Beginner question. - The Firearms Forum

Noremac1982 · 01-25-2012, 10:10 PM

Hello everyone, I am new to this forum and also to reloading. So hello everyone. I have recently taken an interest in reloading my own ammo due to many factors. The first being that I would like to shoot more and secondly I would like to have more control over my availability of ammo. I recently ordered a lee turret press, scales, and a set of the lee deluxe 4 piece die set in 45 Colt. While making my purchase I also ordered some Oregon trail laser cast 200gr bullets in .452 diameter. I chose these because of the cost and the quantity. After some more reading I am wondering if these bullets are what I should have gotten. I went to my local gun store and looked at some reloading guides to get a little bit of a head start before mine arrives with my press. The problem is that I didn't see these bullets in any of the guides. I know this might be a simple question but will the bullets work in 45 Colt. The description didn't specify so I am wondering if I might have purchased the wrong bullets. I also have a .45 Auto so they aren't wasted I will just have to get the dies and i can use them, I think? So I guess I have a couple questions, 1) will they work for my application, plinking and target shooting? 2) since I can't find any load data, what is a comparable recipe that I can use for these if they will work? I have some bullseye powder and CCI 300 primers that I picked up locally because I didn't want to pay the extra shipping. 3) do I need a special crimping die to correctly seat the bullet? 4) would i be better off since i am a beginner to just get a bullet that is listed in my loading guide once it arrives? Any and all help will be greatly appreciated. TIA

Noremac1982 · 01-25-2012, 10:27 PM

Oh and the bullets I ordered are LSWC. Not sure if it matters but i want to give as much detail as possible so I can get the best help possible. Thanks again.

gdmoody · 01-25-2012, 10:29 PM

Welcome Noremac1982!!

I don't know which loading manual that you were looking at or which ones you have on order. The Lyman Reloading handbook # 49 has load data for a 200 grain lead bullet, so does the Hornady Manual #7, and so does Speer #14.

One word of caution on the .45 Colt loads. Most manuals will have two or three different sections listed for them. One that will say something like .45 Revolver and then a section that will say like for Ruger and T/C. If you are using an older .45, you need to use the section for Revolver. Ruger and T/C is self explanatory.

Here is a link to the Accurate powders reloading information. It does have data for a 200 grain Hornady XTP bullet but none for lead. You can use the data for the XTP but stay at the lower end of the data. http://www.accuratepowder.com/wp-con...d_data_3.5.pdf

I no longer load for .45 colt since I traded off my pistol back in November. When I did load for it I loaded 200 grain and 250 grain bullets and the .452 will work just fine in them. I would stay with .451 in the .45 auto even though the .452 lead will be fine for them too.

BETH · 01-25-2012, 10:30 PM

welcome to the forum someone might move your post to the reloading thread but i am sure someone will help u

gdmoody · 01-25-2012, 10:43 PM

I forgot to cover your questions in my post.

1. I did answer that one, YES they will work for your application

2. I kind of answered that one too. You can use the data for a 200 grain XTP bullet but stay at the lower end of the spectrum.

3. Bullseye powder is not listed in the Lyman book but it is in the Hornady and Speer and the starting weights are different. I wouldn't trust something I read on a forum anyway. I would never lead you wrong but people do make typographical errors that could be dangerous. Wait until you get your manuals.

4. The 200 grain bullets are listed so the answer to that question could be NO because it could be in your book. You need to get at least two different manuals and I suggest a Lyman #49 as one of them (three would be better).

