ammo shortage - The Firearms Forum

fedupdon · 03-09-2009, 01:38 PM

thought you would like to here why my local walmart says the are out of ammo the sporting good manager told me that there were two reasons
1 the war all ammo makers are under contract and cannot keep up the demand i replied that was the best bulls*** answer i had heard
2 store afarid of the 500% tax increase that is susposed to passed in the next mo did not have a come back for that one so can any one shed any light on this

SaddleSarge · 03-09-2009, 02:01 PM

Because everyone's buying in advance of additional regulations aimed at ammo:

"Encoded Ammunition"/Bullet Serialization
(From the NRA/ILA Website)

"Encoded Ammunition" (Bullet and Cartridge Case Serialization) Means:

* Forfeiture of Currently-Owned Ammunition

* A Separate Registration for Every Box of New Ammunition

* Outrageously Expensive Ammunition Costs for Police & Private Citizens Alike

*A Waste of Taxpayer Money, Better Spent on Traditional Police Programs

In 2007, the sponsor of "encoded ammunition" legislation in Maryland urged lawmakers across the country to introduce the same kind of legislation in their states. The bill would require ammunition manufacturers to engrave a serial number on "the base of the bullet and the inside of the cartridge casing of each round" of ammunition for popular sporting caliber center-fire rifles, all center-fire pistols, all .22 rimfire rifles and pistols, and all 12 gauge shotguns.

Reasons to Strenuously Oppose This Legislation

People would be required to forfeit all personally-owned non-encoded ammunition. After a certain date, it would be illegal to possess non-encoded ammunition. Gun owners possess hundreds of millions of rounds of ammunition for target shooting, hunting and personal protection. Consider that American manufacturers produce 8 billion rounds each year.

Reloading (re-using cartridge cases multiple times) would be abolished. There would be no way to correspond serial numbers on cartridge cases, and different sets and quantities of bullets.

People would be required to separately register every box of "encoded ammunition." This information would be supplied to the police. Most states do not even require registration of guns. Each box of ammunition would have a unique serial number, thus a separate registration.

Private citizens would have to maintain records, if they sold ammunition to anyone, including family members or friends.

The cost of ammunition would soar, for police and private citizens alike. The Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturing Institute estimates it would take three weeks to produce ammunition currently produced in a single day. For reason of cost, manufacturers would produce only ultra-expensive encoded ammunition, which police would have to buy, just like everyone else.

A tax of five cents a round would be imposed on private citizens, not only upon initial sale, but every time the ammunition changes hands thereafter.

Shotgun ammunition cannot be engraved. Shotgun pellets are too small to be individually engraved. Shotgun cartridge cases are made of plastic, which would be difficult to engrave.

Criminals could beat the system. A large percentage of criminals' ammunition (and guns) is stolen. Criminals could also collect ammunition cases from shooting ranges, and reload them with molten lead bullets made without serial numbers.

Congress eliminated a similar requirement in the 1980s, because there was no law enforcement benefit. Federal law had required purchasers of handgun ammunition to sign a ledger, but Congress repealed that requirement in 1983 (.22 rimfire) and 1986 (center-fire handguns), because it burdened purchasers, vendors and police, with no law enforcement benefit.

Vladimir · 03-09-2009, 02:23 PM

The war has influenced I I think. I suspect war means we go through a lot more ammunition, and last time I checked... the military wasn't reloading their own ammo!

But like all things, no one single answer provides the whole truth.

358 winchester · 03-09-2009, 02:30 PM

it is simple control the ammo and you control the guns

I told you several years ago to start stocking up

chemfantry · 03-09-2009, 02:35 PM

358 you are right on. I have been stocking up since the clinton days. like my pops says...."when the SHTF, its all about beans and bullets. i have more bullets, so i will take your beans."

jacksonco · 03-09-2009, 03:43 PM

Sarge you pretty well put to paper perfectly the most effective method that the gun grabbers can use to neutralize the private citizens armory. Good job and good post!

