Vintage Colt 38 rimless - The Firearms Forum

Jackman · 09-25-2010, 01:29 PM

Okay I have a automatic Colt 38 rimless smokeless ,patent dates April 26, 1897 and Sept 9 ,1902, is in very nice shape I took it to a gun shop checked out good he gave me a source for ammo at 50 dollars a box ,38 APC,,,, can I use this old firm arm as a regular shooter or does the vintage stats make a regular shooter a bad choice?

zb338 · 09-25-2010, 02:07 PM

At $50 bucks a box I doubt if you will shoot
it enough to break it. If the gunsmith says
it's O. K. then have fun. The only thing that
might stop you is collector value preventing
you from shooting for fear of parts breakage.
Zeke

Jackman · 09-25-2010, 02:15 PM

No doubt the ammo cost is a factor but if I buy 4 boxes 40 per box I could blow through that in an afternoon might have to get in to reloading to solve the cost factor, really just wondering about the reliability of a 100 year old firearm being used after a long long nap.

Alpo · 09-25-2010, 02:41 PM

They made 1902s up through 1929. I have, and fire, several guns that were made prior to 1930, and have no worries about shooting them.

Jim K · 09-25-2010, 05:57 PM

DO NOT, repeat, DO NOT, fire .38 Super in that gun. The old .38 ACP and the .38 Super are dimensionally identical, but the latter is much more powerful and will damage that old gun.

You have one of the 1902 models or the 1903 hammer model. Some of those guns are quite valuable and probably should not be fired because of the possibility of damage.

Pictures or a full description of the gun and the markings will be needed to provide more info.

Jim

Jackman · 09-25-2010, 06:26 PM

I will try to post some pics,its serial #35957 and has a hammer.

Alpo · 09-25-2010, 08:18 PM

35957 was made in 1913. Probably December, since 36000 was the first gun in 1914.

As Jim said, 38 Super will fit, feed and fire. And your gun (and maybe your hand) will be in very sad shape. One of Colt's more stupid ideas.

38 ACP is out there, but it is hard to find. If you or a friend reloads, you can make some, using 38 Super brass and dies.

Jim K · 09-26-2010, 09:19 PM

One more safety point. Make certain the slide lock (that is what Colt called that wedge at the front that holds the slide on) is in place properly. If the gun is fired without it, the slide will come off and back into the shooter's face. Not one of Browning's better ideas; the Army made him change it in the Model 1911.

Jim

Jackman · 10-03-2010, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim K

One more safety point. Make certain the slide lock (that is what Colt called that wedge at the front that holds the slide on) is in place properly. If the gun is fired without it, the slide will come off and back into the shooter's face. Not one of Browning's better ideas; the Army made him change it in the Model 1911.

Jim

That little wedge is a bear to get back in , I got it in right and fired the gun for the first time only 9 rounds ,I like it seems like a nice pistol ,same day I also fired my 1911 also for the first time we put a 120 rounds thru it its a nice pistol but its hard to understand how the 1911 is the replacement for the 1902 its bigger heavier and hard to hit the side of a barn at 20 yrds I do like the 1902 better...

fleetwood1976 · 10-03-2010, 11:45 PM

I have a 1903 pocket hammer that I used to carry, very accurate. I did not even know it was such a collectors piece untill i went to look for ammo for it. I lucked into some for about $6 a box about 10 years ago and bought all they had, about 7 boxes.

Jim K · 10-04-2010, 01:59 PM

"a bear to get back in"

It should drop right in. That comment makes me wonder if you understand that you have to push in on the front of the takedown plug (the concave plug under the muzzle) before removing or inserting the slide lock. The two parts are interlocked and if you don't do that, you can damage the slide lock and/or the takedown plug.

Also, the slide lock has a little "tit" that fits into a small notch in the slide; if that is not in right, the lock will be in the wrong position and also can be damaged or come out.

Jim

Jackman · 10-04-2010, 07:37 PM

Jim ,I have it right like you said,,,,,,,,,, maybe my spring is too tight cause pushing down on that plug to make the room for the wedge is the bear part,,,,,its really tight and hard to do on my .38....... Does that sound normal to you, this gun is from the family tree and has not been fired in 50 or more years so anything is possible but the gunsmith said is was good to go shooting

?.....