Noremac1982 · 01-25-2012, 11:44 PM

Thanks gdmoody. The manuals I was looking at had other brands of 200 gr LSWC bullets but I thought I needed to find my specific brand in order to load it safely because the alloy's might differ and also the ballistic coefficient. I was looking for something very similar Oregon trail laser cast and the two that I found were the hornady LSWC and the Speer LSWC. I wrote down some of the data for those bullets and it differs slightly. So I guess what you are saying is that it is safe to use data from other manufacturers brands of bullets as long as they are the same weight? I would be staying on the low end of the spectrum for the load for now. These rounds will be shot through a Taurus judge and I don think it can handle +P rounds anyways so I won't be loading anything likethat anyways. My sig will however so I might load up some +P for it once I gain some experience and more knowledge, for now I am going to be sticking to lighter loads while I work on learning the basics of reloading. I have so much to learn, I have the lee manual or order but I might go back to the store and pick up a copy of the Lyman manual tomorrow after work. I was looking of alliants website and they have load data listed for a 200gr LRFN bullet, would that data work even though it is for a Speer bullet not Oregon trail. From what I have read the Oregon trail bullets are very hard, I know this affects the bullet to barrel seal and also how much leading is experienced. Everything I have read says to start at the lower end of the load spectrum and work your way up so I will do that. How does the ballistic coefficient affect the loading, also what is the COL that I was seeing in the manuals and on some websites? Thanks for the help though, I have a lot to learn and I won't load the first round until I feel confident I am going to be doing it the right way and in the safest way possible. I have a long way to go but it will be worth it in the long run.

woolleyworm · 01-26-2012, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noremac1982

1) will they work for my application, plinking and target shooting?
Welcome to TFF ! Yes, they will work.

2) since I can't find any load data, what is a comparable recipe that I can use for these if they will work? I have some bullseye powder and CCI 300 primers that I picked up locally because I didn't want to pay the extra shipping.

Ensure that bullet style and weight is as similar as possible if you can't find any data anywhere else. Then make sure you use starting loads and not mid loads or "loads someone else finds good". Always start any new load at the mins and treat your processes the same every time.

3) do I need a special crimping die to correctly seat the bullet?

You need a crimping die for roll crimps for 45 Colt. The seating die can be just a seating die or you can get combo seater/crimper dies. So, you can use one die or two, it's just a matter of preference. There are different inserts available for seating different bullet styles/shapes.

4) would i be better off since i am a beginner to just get a bullet that is listed in my loading guide once it arrives? Any and all help will be greatly appreciated.

Yes, it's is best to find a specific bullet for a beginner. It just makes it clearer and easier to reference.

TIA - You're very welcome, come again!

Semper Fi,

Woolley

Noremac1982 · 01-26-2012, 04:31 PM

Thanks, I have ordered a lee set of dies that includes a factory crimp die. Will that give me the roll crimp that I need?

American Leader · 01-26-2012, 04:43 PM

WELCOME ABOARD Normac1982 FROM THE GREAT STATE OF IOWA! Like everyone above stated, get your loading manuals and read as much as you can and then read it again so you comprehend! One thing you might try is the internet loading data available from most powder manufacturers. They all cover their powders of course, but you will get variables in other bullet types such as lead verses plated verses jacketed etc. along with bullet weights and configurations. There is tons of info out there read all you can, but as gdmoody stated, don't rely on info given to you by us because errors do happen, we have all seen them. Totally unintential, but can be deadly. Good luck!

Clipper · 01-26-2012, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noremac1982

Thanks, I have ordered a lee set of dies that includes a factory crimp die. Will that give me the roll crimp that I need?

Yep, the Lee Factory crimp die should do nicely for you. Read the instructions carefully about the set-up. I use mine on all the .45's I roll out.

And welcome to the avocation. It is more than a hobby.

Noremac1982 · 01-26-2012, 05:31 PM

Haha, yea clipper your right. There is a lot to learn, and most hobbies won't blow up in you hand and face if you screw up. You guys have been extremely helpful. I am going to keep reading until my press and stuff gets here. Should be Monday, I have a lot to learn by then, it's gonna be a long weekend, but I got to be ready when my stuff gets here.

woolleyworm · 01-26-2012, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noremac1982

Haha, yea clipper your right. There is a lot to learn, and most hobbies won't blow up in you hand and face if you screw up. You guys have been extremely helpful. I am going to keep reading until my press and stuff gets here. Should be Monday, I have a lot to learn by then, it's gonna be a long weekend, but I got to be ready when my stuff gets here.