bcj1755 · 03-09-2009, 04:35 PM

I just had a thought on this. Ok, the ammo companies have gov't contracts for military supplies. I'm just wondering if the gov't has been increasing the size of their contracts lately. If they are, I see it serving three purposes. One, keeping the military supplied. That's most important and I have absolutely no problem with that. If amo that I would be using at the range instead goes to a soldier and helps saves his life, then it's worth it. Two, decreasing the supply available for civilians, thereby decreasing the effectivness of an armed rebellion against Barry's socialist policies and later making it easier to confiscate empty guns. If we have no ammo, we cannot effectively rise up against Barry. Three, ensuring a ready supply of ammo for Barry's Gestapo...er...I mean NKVD....um...I mean National Security Force. These people will be the ones kicking in doors to takes our guns for the greater glory of Barry. And if they have all the ammo, then that makes their job a lot easier.

paulrw · 03-09-2009, 05:13 PM

Guess I got really lucky. A friend and I each bought .45acp ammo at a local Wal-Mart in the Phoenix, AZ area. Just over $32 for 100 rounds of Winchester 230 gr FMJ!!! It's just a bit more than what we pay for no-name ammo at the local shooting range. Wish we could have bought more.

358 winchester · 03-09-2009, 05:16 PM

Oh I would say that just as a guess I might could hold out for a few ye a little while
chemfantry sir you are welcome tocome to my house bring your supplies but don't bank on getting my beans without a good gas mask

chemfantry · 03-09-2009, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 358 winchester

Oh I would say that just as a guess I might could hold out for a few ye a little while
chemfantry sir you are welcome tocome to my house bring your supplies but don't bank on getting my beans without a good gas mask

358, I tend to ally myself with like minded individuals. And yes, I do have a M40A1 protective mask., with several C2A1 Canisters and JSLIST suits to boot. But not to worry, as I would prefer to seek out liberals just to show them the errors in their ways.

CJ7365 · 03-09-2009, 05:50 PM

My local wallymart, finally had some remington 223 ammo, but $23.99 for 50 rounds I said you can keep it!!, they only had about 5 boxes left.

coyote 270 · 03-09-2009, 05:57 PM

Couple of things here: Law Enforement agencies have been "gearing up" for a couple of years, Swat Team, Homeland Security teams, etc, etc. Alot of ammo and firearms have gone there. Also, the company that has "Invented" the ammunition encoding machines to do all this supposidely (sp) "serialization of ammo" have invested millions to get all the states to pass these bills. I really, sincerely, positively, 100% hope they go broke very soon.

questor · 03-09-2009, 06:07 PM

Check out http://horandy.com and you will see the following statement..

**ATTENTION** Due to unprecedented sales, any factory direct retail ammunition and bullet orders may take 4 to 6 months to ship.

questor · 03-09-2009, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CJ7365

My local wallymart, finally had some remington 223 ammo, but $23.99 for 50 rounds I said you can keep it!!, they only had about 5 boxes left.

Bass Pro shop: 20 rounds of Remington .223 for $9.99 = $.49 per round. . The $23.99 = $.47 per round.. You passed up a good deal...

CJ7365 · 03-09-2009, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by questor

Bass Pro shop: 20 rounds of Remington .223 for $9.99 = $.49 per round. . The $23.99 = $.47 per round.. You passed up a good deal...

Just received my 1000 rounds of PMC last week from Palmetto $362.00 shipped=$.36 a round

glocknut · 03-09-2009, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 358 winchester

it is simple control the ammo and you control the guns

I told you several years ago to start stocking up

That's the same idea as "if you control the money, you control the nation" mentality.

We are sooo overdue for a Revolution!!!!!!!!!!!

mike
gn

glocknut · 03-09-2009, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coyote 270

Also, the company that has "Invented" the ammunition encoding machines to do all this supposidely (sp) "serialization of ammo" have invested millions to get all the states to pass these bills. I really, sincerely, positively, 100% hope they go broke very soon.

Or an "alternative" would suit me just fine...

mike
gn

ponycar17 · 03-09-2009, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vladimir

The war has influenced I I think. I suspect war means we go through a lot more ammunition, and last time I checked... the military wasn't reloading their own ammo!

But like all things, no one single answer provides the whole truth.

The war caused the ammo prices to increase over the past several years but I had no trouble finding anything I wanted before November 4, 2008. I bought bit before then and it's a good thing. I can't find squat now. It was nothing to order from http://www.georgia-arms.com and get the package in 2-3 days. Now, it's 2 weeks or more. They manufacture their own ammo, and have no military contracts. They say that due to the huge increase in demand recently, to expect as much as 5-7 weeks delivery. AK ammo could be purchased and delivered in a week before from Cheaperthandirt.com or those pathetic losers at Sportsmansguide.com. Now, it's several weeks to months IF you can find it. I've NEVER had a problem finding CCI .22 mini-mag ammo. Now, it's sold out at WalMarts and online retailers alike. And to my knowledge CCI rimfire isn't used in the war effort...

