Jacketed after cast - The Firearms Forum

army mp · 02-01-2010, 08:18 AM

Awhile back I was reading a post on another form about shooting jacketed bullets after cast. Too loosen any leading from shooting cast bullets. My belief is that this is not a good Idea. As was many on that site.
How ever the other evening, I was re-reading My Lyman Cast Bullet book. And there is a paragraph in there. Saying that this works well for removing moderate leading. I know I may be wrong. But this just doesn’t sound right to me. Cast bullets by nature fit tighter to the barrel. So my thinking would be the Jacketed Bullets would. Only force the lead harder against the barrel. And make it that much harder to clean it out.. What are your opinions.

carver · 02-01-2010, 09:06 AM

Lead is hard to get out anyway. I suppose that some of the lead could be shot out with a jacketed bullet, but like you, I would tend to think that anything left behind would be that much harder to get out. When I reload lead bullets I keep the FPS low, so as not to cause much leading to start with.

army mp · 02-01-2010, 10:50 AM

Yes I have cast and shot Lead for many years. I guess I’m too old to change habits now anyway. the little bit of leading I do get. Isn’t that hard to get out. It just seemed odd. That Lyman would suggest it.

RustyFN · 02-02-2010, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Awhile back I was reading a post on another form about shooting jacketed bullets after cast. Too loosen any leading from shooting cast bullets. My belief is that this is not a good Idea.

It's not a good idea. The jacketed bullet can push the lead ahead of it until it bunches up and then expanding the lead ( and barrel ) to get by creating a ring of lead in the barrel that you will never get out.

old semperfi · 02-02-2010, 05:37 PM

right,wrong,or indifferent.i was taught 40 years ago to load five cast and last round jacketed.i currently have three smith model 29s, on my stainless model classic i have fired no less than 5-6000 rounds thru that gun with no problems.i do however clean gun every time it goes to range.i have never had a lead problem on any of my revolvers old semperfi

Terry_P · 02-02-2010, 08:49 PM

I think old semperfi got it right. I usually fire jacketed after lead and then clean after each range session. Just habit always clean my firearms after I shoot them.

Gatofeo · 02-07-2010, 10:00 PM

I've always found copper fouling harder to remove than lead. It's harder, resists scrubbing, and ammonia-based solutions only remove the top layer of it.
Lead, being softer, I've found easier to remove.
One of the best lead removers is Iosso Bore Cleaner, which is a slightly abrasive cream that comes in a tube. Hard to find, but Midway has it at a reasonable $5 or thereabouts. One tube lasts longer than expected.
I work the Iosso Bore Cleaner into a patch, then use a patch jag that will hold the patch tight in the bore. Work this back and forth until it feels too easy to be doing any good. Push the patch out and you'll likely see long threads of lead on the patch, where it was once deposited in the grooves.
For .38/9mm handguns, I use a 5/16th length of dowel and tap the patch through with the dowel (it's a tight fit, so you won't be able to move it by hand).
For the .44 or .45 I use a 7/16th length of dowel.
The flat-faced dowel ensures the patch fits tightly. When it's tight, it grips the lead in the grooves and lands and pushes it out. The wooden dowel eliminates any chance of bore damage.
For revolver chambers, I use a slightly oversized bronze brush (.40 for .38/.357 and .50 for .44 or .45) attached to a short length of cleaning rod. Chuck the cleaning rod into a cordless drill, dip the brush in Hoppes No. 9 or your favorite solvent, and run the brush in and out of each chamber at low speed.
No need to run fast, low to medium speed worked forth and back will get the lead out of the shoulder in the chamber.
And if not, use the dowel and tight patch method with Iosso Bore Cleaner. A tight patch tapped through will push it out.
One warning, though: use a copper or bronze brush, not stainless steel. A steel brush may damage or slightly enlarge your chamber. The bronze or copper brush, being much softer than cylinder steel, doesn't pose that danger.
Oh, and the Iosso Bore Cleaner is wonderful for the bores of cap and ball revolvers and muzzleloading rifles. It will smooth them wonderfully, after they've been thoroughly cleaned. It will also remove any black powder fouling you may have missed.
For cleaning shotgun barrels, it's great. Removes rust, plastic, lead and any other crud.
And no, I don't get a commission from Iosso! I should though ... I've been promoting it for years. It's that good.

jack404 · 02-07-2010, 10:09 PM

I'm of the same opionion as old semperfi,

sold the 6 gun a while back sadly

but i extend this even to my flinter,

this i use a printers lead ( high antimony content so harder than normal lead ) slug

last shot of the day i give it a burl and clean as usual never had a lead build up ( oh i have a rifled barrel for my hunting peice not a exact copy but i hunt and hate to miss, this way i get the best of both worlds)

cheers

jack

02-01-2010, 08:18 AM	#1
army mp V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: western Pa, Posts: 479	Jacketed after cast Awhile back I was reading a post on another form about shooting jacketed bullets after cast. Too loosen any leading from shooting cast bullets. My belief is that this is not a good Idea. As was many on that site. How ever the other evening, I was re-reading My Lyman Cast Bullet book. And there is a paragraph in there. Saying that this works well for removing moderate leading. I know I may be wrong. But this just doesn’t sound right to me. Cast bullets by nature fit tighter to the barrel. So my thinking would be the Jacketed Bullets would. Only force the lead harder against the barrel. And make it that much harder to clean it out.. What are your opinions. -->