Do you already have a tumbler and a set of calipers? Prep some brass and plan on doing up some dummy rounds to get the hang of die adjustments. Don't worry about scrapping a few bullets, it's worth the $1 or 2 to get it right.

Brisk44 · 01-26-2012, 07:39 PM

I'm glad to see you picked the LEE equipment as it is the very best.

American Leader · 01-26-2012, 10:06 PM

Where's LDBennett when you need him?

Brisk44 · 01-26-2012, 10:09 PM

Hey now don't pick on my buddy LD.

Noremac1982 · 01-27-2012, 10:52 PM

Yes wooly, I picked up a Frankfort arsenal quick n easy tumbler, it had pretty good reviews and came with case lube, separator and tumbling media so we will see how it works, hopefully pretty well. It didn't break the bank though so if it doesn't work well And I get more brass to reload I will pick up a larger Lyman or something. I also have a set of Mitutoyo calipers from when I was working in a machine shop. They are digital but I have used them for years and checked them on quite a few standard blocks so I know they are very accurate. They have a half mil resolution.

One more quick question, I was inspecting my brass I ordered and checking case length. I have inspected and measured about 50 so far and none have been over 1.28in. Most are mid to upper 1.27's. From he manuals I picked up they all state that minimum case length is 1.285in. Is this going to be a problem or am I being to precise. Is there a tolerance to stay within +/- so many mil's or anything I should be aware of? I don't see any tolerances in the manuals or on the interweb. I am a little bit OCD and a firm believer in doing things the right way the first time.

Also thanks for the suggestion about doing a few mock up rounds to practice my die adjustments. Everything but the press got delivered today so I will have to do that tomorrow when it's delivered. I'm not sure if we can say anything about vendors on here but the two I felt with when ordering my setup were very helpful and prompt with delivery. The only reason the press and tumbler didn't make it today was they are in a 25lb box and it took anlittle longer in transit. But I ordered the stuff on Wednesday with 3-5 day ground shipping and it was shipped that night and at my doorstep today!! ouldnt be more pleased with the service. Called to ask where my press and tumbler were and never had to go through the phone tree automation junk, promptly got a human and my question was answered and my estimated delivery was given to me within 5 minutes of placing the call.

01-25-2012, 10:27 PM	#2
Noremac1982 Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Kentucky Posts: 6	Re: Beginner question. Oh and the bullets I ordered are LSWC. Not sure if it matters but i want to give as much detail as possible so I can get the best help possible. Thanks again.

01-25-2012, 10:29 PM	#3
gdmoody Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Northeast Georgia Contributor Posts: 6,324	Re: Beginner question. Welcome Noremac1982!! I don't know which loading manual that you were looking at or which ones you have on order. The Lyman Reloading handbook # 49 has load data for a 200 grain lead bullet, so does the Hornady Manual #7, and so does Speer #14. One word of caution on the .45 Colt loads. Most manuals will have two or three different sections listed for them. One that will say something like .45 Revolver and then a section that will say like for Ruger and T/C. If you are using an older .45, you need to use the section for Revolver. Ruger and T/C is self explanatory. Here is a link to the Accurate powders reloading information. It does have data for a 200 grain Hornady XTP bullet but none for lead. You can use the data for the XTP but stay at the lower end of the data. http://www.accuratepowder.com/wp-con...d_data_3.5.pdf I no longer load for .45 colt since I traded off my pistol back in November. When I did load for it I loaded 200 grain and 250 grain bullets and the .452 will work just fine in them. I would stay with .451 in the .45 auto even though the .452 lead will be fine for them too. __________________ NRA Endowment Member GeorgiaCarry.Org Member Retired US Army Postal Worker Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take an ass whoopin'.....author unknown (but obviously brilliant) Last edited by gdmoody; 01-25-2012 at 10:31 PM..