It's funny though... Everyone thought I was irrational buying up a lot before the election. One ditz at Wal-Mart grinned sarcastically and asked me, "so you're one of the ones that's been comin' in here who's going to war, huh?"... I said, "no, just trying to get it while I can..." Turns out, I was right. He probably realizes that now.

Ok, rant off... Sorry, it's just annoying having to plan what ammo to buy because it can't be had quickly any more.

lb969 · 03-09-2009, 08:10 PM

Quote:

The war has influenced I I think. I suspect war means we go through a lot more ammunition, and last time I checked... the military wasn't reloading their own ammo!

That is why I propose...

Operation Desert Screen!

Just imagine all the ammo and other cool stuff you could find if we went and sifted Iraq/Afghanastan?

Its mostly sand anyways so it'd be easy. And you could make these giant sand sifting combines to comb the desert!

bcj1755 · 03-09-2009, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ponycar17

Ok, rant off... Sorry, it's just annoying having to plan what ammo to buy because it can't be had quickly any more.

You plan when you buy ammo now? I can't. My ammo purchases are usually spur of the moment purchases because I happen to luck out and find some ammo in stock somewhere. The only exception is when I go to one particular gun store every week and buy a couple boxes of Fiochi 7.62x39 because it's the only place I can still find lead core AK ammo around here.

darren · 03-10-2009, 02:39 AM

Hello, I am not a gun owner and I joined this forum out of despiration for information. I hope none of you mind.

I quickly found this thread here and hope someone can rest my mind today.

I buy empty Winchester 22 Hornet casings and make microphones out of them. I am a small business owner and my only employee. Been in biz since 1998. I am now out of casings and to my horror can't find any online.

Someone mentioned some impending law. When is this due to pass? I just need a few bags of 100 casings just to tide me over until I can find another source for what I need.

Is this a temporary shortage or should I loose sleep over it?

Without these casings I and my business are royally screwed!

SaddleSarge · 03-10-2009, 03:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darren

Hello, I am not a gun owner and I joined this forum out of despiration for information. I hope none of you mind.

I quickly found this thread here and hope someone can rest my mind today.

I buy empty Winchester 22 Hornet casings and make microphones out of them. I am a small business owner and my only employee. Been in biz since 1998. I am now out of casings and to my horror can't find any online.

Someone mentioned some impending law. When is this due to pass? I just need a few bags of 100 casings just to tide me over until I can find another source for what I need.

Is this a temporary shortage or should I loose sleep over it?

Without these casings I and my business are royally screwed!

Darren, these things have not yet come to pass, but....are being discussed in liberal, democrat, arenas where they would like for these things to become law and disregard the rights of honest citizens in the name of, "safety."

I believe this is a temporary shortage and when the manufacturers are able to replenish the supplies, things will get back to normal at some point as supply/demand stabalizes.

358 winchester · 03-10-2009, 05:13 AM

You may be right Sarge but at what PRICE and how much TAX ?

SaddleSarge · 03-10-2009, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 358 winchester

You may be right Sarge but at what PRICE and how much TAX ?

I've been wondering that too... say if Hornady (or others) may make their profit now before being forced out of business due to a government depressed and limited market (taxes/restrictions)?

darren · 03-10-2009, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SaddleSarge

Darren, these things have not yet come to pass, but....are being discussed in liberal, democrat, arenas where they would like for these things to become law and disregard the rights of honest citizens in the name of, "safety."

I believe this is a temporary shortage and when the manufacturers are able to replenish the supplies, things will get back to normal at some point as supply/demand stabalizes.

Thank you for the information.

I didn't sleep well at all last night and am heading to Gander Mountain to see if any bags are hanging on the hook and will order the Remington version of the same case today. at least I'll have a year supply that way.

I just got this email from Midway USA.

Thank you for your email. We are currently out of stock and not taking backorders. We are hoping to have more in tentatively between now and the middle of next month. Winchester has asked us not to take backorders because they are having a hard time keeping up.

