Doctors say gun violance is social disease

[hunter29180]

are we going to have to stop going to see our doctors??

http://www.wnem.com/story/19253721/d...social-disease

[carver]

Violance is a "sin" disease! There is no cure for it but one! And man in all his wisdom cannot find it! Of course, if they do classify gun violance as a social disease, then it falls under the control of the CDC, and thus, the Federal Government!

[ozo]

http://www.wnem.com/story/19253721/d...social-disease

How strange......this was put up almost at the same time
by hunter and I.......weird.....

[wv hillbilly]

" Infectious Disease "
well there is a very simple cure. it's called
CAPITAL PUNISHMENT
bring it back

[flintlock]

With due respect to any doctors on the forum, this is my opinion. I think you are far more likely, statisticaly speaking, to die from medical malpractice than from a deranged gunmans bullet. I'm sure the "Health" department of the current administration would love to pass this article off as gospel truth, and a portion of the public will no doubt believe it.

[NxNW]

I normally just read but had to post this. Hope it works.

http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle...165845396.html

[CJ_56]

What a shock! It was an AP story with no space for comments. The American Propaganda news network (AP) never writes anything that isn't looney left. They don't take suggestions from us peons either. Why they have a college education in "journalism". Naturally they are the smartest people on earth. According to them.

Doctors are a social disease IMO. I saw where a court in Florida changed a lower court ruling that stopped doctors from denying patients coverage if they owned guns. A court had said they couldn't even ask that question. Now they're back to kicking people to the curb if they own guns. All I can say is, "What second amendment?"

[jlloyd73]

That's the biggest issue with anti gun people and the "mentally ill" classification.


So, they don't want mentally ill people to have guns.......so whats a mental illness? Lets think about that for a second......

Who's to say they (anti gun people, government, doctors.....) won't start to manipulate the phrase "mental illness" (which I will bet you they will)........

....so, now if you collect stamps, coins, and God forbid guns......you have OCD and you are unable to control yourself....you are OBSESSIVE

.......you are a prepper.....well heck you suffer from PARANOIA (because they know nothing bad will ever happen...the government will protect you).....you can't have guns and be suffering from paranoia


I can go all day on this one.......doctors don't care and will not hesitate to put a classification on you regardless of if it is true or how it will affect you.

So, let me give you an example.....a personal one.

My wife Donna had surgery last year and a few months later complained about a pain in her side.......she has had 2 follow up surgeries to fix scar tissue etc. Well the month before last she was in extreme pain and had to go to the emergency room. They did some tests and saw that she had a mass inside her (on the side that has been hurting her for a year now). The doctors concluded that it was some sort of an infection.....treated her and that was that.

Fast Forward to about 2 weeks ago.....

We went to another doctor and let him look at her for a second opinion. Evidently without looking at the notes and medical records (including a cd with her CT scans on them) we brought with us (I will get to that) He said he knew her surgeon and said he would have done the same steps her doctor did and if this new doctor were to treat her he would have to do all the step over again.... meaning another surgery (it was laproscopic, so no big deal really). He then went to tell her that sometimes pain like that is just in our heads and that it......and that maybe she should see someone about pain management. SO, basically she is crazy and a drug addict.

Well Donna was getting upset and after just sitting back and saying nothing I looked at him and said, you know the main concern is the mass they found inside her when she was admitted into the emergency room.....(let the backpedaling begin). Anyways the @#$% proceeded to pull up the CT scan from last year and one from the newest visit side by side and he could see where there wasn't then was a mass there. All in all Donna's pain has been justified and she isn't a nut.

But that didn't stop that doctor from trying to make her out to be a nutjob, drug addict.

Bottom line......THEY DON'T CARE..........

[jedwil]

BS article.

[skullfr]

the whole thing is just stupid.Alcohol is a known cause for more death and violent crime but it is advertised on tv.They rail against marijuana use as a evil drug but it cannot be proven that usage is a cause of crime other than the major dealers and cartels.Opium is a dangerous drug yet we have our govt involved in importing and protecting opium production in Afghanistan.Our dr. repeatedly put patients on drugs like oxycontin and then blame the patients.Look at the number of deaths in hospitals and nursing homes caused by serial killers.They operate for years killing patients.I culd go on but you get the idea.There has been murder since the beginning of time and it will continue till the end.

[jedwil]

Liberal MD and AP BS. Neither has a wide following.

[TotheTop83]

Originally Posted by jlloyd73

That's the biggest issue with anti gun people and the "mentally ill" classification.


So, they don't want mentally ill people to have guns.......so whats a mental illness? Lets think about that for a second......

Who's to say they (anti gun people, government, doctors.....) won't start to manipulate the phrase "mental illness" (which I will bet you they will)........

....so, now if you collect stamps, coins, and God forbid guns......you have OCD and you are unable to control yourself....you are OBSESSIVE

.......you are a prepper.....well heck you suffer from PARANOIA (because they know nothing bad will ever happen...the government will protect you).....you can't have guns and be suffering from paranoia


I can go all day on this one.......doctors don't care and will not hesitate to put a classification on you regardless of if it is true or how it will affect you.