01-25-2012, 10:43 PM	#5
gdmoody Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Northeast Georgia Contributor Posts: 6,324	Re: Beginner question. I forgot to cover your questions in my post. 1. I did answer that one, YES they will work for your application 2. I kind of answered that one too. You can use the data for a 200 grain XTP bullet but stay at the lower end of the spectrum. 3. Bullseye powder is not listed in the Lyman book but it is in the Hornady and Speer and the starting weights are different. I wouldn't trust something I read on a forum anyway. I would never lead you wrong but people do make typographical errors that could be dangerous. Wait until you get your manuals. 4. The 200 grain bullets are listed so the answer to that question could be NO because it could be in your book. You need to get at least two different manuals and I suggest a Lyman #49 as one of them (three would be better). __________________ NRA Endowment Member GeorgiaCarry.Org Member Retired US Army Postal Worker Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take an ass whoopin'.....author unknown (but obviously brilliant)

01-25-2012, 11:44 PM	#6
Noremac1982 Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Kentucky Posts: 6	Re: Beginner question. Thanks gdmoody. The manuals I was looking at had other brands of 200 gr LSWC bullets but I thought I needed to find my specific brand in order to load it safely because the alloy's might differ and also the ballistic coefficient. I was looking for something very similar Oregon trail laser cast and the two that I found were the hornady LSWC and the Speer LSWC. I wrote down some of the data for those bullets and it differs slightly. So I guess what you are saying is that it is safe to use data from other manufacturers brands of bullets as long as they are the same weight? I would be staying on the low end of the spectrum for the load for now. These rounds will be shot through a Taurus judge and I don think it can handle +P rounds anyways so I won't be loading anything likethat anyways. My sig will however so I might load up some +P for it once I gain some experience and more knowledge, for now I am going to be sticking to lighter loads while I work on learning the basics of reloading. I have so much to learn, I have the lee manual or order but I might go back to the store and pick up a copy of the Lyman manual tomorrow after work. I was looking of alliants website and they have load data listed for a 200gr LRFN bullet, would that data work even though it is for a Speer bullet not Oregon trail. From what I have read the Oregon trail bullets are very hard, I know this affects the bullet to barrel seal and also how much leading is experienced. Everything I have read says to start at the lower end of the load spectrum and work your way up so I will do that. How does the ballistic coefficient affect the loading, also what is the COL that I was seeing in the manuals and on some websites? Thanks for the help though, I have a lot to learn and I won't load the first round until I feel confident I am going to be doing it the right way and in the safest way possible. I have a long way to go but it will be worth it in the long run.

01-26-2012, 04:31 PM	#8
Noremac1982 Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Kentucky Posts: 6	Re: Beginner question. Thanks, I have ordered a lee set of dies that includes a factory crimp die. Will that give me the roll crimp that I need?

01-25-2012, 10:10 PM	#1
Noremac1982 Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Kentucky Posts: 6	Beginner question. Hello everyone, I am new to this forum and also to reloading. So hello everyone. I have recently taken an interest in reloading my own ammo due to many factors. The first being that I would like to shoot more and secondly I would like to have more control over my availability of ammo. I recently ordered a lee turret press, scales, and a set of the lee deluxe 4 piece die set in 45 Colt. While making my purchase I also ordered some Oregon trail laser cast 200gr bullets in .452 diameter. I chose these because of the cost and the quantity. After some more reading I am wondering if these bullets are what I should have gotten. I went to my local gun store and looked at some reloading guides to get a little bit of a head start before mine arrives with my press. The problem is that I didn't see these bullets in any of the guides. I know this might be a simple question but will the bullets work in 45 Colt. The description didn't specify so I am wondering if I might have purchased the wrong bullets. I also have a .45 Auto so they aren't wasted I will just have to get the dies and i can use them, I think? So I guess I have a couple questions, 1) will they work for my application, plinking and target shooting? 2) since I can't find any load data, what is a comparable recipe that I can use for these if they will work? I have some bullseye powder and CCI 300 primers that I picked up locally because I didn't want to pay the extra shipping. 3) do I need a special crimping die to correctly seat the bullet? 4) would i be better off since i am a beginner to just get a bullet that is listed in my loading guide once it arrives? Any and all help will be greatly appreciated. TIA -->