Jackman · 10-07-2010, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alpo

35957 was made in 1913. Probably December, since 36000 was the first gun in 1914.

As Jim said, 38 Super will fit, feed and fire. And your gun (and maybe your hand) will be in very sad shape. One of Colt's more stupid ideas.

38 ACP is out there, but it is hard to find. If you or a friend reloads, you can make some, using 38 Super brass and dies.

Alpo,

Where can I find that serial number info?

Anyone know if I have a civilian or military model?

Thanks Jack

Jim K · 10-08-2010, 01:21 PM

Pushing in on the takedown plug shouldn't be that hard, less difficult than pushing in on the recoil spring plug of a Model 1911. If it is really stiff, maybe there is crud in there or something else is wrong.

Jim

Alpo · 10-08-2010, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jackman

Alpo,

Where can I find that serial number info?

Anyone know if I have a civilian or military model?

Thanks Jack

http://proofhouse.com/

Jackman · 09-13-2011, 04:56 AM

Okay this is an old thread but I have learned pic posting (sort of) so bring it back up for comments. I have been told this is a 1903 pocket hammer model anyone have info on that name I don't see were the term pocket comes from

. This gun is a pleasure to shoot

more so than my WWI 1911...

Bindernut · 09-13-2011, 09:08 AM

Yes, that's a 1903 Pocket Hammer model.
The Pocket refers to it being a shorter version of the 1902 Sporting Model.
The Pocket Hammer naming is to distinguish it from Colt's other 1903 model, the Model M or Pocket Hammerless, which is a compact .32ACP or .380ACP.

From your picture, it sure looks like it's still the original finish. This would put it up near the top end of the price range and desirable to collectors.

Personally, I'm kinda glad to see folks enjoying these rare old guns with some time at the range.
I don't know if I would make a regular habit of shooting it for fear of breaking parts that are hard to find anymore, but I sure wouldn't let it collect dust in the safe either.

Jackman · 09-15-2011, 09:19 PM

Thanks for the ID help

and I agree it looks like the original finish. I doubt this gun got shot very much just went to the office just in case a bad guy showed up , I can't bear the thought of not shooting this gun but I am in the market for a modern 1911 to take the pressure off these old ones

Brisk44 · 09-15-2011, 09:25 PM

That is in beautiful shape. WOW

Jackman · 09-15-2011, 09:49 PM

Thanks , I really really like this one shoots nice and smooth and just feels right.

09-25-2010, 01:29 PM	#1
Jackman V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 446	Vintage Colt 38 rimless Okay I have a automatic Colt 38 rimless smokeless ,patent dates April 26, 1897 and Sept 9 ,1902, is in very nice shape I took it to a gun shop checked out good he gave me a source for ammo at 50 dollars a box ,38 APC,,,, can I use this old firm arm as a regular shooter or does the vintage stats make a regular shooter a bad choice? -->

09-25-2010, 02:07 PM	#2
zb338 V.I.P. Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Recently moved to Pennsylvania. Posts: 286	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless At $50 bucks a box I doubt if you will shoot it enough to break it. If the gunsmith says it's O. K. then have fun. The only thing that might stop you is collector value preventing you from shooting for fear of parts breakage. Zeke

09-25-2010, 02:41 PM	#4
Alpo Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: NW Florida Posts: 8,658	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless They made 1902s up through 1929. I have, and fire, several guns that were made prior to 1930, and have no worries about shooting them. __________________ Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy, and taste good with catsup - George of Lod, Year of Our Lord 297 I always take precautions. Beware the Evil Bullet Fairies.

09-25-2010, 05:57 PM	#5
Jim K Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 6,408	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless DO NOT, repeat, DO NOT, fire .38 Super in that gun. The old .38 ACP and the .38 Super are dimensionally identical, but the latter is much more powerful and will damage that old gun. You have one of the 1902 models or the 1903 hammer model. Some of those guns are quite valuable and probably should not be fired because of the possibility of damage. Pictures or a full description of the gun and the markings will be needed to provide more info. Jim

09-25-2010, 06:26 PM	#6
Jackman V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 446	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless I will try to post some pics,its serial #35957 and has a hammer.