03-09-2009, 01:38 PM	#1
fedupdon V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 307	ammo shortage thought you would like to here why my local walmart says the are out of ammo the sporting good manager told me that there were two reasons 1 the war all ammo makers are under contract and cannot keep up the demand i replied that was the best bulls*** answer i had heard 2 store afarid of the 500% tax increase that is susposed to passed in the next mo did not have a come back for that one so can any one shed any light on this -->

03-09-2009, 02:01 PM	#2
SaddleSarge Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1,025	Re: ammo shortage Because everyone's buying in advance of additional regulations aimed at ammo: "Encoded Ammunition"/Bullet Serialization (From the NRA/ILA Website) "Encoded Ammunition" (Bullet and Cartridge Case Serialization) Means: * Forfeiture of Currently-Owned Ammunition * A Separate Registration for Every Box of New Ammunition * Outrageously Expensive Ammunition Costs for Police & Private Citizens Alike A Waste of Taxpayer Money, Better Spent on Traditional Police Programs In 2007, the sponsor of "encoded ammunition" legislation in Maryland urged lawmakers across the country to introduce the same kind of legislation in their states. The bill would require ammunition manufacturers to engrave a serial number on "the base of the bullet and the inside of the cartridge casing of each round" of ammunition for popular sporting caliber center-fire rifles, all center-fire pistols, all .22 rimfire rifles and pistols, and all 12 gauge shotguns. Reasons to Strenuously Oppose This Legislation People would be required to forfeit all personally-owned non-encoded ammunition. After a certain date, it would be illegal to possess non-encoded ammunition. Gun owners possess hundreds of millions of rounds of ammunition for target shooting, hunting and personal protection. Consider that American manufacturers produce 8 billion rounds each year. Reloading (re-using cartridge cases multiple times) would be abolished. There would be no way to correspond serial numbers on cartridge cases, and different sets and quantities of bullets. People would be required to separately register every box of "encoded ammunition." This information would be supplied to the police. Most states do not even require registration of guns. Each box of ammunition would have a unique serial number, thus a separate registration. Private citizens would have to maintain records, if they sold ammunition to anyone, including family members or friends. The cost of ammunition would soar, for police and private citizens alike. The Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturing Institute estimates it would take three weeks to produce ammunition currently produced in a single day. For reason of cost, manufacturers would produce only ultra-expensive encoded ammunition, which police would have to buy, just like everyone else. A tax of five cents a round would be imposed on private citizens, not only upon initial sale, but every time the ammunition changes hands thereafter. Shotgun ammunition cannot be engraved. Shotgun pellets are too small to be individually engraved. Shotgun cartridge cases are made of plastic, which would be difficult to engrave. Criminals could beat the system. A large percentage of criminals' ammunition (and guns) is stolen. Criminals could also collect ammunition cases from shooting ranges, and reload them with molten lead bullets made without serial numbers. Congress eliminated a similar requirement in the 1980s, because there was no law enforcement benefit. Federal law had required purchasers of handgun ammunition to sign a ledger, but Congress repealed that requirement in 1983 (.22 rimfire) and 1986 (center-fire handguns), because it burdened purchasers, vendors and police, with no law enforcement benefit. Last edited by SaddleSarge; 03-10-2009 at 02:48 AM..*

03-09-2009, 02:23 PM	#3
Vladimir Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Issaquah WA Posts: 3,558	Re: ammo shortage The war has influenced I I think. I suspect war means we go through a lot more ammunition, and last time I checked... the military wasn't reloading their own ammo! But like all things, no one single answer provides the whole truth. __________________ -JVRR меня зовут Владимир или Джеймс. Я знаю только немного русский язык (я американец, но мой пра дедушка русски). STEAM (CSS, TF2, etc): Ask me! Xbox LIVE! GT: "Vlad is Rad" PS3 PSN: "Vlad_Is_Rad"

03-09-2009, 02:30 PM	#4
358 winchester TFF Admin Staff Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Pensacola Fl. area Posts: 7,335	Re: ammo shortage it is simple control the ammo and you control the guns I told you several years ago to start stocking up __________________ Administrator & Owner RangeDay.com Proud, White, Heterosexual, Gun Owning, Southern American, Christian. Any question about where I stand?

03-09-2009, 02:35 PM	#5
chemfantry V.I.P. Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Ft. Campbell, KY Posts: 305	Re: ammo shortage 358 you are right on. I have been stocking up since the clinton days. like my pops says...."when the SHTF, its all about beans and bullets. i have more bullets, so i will take your beans." __________________ Sancte Michael Archangele, defende nos in proelio.