01-25-2012, 10:30 PM	#4
BETH Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: naugatuck,Ct. Contributor Posts: 6,668	Re: Beginner question. welcome to the forum someone might move your post to the reloading thread but i am sure someone will help u

01-26-2012, 04:43 PM	#9
American Leader Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Iowa Contributor Posts: 1,630	Re: Beginner question. WELCOME ABOARD Normac1982 FROM THE GREAT STATE OF IOWA! Like everyone above stated, get your loading manuals and read as much as you can and then read it again so you comprehend! One thing you might try is the internet loading data available from most powder manufacturers. They all cover their powders of course, but you will get variables in other bullet types such as lead verses plated verses jacketed etc. along with bullet weights and configurations. There is tons of info out there read all you can, but as gdmoody stated, don't rely on info given to you by us because errors do happen, we have all seen them. Totally unintential, but can be deadly. Good luck!

01-26-2012, 05:31 PM	#11
Noremac1982 Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Kentucky Posts: 6	Re: Beginner question. Haha, yea clipper your right. There is a lot to learn, and most hobbies won't blow up in you hand and face if you screw up. You guys have been extremely helpful. I am going to keep reading until my press and stuff gets here. Should be Monday, I have a lot to learn by then, it's gonna be a long weekend, but I got to be ready when my stuff gets here.

01-26-2012, 07:39 PM	#13
Brisk44 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Iowa Contributor Posts: 1,747	Re: Beginner question. I'm glad to see you picked the LEE equipment as it is the very best.

01-26-2012, 10:06 PM	#14
American Leader Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Iowa Contributor Posts: 1,630	Re: Beginner question. Where's LDBennett when you need him?

01-26-2012, 10:09 PM	#15
Brisk44 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Iowa Contributor Posts: 1,747	Re: Beginner question. Hey now don't pick on my buddy LD.

01-27-2012, 10:52 PM	#16
Noremac1982 Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Kentucky Posts: 6	Re: Beginner question. Yes wooly, I picked up a Frankfort arsenal quick n easy tumbler, it had pretty good reviews and came with case lube, separator and tumbling media so we will see how it works, hopefully pretty well. It didn't break the bank though so if it doesn't work well And I get more brass to reload I will pick up a larger Lyman or something. I also have a set of Mitutoyo calipers from when I was working in a machine shop. They are digital but I have used them for years and checked them on quite a few standard blocks so I know they are very accurate. They have a half mil resolution. One more quick question, I was inspecting my brass I ordered and checking case length. I have inspected and measured about 50 so far and none have been over 1.28in. Most are mid to upper 1.27's. From he manuals I picked up they all state that minimum case length is 1.285in. Is this going to be a problem or am I being to precise. Is there a tolerance to stay within +/- so many mil's or anything I should be aware of? I don't see any tolerances in the manuals or on the interweb. I am a little bit OCD and a firm believer in doing things the right way the first time. Also thanks for the suggestion about doing a few mock up rounds to practice my die adjustments. Everything but the press got delivered today so I will have to do that tomorrow when it's delivered. I'm not sure if we can say anything about vendors on here but the two I felt with when ordering my setup were very helpful and prompt with delivery. The only reason the press and tumbler didn't make it today was they are in a 25lb box and it took anlittle longer in transit. But I ordered the stuff on Wednesday with 3-5 day ground shipping and it was shipped that night and at my doorstep today!! ouldnt be more pleased with the service. Called to ask where my press and tumbler were and never had to go through the phone tree automation junk, promptly got a human and my question was answered and my estimated delivery was given to me within 5 minutes of placing the call.