Crimping .223

[AR guy]

Got a question on crimping. First of all I read that the .223 should be crimped, right? Next when I go to crimp the case or bullet whatever you prefer I screw the die in till it touches the neck, then give it a 1/4 turn more. Then the cam arm kinda pops when fully extended. I went a bit too far on first couple and the neck was pushed down into the shoulder just a bit not too much then loosened it up a bit till I thought it was good. The thing is though I can't see the roll crimp that its suppose to have. I can't tell a difference between the uncrimped and crimped. Should you be able to see the crimp? I can't tell. And the ones that have their shoulder pushed down can I use those or should I take apart and salvage what I can?

[gdmoody]

The way I check it is not scientific at all and may not be the way it should be done - but I press my completed cartridge against my reloading bench with the bullet down. If the bullets is pushed into the case then I crimp a little more. If it doesn't move, it's OK. Measure with caliper before and after push to determine if it moves or not.

[soundguy]

ar guy.. I'm not sure what die set you have.. but on the rcbs rifle dies.. they give a good description of setting the roll crimp.

you basically set it up in a couple stages, then seat and crimp in 1 stage after setup.

you more or less getthe bullet seated where you wand it.. remove the seater, then adjust die to achieve crimp you want... then screw seater back in till it makes firm contatc.. lock all down.

then make another and check.

it should seat and roll crimp in one operation.

[steve4102]

Crimping for an AR is a subject that has been beaten to death and you will find many that advocate crimping and just as many that do not. It is really up to the individual handloader to decide. Me I crimp.

Crimping with the seating die can be very tricky and can cause a few problems.
It's very important that all brass is trimmed to the exact same length otherwise you may end up with rounds that have little or no crimp and rounds with collapsed shoulders.

IMO, crimping with the seating die works best when loading bullets with a cannelure, if using non-cannelured bullets I would not crimp with the seating die.

I eliminate all the potential crimping problems by crimping with the Lee Factory Crimp die. It can be used on bullets with or without cannelure, case length is not a factor, it helps secure the bullet and improves accuracy.

IMO the LFCD is well worth the $12.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/456...-223-remington

[soundguy]

yep.. trim length is very important on a rollcrimp with the seating die.

I always trim all my brass after FL resize. that assures me a good standard roll crimp.

In the rare event i crimp a non cannelured projectile, I generally go with the least amount of crimp I can percieve, so that it does not bulge and make a hard to chamber situation..

[cycloneman]

Lee factory crimp die only way to go for me and yes you can see it.

[AR guy]

I'm using a lyman 2 ie set. And yes I do have a problem with all shells being the same size. I'm hand trimming all shells I don't have a trimmer yet. So ll shells are close but not exact. So what I'm doing is all seating ( ll my bullets I'm using do have the cannalure ) then going back and crimping. I got the feel on the ram arm if its gunna push the shoulder down, then I stop and loosen the die. The thing is, I can't see or notice a crimp. Is it noticeable, the crimp that is? And the few I did push down too far can I use them or do I take apart and salvage what I can.

[AR guy]

Ok I answered to soon I only read steve4102, so you can see the crimp. I can't notice it what am I doing wrong if that's the case or are the dies bad I got them used on eBay so that can be the problem. My 9mm I bought new rcbs carbide, maybe I should just get a new set.

[cycloneman]

Originally Posted by AR guy

Ok I answered to soon I only read steve4102, so you can see the crimp. I can't notice it what am I doing wrong if that's the case or are the dies bad I got them used on eBay so that can be the problem. My 9mm I bought new rcbs carbide, maybe I should just get a new set.

No

I cant speak for those dies i dont use them. I am not sure but i dont think all rifle dies may give you a crimp. I really cant speak for your dies I only have used lee. Hang on

ok i have lee dies and the instructions says if a crimp is desired, screw the die in slightly and test until the proper crimp is formed. The bullet must have a crimping groove or it cannot be crimped. Cases must be trimmed to the same length to provide a unifrom crimp. That is the directions i have. Now like i said i dont know if all rifle dies are gona give you the option to crimp.

But i would not throw them away. I would simply add the lee factory crimp die and use that. It is a much easier die/crimp to use.

Now i allways had problems with the bullet seating die when it came time to crimp that is why i now use the factory crimp die for all my loading. Much easier and way more professional in my opinion. Get yourslef one and never look back.

Now as far as the pistol dies that is a different case. You shouldn't have a problem with them since they are straight walled and you probably dont have a length problem/neck to deal with.

[AR guy]

Alright I'll give it a try, it's gotta be cheaper than a new set. My instructions say that they crimp. But I will go get one. Is it a Universal crimp die or are the caliber specific? Thanks for the info.

[cycloneman]

One more plus for the factory crimp die. Trim length is not critical. Just make sure they are not too long / out of speck. Too short and you will not get a crimp. Anywhere inbetween and your ok.

You also not have to have a crimp groove in the projectile.

[cycloneman]

Originally Posted by AR guy

Alright I'll give it a try, it's gotta be cheaper than a new set. My instructions say that they crimp. But I will go get one. Is it a Universal crimp die or are the caliber specific? Thanks for the info.

Cal specific.

When you get one and use it you will be happy. Its the only way to go.

[AR guy]

Ok cool thanks Cycloneman.

[243winxb]

http://www.exteriorballistics.com/re...sgunreload.cfm Read the Neck Tension part by Sierra. To much crimp & you bulge the shoulder, resulting in chambering problems. No crimp needed. If you feel you must crimp, taper crimp. The new taper crimp dies now available are more forgiving with brass of a different trim length.

[AR guy]

That's exactly what mine look like. Ill take apart and salvage. Thanks.

[soundguy]

did you FL resize your brass?

[AR guy]

I'm still new soundguy and ignorant what's FL stand for? If I think what it means full-length my shell. I made it to spec of the Speer #14 2.60" +-.1000

[steve4102]

Originally Posted by AR guy

I'm still new soundguy and ignorant what's FL stand for? If I think what it means full-length my shell. I made it to spec of the Speer #14 2.60" +-.1000

Yes, FL means Full Length size the case.

If you decide to give the Lee Factory Crimp die a shot, don't over do it. The amount of crimp is adjusted by screwing the die body in or out of the press.

I use what I call a Medium-Light crimp. I can see it, I can feel it when crimping and the bullet will have a slight dent or cannelure when pulled. A slight cannelure, almost none, to much crimp can deform the bullet and accuracy may suffer.

Here is a little test I did last summer.
The left target(heavy crimp) was with the LFCD screwed in as far as it could go without damaging the die. It put a deep dent/cannelure in the bullet.

[AR guy]

Yeah I'm gunna try the lee crimp. I'm actually getting ready to take a ride to cabelas for supplies. Gunna see if they have one.