03-09-2009, 03:43 PM	#6
jacksonco Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Jackson County West Virginia Posts: 2,237	Re: ammo shortage Sarge you pretty well put to paper perfectly the most effective method that the gun grabbers can use to neutralize the private citizens armory. Good job and good post!

03-09-2009, 04:35 PM	#7
bcj1755 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: A wretched hive of scum and villiany Posts: 4,357	Re: ammo shortage I just had a thought on this. Ok, the ammo companies have gov't contracts for military supplies. I'm just wondering if the gov't has been increasing the size of their contracts lately. If they are, I see it serving three purposes. One, keeping the military supplied. That's most important and I have absolutely no problem with that. If amo that I would be using at the range instead goes to a soldier and helps saves his life, then it's worth it. Two, decreasing the supply available for civilians, thereby decreasing the effectivness of an armed rebellion against Barry's socialist policies and later making it easier to confiscate empty guns. If we have no ammo, we cannot effectively rise up against Barry. Three, ensuring a ready supply of ammo for Barry's Gestapo...er...I mean NKVD....um...I mean National Security Force. These people will be the ones kicking in doors to takes our guns for the greater glory of Barry. And if they have all the ammo, then that makes their job a lot easier. __________________ History is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace, and revolution continue on forever. Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges - Cicero If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen. - Samuel Adams

03-09-2009, 05:13 PM	#8
paulrw Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 22	Re: ammo shortage Guess I got really lucky. A friend and I each bought .45acp ammo at a local Wal-Mart in the Phoenix, AZ area. Just over $32 for 100 rounds of Winchester 230 gr FMJ!!! It's just a bit more than what we pay for no-name ammo at the local shooting range. Wish we could have bought more.

03-09-2009, 05:16 PM	#9
358 winchester TFF Admin Staff Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Pensacola Fl. area Posts: 7,335	Re: ammo shortage Oh I would say that just as a guess I might could hold out for a few ye a little while chemfantry sir you are welcome tocome to my house bring your supplies but don't bank on getting my beans without a good gas mask __________________ Administrator & Owner RangeDay.com Proud, White, Heterosexual, Gun Owning, Southern American, Christian. Any question about where I stand?

03-09-2009, 05:50 PM	#11
CJ7365 V.I.P. Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: El Paso TEXAS Posts: 65	Re: ammo shortage My local wallymart, finally had some remington 223 ammo, but $23.99 for 50 rounds I said you can keep it!!, they only had about 5 boxes left.

03-09-2009, 05:57 PM	#12
coyote 270 V.I.P. Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Wash. State Posts: 210	Re: ammo shortage Couple of things here: Law Enforement agencies have been "gearing up" for a couple of years, Swat Team, Homeland Security teams, etc, etc. Alot of ammo and firearms have gone there. Also, the company that has "Invented" the ammunition encoding machines to do all this supposidely (sp) "serialization of ammo" have invested millions to get all the states to pass these bills. I really, sincerely, positively, 100% hope they go broke very soon. __________________ Go SEAHAWKS, and take the SONICSand MARINERS with ya!!

03-09-2009, 06:07 PM	#13
questor V.I.P. Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Slickville, Pa Posts: 388	Re: ammo shortage Check out http://horandy.com and you will see the following statement.. ATTENTION Due to unprecedented sales, any factory direct retail ammunition and bullet orders may take 4 to 6 months to ship.

03-10-2009, 02:39 AM	#21
darren Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 3	Re: ammo shortage Hello, I am not a gun owner and I joined this forum out of despiration for information. I hope none of you mind. I quickly found this thread here and hope someone can rest my mind today. I buy empty Winchester 22 Hornet casings and make microphones out of them. I am a small business owner and my only employee. Been in biz since 1998. I am now out of casings and to my horror can't find any online. Someone mentioned some impending law. When is this due to pass? I just need a few bags of 100 casings just to tide me over until I can find another source for what I need. Is this a temporary shortage or should I loose sleep over it? Without these casings I and my business are royally screwed!

03-10-2009, 05:13 AM	#23
358 winchester TFF Admin Staff Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Pensacola Fl. area Posts: 7,335	Re: ammo shortage You may be right Sarge but at what PRICE and how much TAX ? __________________ Administrator & Owner RangeDay.com Proud, White, Heterosexual, Gun Owning, Southern American, Christian. Any question about where I stand?