new to bp

[shorter260513]

I was just given tonight a couple of black powder pistols one is a conneticut valley arms .45 cal and the other is a smaller dikar spain also a .45 cal both say black powder only and look to be in good shape the most i can find on these is they are both made in the late 70s to late 80s first of all i was wondering if they would be safe to shoot and what would be a good starting load to play with should i use loose powder or the pellets any info would be appreciated and i can post pics if needed just dont have the camera handy right now

[jack404]

ok first up are they flintlocks or cap lock's?? flintlocks as a rules dont go well with the pelletised powders and caplocks prefer a hotter cap to ignite the pellets too

starting loads first off, is the pistol a dikar or jukar ( sorry to ask but many folks get told wrong dikar/jukar/CVA being similar but taking differing loads )

if a dikar start light say 15 grain powder load first time off with a .454 ball with a 27 grain load top max ( the touch holes are a bit thinnish )

Jukar are a bit later and better metal ( thicker in the touch hole too) so you can start at 20 grains no worries

work up your loads until your happy ( about 28 max for all the CVA type pistols with 30 being top max load )

i've dropped a wild ( feral ) dog here with 25 grain loads at 20 yards , straight through the critter and stopped it dead

enjoy!!!

[shorter260513]

they are both cap pistols as far as i can tell the nipple on one doesnt look as if it has even been used and the barrel has a tad of surface rust (conneticu valley arms) and the other looks a little worn and the barrel is shiny and you can see a little powder residue at the back of the barrel

[shorter260513]

the barrel stamp is pretty clear still it is difinately a Dikar

[jack404]

thats ok just load a bit light to start, they are great little guns , but dont take to overloads and will, if overloaded "spout" ( or burn too much out the touch hole )

i'm not a fan of pellets but thats me , so pellets should be ok , if you can measure the nipple on both to discover what size they are

this is a chart of cap sizes



if you do use pellets change the nipple ( if required) to use number 11 size caps and this should be ok and give you consistent firing ( 10's can be iffy on ignition)

[shorter260513]

if the pics come through the smaller of the two is the dikar the longer one is the cva by the way the paint stick is 12in

[old semperfi]

i think you have some nice pistols to start out black powder,however pellitized powder is hit and miss on most cap locks and you are limited to powder charge,i wouldnt waste the money.jack has the right idea about starting out on low powder charges.i see no reason to shoot hot loads on pistols you cant hunt with. old semperfi

[jack404]

old semperfi, cant hunt with ?? dont tell me that . i do it often ( mainly pest control )

that stated it is no where near as accurate as my flinters or long cap rifles, but great fun on the odd razorback ( boar)

[shorter260513]

what about bullets can i go to the gun shop and just buy regular 45 cal muzzleloader bullets or do i have to use lead

[Buffalochip]

Originally Posted by shorter260513

what about bullets can i go to the gun shop and just buy regular 45 cal muzzleloader bullets or do i have to use lead

You'll want to use patched balls with these--you don't want to use any round that won't stay seated firmly on the barrel--an air gap can be quite nasty. I think .44 cal with greased pillow ticking is the ticket, but check the web.

[Curlyjoe_99]

both look like nice pistols.

as for the bullets, +1 on going with patch & Ball & Buffalochip's advice. if there is anyone around you that already shoots BP in 45cal that is not a revolver (revolver's tend to use a ball larger than .450), check with them to see what they are shooting. odds are they are using .440 RB (Round Ball) with a .005-.010 lubed patch. I shot a CVA nearly idetical to what you have pictured back in the '80s and this was what we used. a simple test for ball size is to test a ball on an empty barrel. take the ball and see if it will slide into the barrel bithout much pressure & No Patch. it should roll or slide in & be able to be lightly tapped right back out. do not use a bullet starter during this test. when you add the patch to actually shoot it, it should be firm at the muzzel and need the bullet starter to get the round into the barrel to ensure an airtight seal.

Do Not try to force the RB deep into the barrel during the test fitting, as you would then have to have it pulled! and the bullet is most likely too large of a diameter for your particular pistol.

the only true way to be sure what size RB to get is to have the barrel's diameter swagged (Measured by a gunsmith). the gunsmith can also check the barrel to make sure it's not too bad to fire.

Ditto that you can search the forum (& the web) as there are a lot of posts on how to safely begin BP shooting.

Hope some of these suggestions help and welcome aboard!

[Hawg]

.440 round ball, .010 lubed patch, 30 grains of FFFG or Pyrodex P. Forget the pellets. You can change powder/patch combos until you get the best groups. You'll need a short starter and # 11 caps. Hot soapy water to clean. You'll need a patch jag to clean it and a ball puller for when you dry ball. Keep petroleum based lubes out of the bore unless you want to really work at cleaning it. Use vegetable based lubes like olive oil or one of the black powder recommended lubes like Bore Butter

[shorter260513]

Thanks everybody for the advice I went today to pick up the things I need being a first timer to black powder I needed it all so off to the big chain sporting goods store to get it all after some searching scratching my head I found balls .440 pre, lubed patches, caps, and more brands of black powder than I could shake a stick at then I searched high and low and not even an empty place where they would sell anything to measure the stinkin charge with guess the expect you to guess im gonna get me an order together online and mabe shoot next weekend