02-01-2010, 09:06 AM	#2
carver TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: DAV, Deep in the Pineywoods of East Texas, just west of Shreveport, LA Contributor Posts: 11,236	Re: Jacketed after cast Lead is hard to get out anyway. I suppose that some of the lead could be shot out with a jacketed bullet, but like you, I would tend to think that anything left behind would be that much harder to get out. When I reload lead bullets I keep the FPS low, so as not to cause much leading to start with. __________________ Y'all be safe now, ya hear! Lamentations Chapter 5: 1. Remember, O LORD, what is come upon us: consider, and behold our reproach. 2. Our inheritance is turned to strangers, our houses to aliens. 3. We are orphans and fatherless, our mothers [are] as widows. 5. Our necks [are] under persecution: we labour, [and] have no rest. 16. The crown is fallen [from] our head: woe unto us, that we have sinned! 21. Turn thou us unto thee, O LORD, and we shall be turned; renew our days as of old.

02-01-2010, 10:50 AM	#3
army mp V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: western Pa, Posts: 479	Re: Jacketed after cast Yes I have cast and shot Lead for many years. I guess I’m too old to change habits now anyway. the little bit of leading I do get. Isn’t that hard to get out. It just seemed odd. That Lyman would suggest it.

02-02-2010, 05:37 PM	#5
old semperfi Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: i live in southern indiana,old country boy at heart Posts: 1,506	Re: Jacketed after cast right,wrong,or indifferent.i was taught 40 years ago to load five cast and last round jacketed.i currently have three smith model 29s, on my stainless model classic i have fired no less than 5-6000 rounds thru that gun with no problems.i do however clean gun every time it goes to range.i have never had a lead problem on any of my revolvers old semperfi

02-02-2010, 08:49 PM	#6
Terry_P Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: NH Posts: 2,513	Re: Jacketed after cast I think old semperfi got it right. I usually fire jacketed after lead and then clean after each range session. Just habit always clean my firearms after I shoot them. __________________ NRA and NAHC Life "Both oligarch and tyrant mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms." -Aristotle

02-07-2010, 10:00 PM	#7
Gatofeo V.I.P. Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Remote Utah desert, separated from Oblivion by a screen door. Posts: 84	Re: Jacketed after cast I've always found copper fouling harder to remove than lead. It's harder, resists scrubbing, and ammonia-based solutions only remove the top layer of it. Lead, being softer, I've found easier to remove. One of the best lead removers is Iosso Bore Cleaner, which is a slightly abrasive cream that comes in a tube. Hard to find, but Midway has it at a reasonable $5 or thereabouts. One tube lasts longer than expected. I work the Iosso Bore Cleaner into a patch, then use a patch jag that will hold the patch tight in the bore. Work this back and forth until it feels too easy to be doing any good. Push the patch out and you'll likely see long threads of lead on the patch, where it was once deposited in the grooves. For .38/9mm handguns, I use a 5/16th length of dowel and tap the patch through with the dowel (it's a tight fit, so you won't be able to move it by hand). For the .44 or .45 I use a 7/16th length of dowel. The flat-faced dowel ensures the patch fits tightly. When it's tight, it grips the lead in the grooves and lands and pushes it out. The wooden dowel eliminates any chance of bore damage. For revolver chambers, I use a slightly oversized bronze brush (.40 for .38/.357 and .50 for .44 or .45) attached to a short length of cleaning rod. Chuck the cleaning rod into a cordless drill, dip the brush in Hoppes No. 9 or your favorite solvent, and run the brush in and out of each chamber at low speed. No need to run fast, low to medium speed worked forth and back will get the lead out of the shoulder in the chamber. And if not, use the dowel and tight patch method with Iosso Bore Cleaner. A tight patch tapped through will push it out. One warning, though: use a copper or bronze brush, not stainless steel. A steel brush may damage or slightly enlarge your chamber. The bronze or copper brush, being much softer than cylinder steel, doesn't pose that danger. Oh, and the Iosso Bore Cleaner is wonderful for the bores of cap and ball revolvers and muzzleloading rifles. It will smooth them wonderfully, after they've been thoroughly cleaned. It will also remove any black powder fouling you may have missed. For cleaning shotgun barrels, it's great. Removes rust, plastic, lead and any other crud. And no, I don't get a commission from Iosso! I should though ... I've been promoting it for years. It's that good. __________________ "Therein do I see an ugly cat. Smoke. Fire. Brimstone. A vast desert. Holes in parchment. The ugly cat is much amused." --- The quantrains of Gatodamus (1503-1566)

02-07-2010, 10:09 PM	#8
jack404 Former Guest Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Australia Contributor Posts: 17,622	Re: Jacketed after cast I'm of the same opionion as old semperfi, sold the 6 gun a while back sadly but i extend this even to my flinter, this i use a printers lead ( high antimony content so harder than normal lead ) slug last shot of the day i give it a burl and clean as usual never had a lead build up ( oh i have a rifled barrel for my hunting peice not a exact copy but i hunt and hate to miss, this way i get the best of both worlds) cheers jack