09-25-2010, 02:15 PM	#3
Jackman V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 446	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless No doubt the ammo cost is a factor but if I buy 4 boxes 40 per box I could blow through that in an afternoon might have to get in to reloading to solve the cost factor, really just wondering about the reliability of a 100 year old firearm being used after a long long nap.

09-25-2010, 08:18 PM	#7
Alpo Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: NW Florida Posts: 8,658	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless 35957 was made in 1913. Probably December, since 36000 was the first gun in 1914. As Jim said, 38 Super will fit, feed and fire. And your gun (and maybe your hand) will be in very sad shape. One of Colt's more stupid ideas. 38 ACP is out there, but it is hard to find. If you or a friend reloads, you can make some, using 38 Super brass and dies. __________________ Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy, and taste good with catsup - George of Lod, Year of Our Lord 297 I always take precautions. Beware the Evil Bullet Fairies.

09-26-2010, 09:19 PM	#8
Jim K Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 6,408	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless One more safety point. Make certain the slide lock (that is what Colt called that wedge at the front that holds the slide on) is in place properly. If the gun is fired without it, the slide will come off and back into the shooter's face. Not one of Browning's better ideas; the Army made him change it in the Model 1911. Jim

10-03-2010, 11:45 PM	#10
fleetwood1976 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Southern Indiana Contributor Posts: 1,333	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless I have a 1903 pocket hammer that I used to carry, very accurate. I did not even know it was such a collectors piece untill i went to look for ammo for it. I lucked into some for about $6 a box about 10 years ago and bought all they had, about 7 boxes.

10-04-2010, 01:59 PM	#11
Jim K Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 6,408	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless "a bear to get back in" It should drop right in. That comment makes me wonder if you understand that you have to push in on the front of the takedown plug (the concave plug under the muzzle) before removing or inserting the slide lock. The two parts are interlocked and if you don't do that, you can damage the slide lock and/or the takedown plug. Also, the slide lock has a little "tit" that fits into a small notch in the slide; if that is not in right, the lock will be in the wrong position and also can be damaged or come out. Jim

10-04-2010, 07:37 PM	#12
Jackman V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 446	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless Jim ,I have it right like you said,,,,,,,,,, maybe my spring is too tight cause pushing down on that plug to make the room for the wedge is the bear part,,,,,its really tight and hard to do on my .38....... Does that sound normal to you, this gun is from the family tree and has not been fired in 50 or more years so anything is possible but the gunsmith said is was good to go shooting ?.....

10-08-2010, 01:21 PM	#14
Jim K Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 6,408	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless Pushing in on the takedown plug shouldn't be that hard, less difficult than pushing in on the recoil spring plug of a Model 1911. If it is really stiff, maybe there is crud in there or something else is wrong. Jim

09-13-2011, 04:56 AM	#16
Jackman V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 446	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless Okay this is an old thread but I have learned pic posting (sort of) so bring it back up for comments. I have been told this is a 1903 pocket hammer model anyone have info on that name I don't see were the term pocket comes from. This gun is a pleasure to shoot more so than my WWI 1911...

09-13-2011, 09:08 AM	#17
Bindernut Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ND, USA Posts: 2,446	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless Yes, that's a 1903 Pocket Hammer model. The Pocket refers to it being a shorter version of the 1902 Sporting Model. The Pocket Hammer naming is to distinguish it from Colt's other 1903 model, the Model M or Pocket Hammerless, which is a compact .32ACP or .380ACP. From your picture, it sure looks like it's still the original finish. This would put it up near the top end of the price range and desirable to collectors. Personally, I'm kinda glad to see folks enjoying these rare old guns with some time at the range. I don't know if I would make a regular habit of shooting it for fear of breaking parts that are hard to find anymore, but I sure wouldn't let it collect dust in the safe either.

09-15-2011, 09:19 PM	#18
Jackman V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 446	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless Thanks for the ID help and I agree it looks like the original finish. I doubt this gun got shot very much just went to the office just in case a bad guy showed up , I can't bear the thought of not shooting this gun but I am in the market for a modern 1911 to take the pressure off these old ones

09-15-2011, 09:25 PM	#19
Brisk44 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Iowa Contributor Posts: 1,747	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless That is in beautiful shape. WOW

09-15-2011, 09:49 PM	#20
Jackman V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 446	Re: Vintage Colt 38 rimless Thanks , I really really like this one shoots nice and smooth and just feels right.