So, let me give you an example.....a personal one.

My wife Donna had surgery last year and a few months later complained about a pain in her side.......she has had 2 follow up surgeries to fix scar tissue etc. Well the month before last she was in extreme pain and had to go to the emergency room. They did some tests and saw that she had a mass inside her (on the side that has been hurting her for a year now). The doctors concluded that it was some sort of an infection.....treated her and that was that.

Fast Forward to about 2 weeks ago.....

We went to another doctor and let him look at her for a second opinion. Evidently without looking at the notes and medical records (including a cd with her CT scans on them) we brought with us (I will get to that) He said he knew her surgeon and said he would have done the same steps her doctor did and if this new doctor were to treat her he would have to do all the step over again.... meaning another surgery (it was laproscopic, so no big deal really). He then went to tell her that sometimes pain like that is just in our heads and that it......and that maybe she should see someone about pain management. SO, basically she is crazy and a drug addict.

Well Donna was getting upset and after just sitting back and saying nothing I looked at him and said, you know the main concern is the mass they found inside her when she was admitted into the emergency room.....(let the backpedaling begin). Anyways the @#$% proceeded to pull up the CT scan from last year and one from the newest visit side by side and he could see where there wasn't then was a mass there. All in all Donna's pain has been justified and she isn't a nut.

But that didn't stop that doctor from trying to make her out to be a nutjob, drug addict.

Bottom line......THEY DON'T CARE..........

Ah stories like that frustrate the hell out of me. Some physicians think they're God's gift to the world and refuse to listen to patients. After all, they're a DOCTOR and the patient is JUST a patient right?

Couple of notes though:

I noticed you took "pain in head" to mean she's "crazy." He probably meant that her nerves were sending inappropriate pain signals to her head. There's all sorts of things that can happen after even "minor" surgery. After all, your body doesn't expect someone to cut it open and remove pieces so it's not uncommon to have some weird side effects. Disease like fibromyalgia are sort of similar to that. He was referencing a pain specialist because he probably thought she would have chronic pain from damaged nerves, etc. They're trained to make those nerves "behave"....sort of.

The phrase "in her head" isn't appropriate. He should have explained that further. In fact, I can't believe he actually used that verbiage. Please tell me you were paraphrasing and a doctor didn't say pain is in a patients head.

He probably didn't mean she was a drug addict. If he did, he most likely wouldn't have referred her to a pain management specialist.

The reason I said these stories make my blood boil is because I think it's insane that physicians still don't understand how to communicate with and listen to their patients. It drives me up the wall. Why should I have to type on the internet to decipher this guy's words? Why should you need the internet as the outlet for this guy's words?

I'm a future physician (couple years to go) and I already know that one of the most important things is to LISTEN TO YOUR PATIENTS. I can't tell you how many times a physician has said "If you listen to your patients, 90% of them will tell you enough for the diagnosis before you even touch them." If a patient says something hurts, it f*cking hurts whether it's "in the head" or not so it deserves attention, not just a brush off.

I hope your wife is feeling better and continues to improve and if this doc's a dick, see someone else. I just wanted to drop you a line saying that even if this guy is a clown, current physicians are NOT trained to think they're above their patients. Humility is a much larger part of medical education these days than it seems it was in the past.

Lastly, while medicine for sure attracts people because of money, 95% of us DO actually care and did actually come into it for the patients, not the money.

[1LoneWolf75]

I agree just plain BS. More safety aint gonna stop people in the lesser parts of CITIES where most of those 9% of gun related violent activities occur. Now as fer the Dredd type guns, well I think thats pure science fiction dreamed up fer the anti gun people. Jlloyd sounds like a typical "health care provider" how can I make the most money person. If you can find a good dr stick with him but good luck on that.

[ozo]

The medical profession watches each others backs.......
even if they find that they're wrong.....

[Gun Geezer]

Being a criminal is a social disease, having a gun and the right to carry it for self-defense is the cure!

[jedwil]

Originally Posted by flintlock

With due respect to any doctors on the forum, this is my opinion. I think you are far more likely, statisticaly speaking, to die from medical malpractice than from a deranged gunmans bullet. I'm sure the "Health" department of the current administration would love to pass this article off as gospel truth, and a portion of the public will no doubt believe it.

Absolutely true about dieing due to incompetent medical care. Frightening..

[Tmergen24]

Who ever came up with that idea has a "Social Disease" in my opinion. And I do not see any problem with wanting to protects ourselves crimes are always going to be a problem and the criminals will always get guns. If guns go it just become harder to protect ourselves.

[jlloyd73]

Originally Posted by TotheTop83

Ah stories like that frustrate the hell out of me. Some physicians think they're God's gift to the world and refuse to listen to patients. After all, they're a DOCTOR and the patient is JUST a patient right?

Couple of notes though:

I noticed you took "pain in head" to mean she's "crazy." He probably meant that her nerves were sending inappropriate pain signals to her head. There's all sorts of things that can happen after even "minor" surgery. After all, your body doesn't expect someone to cut it open and remove pieces so it's not uncommon to have some weird side effects. Disease like fibromyalgia are sort of similar to that. He was referencing a pain specialist because he probably thought she would have chronic pain from damaged nerves, etc. They're trained to make those nerves "behave"....sort of.

