostal]

Most handguns are set up for 25 yards

Here is how I line my sights ,each gun usually has a different point of aim ,hopefully it will only be up and down , not side to side

I mainly focus at the same point on the rear sight of every gun {by focus I mean point of aim}

Then when you use another gun ,keep your same focus on the rear sight ,and then you lock this into your shooting style ,when you shoot another gun ,you will start at the same point of aim at the rear sight {there are some guns that exceptions will be made}

Now each gun you will have to shoot a round or two ,to see with the front sight how it lines up with the point of aim with the rear sight ,it works for me very well , I have a S&W 1 5/8 inch barrel at 25 yrds my front sight point of aim is almost at the bottom of the sight


Its early I’m still asleep ,hope I said this right

Of course there are some guys here that have had training in the subject

[Woodman]

Encouraging...

I'm kicking up too much dirt (targets are on an old log),

I can place where I want with smaller calibers, but I've gotta obey a few extra rules when shooting 45ACP.

More practice.

[Crpdeth]

Gpostal, what does "too little trigger finger" mean to me? I only use the tip of my finger... This is the way I learned to shoot, so I always shoot this way, but at 20- 25 yards, with the .45 when I miss, this is the area I miss in...Also I see that according to the target, I am "tightening fingers" which I agree with...I always keep a good tight grip.

Thanks for the target, I saw one of these at the indoor range last time I was there, but its about 100 mi from here so I haven't taken the chance to go back, but I've been wanting one lately.

~Crp

[Woodman]

[QUOTE]I have a S&W 1 5/8 inch barrel at 25 yrds my front sight point of aim is almost at the bottom of the sightQUOTE]

Now, my Tomcat is the opposite. The fixed front sight is 'way up above the rear sight.

I've got the Para all cleaned up, six mags loaded, another 50+ rounds, all packed in my shooting bag, ready to grab and run at the first moment.

This is one problem I'm going to lick in the bud. Everybody and their brother talks about shooting '45's like it was clipping coupons, but I STILL feel the sights are "in the way". After this next trip, I might remove them.

Para sent (free) used sights (from the NS conversions they do) so I can mill down the rear sight to fill the dovetail and keep the top of the slide nice and .. even.