The phrase "in her head" isn't appropriate. He should have explained that further. In fact, I can't believe he actually used that verbiage. Please tell me you were paraphrasing and a doctor didn't say pain is in a patients head.

He probably didn't mean she was a drug addict. If he did, he most likely wouldn't have referred her to a pain management specialist.

The reason I said these stories make my blood boil is because I think it's insane that physicians still don't understand how to communicate with and listen to their patients. It drives me up the wall. Why should I have to type on the internet to decipher this guy's words? Why should you need the internet as the outlet for this guy's words?

I'm a future physician (couple years to go) and I already know that one of the most important things is to LISTEN TO YOUR PATIENTS. I can't tell you how many times a physician has said "If you listen to your patients, 90% of them will tell you enough for the diagnosis before you even touch them." If a patient says something hurts, it f*cking hurts whether it's "in the head" or not so it deserves attention, not just a brush off.

I hope your wife is feeling better and continues to improve and if this doc's a dick, see someone else. I just wanted to drop you a line saying that even if this guy is a clown, current physicians are NOT trained to think they're above their patients. Humility is a much larger part of medical education these days than it seems it was in the past.

Lastly, while medicine for sure attracts people because of money, 95% of us DO actually care and did actually come into it for the patients, not the money.

I know that her doctor cares for her well being and maybe even the one she just saw, but I do not think this latest doctor cared if she "were labeled" as mental or an addict.

He was referring to the pain in her head as if she wasn't really in pain, but that it was a mental issue causing her to think she was hurting.....and nothing could really be done for that other than her seeing a shrink. He did say "in her head though".

The pain management was explained that she needed to stop taking pain pills that her current doctor was giving her....and go elsewhere where they could try other methods or pain control (where she could be more supervised).

Oh, also he kept pressing her on if she were depressed.......like he couldn't believe she wasn't.......like depression was a major factor. Now of course it sucks she has been hurting for so long, but she is not suffering from depression.

On a side note......
What a lot of anti gun people fail to realize is that you cannot regulate evil and evil intent. If someone wants to kill they will.

[gvw3]

Hey were else can you go [like i did a few weeks ago] and spend $1200 to experience the worst pain I have felt in my 62 years of life. I had a tooth removed by a surgeon. I was told I wouldn't feel a thing. They lied.

[gvw3]

I just found this in February 2012 Guns & Ammo

Numbers of doctors in USA 700000
Accidental deaths caused by doctors 120000

Number of gun owners in USA 80000000
Number of accidental deaths by guns 1500

Accidental death per doctor 0.171
Accidental death by gun owner 0.000188

This plainly tells us Doctors are much deadlier than gun owners.

[jstgsn]

You guys are missing the point. Look at it this way.

OK I'm a doctor. (just saying-cause I'm not) I have years of medical training and the bills that come with it. Med school, etc. Now I have the credentials etc. and have to pay for them. Obamacare is going to cripple my income. So, let me declare that my studies have found gun ownership is a disease. If you give me funding, I will give you more facts and studies to proclaim that guns are evil and gun owners are insane. (Cause I see that is your agenda). So you give me federal money and I will support your cause. JUST LIKE GLOBAL WARMING!
The liberal masses will pour money into any doctors account if he will say gun owners are bad people.
Brace yourself girls, it's going to get worse.
Hopefully better days are coming, but they ain't here yet.

[time2shoot]

He's just wants to get his name out there so he can try to be our next Surgeon general. MHO.

[dbrodin]

One recent study found firearm owners were more likely than those with no firearms at home to binge drink or to drink and drive, and other research has tied alcohol and gun violence.

So we are all drunks and/or drunk drivers!

[aa1911]

"They want a science-based, pragmatic approach based on the reality of a society saturated with guns and seek better ways of preventing harm from them."

Not really, they want to regulate something that can't be regulated. And being blind to the fact that guns are used to prevent/stop crimes is not very scientific or pragmatic. If everyone started packing, who is going to start shooting a crowded theatre up when they know that even 50% are armed? It would be suicidal.


"More than 73,000 emergency room visits in 2010 were for firearm-related injuries, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimates."

That's not really a big number to me. So how many car accident related cases are there? We should restrict vehicle ownership by that logic or outright ban them.

I hope to be training as a physician assistant this time next year through the military; I do see a lot of docs who don't care as much as they should but there is also a large volume of patients that are ignorant and tap your patience (no pun intended). If you're not happy, get another doc or at least tell the doc that you're not happy with his work.

TotheTop said it best; listen to the patient, most of the time, I can make a diagnosis without ever touching the patient. There are many common ailments that are easy to clinically identify but there are those small percentage of rare or extreme cases that modern medicine does not have the best answer yet on how to treat. Or that doctor does not know enough about it so he should in turn refer you to a specialist.

So if you're being blown off by your health care provider, call him out; he will either seek self improvement to try and honestly help you or he will get pissed and refer you to another doc. Either way, you win. I know that's a generality so don't take it as gospel but it's a thought.