45/70 gvt. - The Firearms Forum

time2shoot · 12-02-2012, 11:46 AM

My friends father inlaw is wanting me to reload some 45/70 govt. loads for him. Not a problume usaly, but here is my question.
He will be shooting it through his old sharps.
This is not a madern sharps, it is an original. still in great fiering order,well taken cared of all thease years.

I don't want to damage the rifle.
I was thinking soft lead cast bullets, I know it will cause leading. but if I use coper jaketed bullets could they not damage the rifle. being as old as it is?
It is in great shape. But i just want to make shure.
Any thoughts?

Alpo · 12-02-2012, 12:39 PM

405 cast lead bullet on top of 50 grains of 2F black powder, with something on top of the powder to take up the space (cardboard spacers [what the Army used], 410 shotgun felt wads, grits). I'd be much more worried about smokeless powder hurting the gun, than I would a jacketed bullet.

JLA · 12-02-2012, 01:00 PM

I used to shoot an old remington rolling block Dale. Just use any cast 405 gr lead bullet and trailboss. Run them at 1200-1400 fps and it wont hurt the rifle.

Other than that, BP, as Alpo mentions, is the only other way to go

time2shoot · 12-02-2012, 06:17 PM

Ok thanks. This one is new to me. I would hate to ruin such a beautiful firearm

time2shoot · 12-02-2012, 06:35 PM

1 more thing what would be the overall cartridge length be.
do they even make a gage cartridge that I can you check that with?

JLA · 12-02-2012, 07:22 PM

those single shots are not at all COAL sensitive. Just seat the bullet tot he cannelure and use a charge of TB that fills the case to 90% capacity. prolly be around about 12 gr or so right off the top of my head for a 405 gr bullet..

JLA · 12-02-2012, 07:25 PM

Cartridge: 45-70 Government (Trapdoor Rifles)*
Load Type: Rifle
Starting Loads

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Maximum Loads

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bullet Weight (Gr.) Manufacturer Powder Bullet Diam. C.O.L. Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

300 GR. CAST LFP IMR Trail Boss .458" 2.465" 14.0 1199 19,400 CUP 16.5 1285 20,900 CUP
385 GR. CAST LFP IMR Trail Boss .458" 2.505" 14.0 1075 19,400 CUP 16.0 1142 23,200 CUP
405 GR. CAST LFP IMR Trail Boss .458" 2.540" 12.0 971 24,500 CUP 13.0 1007 25,600 CUP
485 GR. CAST LFP IMR Trail Boss .458" 2.540" 8.0 699 17,100 CUP 10.0 804 23,300 CUP

JLA · 12-02-2012, 07:26 PM

Wasnt too far off eh..

time2shoot · 12-03-2012, 10:11 AM

nope. thanks guys.

bluesea112 · 12-07-2012, 01:02 AM

If you load them with BP, don't forget to remind him to run hot water through the barrel after shooting. Potassium Nitrate can only be disolved with water. An oiled patch alone will not clean it. Water first, then oil. I know it sounds obvious, but it is easy to forget when you are used to shooting smokeless.

XP100 · 12-07-2012, 04:21 AM

Look up load data for the BP substitute Blackhorn 209.

JLA · 12-07-2012, 10:28 PM

Hey charles.. I need some BP. You got any left in your concrete mixer?

12-02-2012, 11:46 AM	#1
time2shoot Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Brandon SD Contributor Posts: 2,612	45/70 gvt. My friends father inlaw is wanting me to reload some 45/70 govt. loads for him. Not a problume usaly, but here is my question. He will be shooting it through his old sharps. This is not a madern sharps, it is an original. still in great fiering order,well taken cared of all thease years. I don't want to damage the rifle. I was thinking soft lead cast bullets, I know it will cause leading. but if I use coper jaketed bullets could they not damage the rifle. being as old as it is? It is in great shape. But i just want to make shure. Any thoughts? __________________ I AM A VETERAN MY OATH OF ENLISTMENT HAS NO EXPIRATION DATE! -->

12-02-2012, 12:39 PM	#2
Alpo Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: NW Florida Posts: 8,772	Re: 45/70 gvt. 405 cast lead bullet on top of 50 grains of 2F black powder, with something on top of the powder to take up the space (cardboard spacers [what the Army used], 410 shotgun felt wads, grits). I'd be much more worried about smokeless powder hurting the gun, than I would a jacketed bullet. __________________ Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy, and taste good with catsup - George of Lod, Year of Our Lord 297 I always take precautions. Beware the Evil Bullet Fairies.

12-02-2012, 01:00 PM	#3
JLA TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Heart Of Texas Contributor Posts: 17,407	Re: 45/70 gvt. I used to shoot an old remington rolling block Dale. Just use any cast 405 gr lead bullet and trailboss. Run them at 1200-1400 fps and it wont hurt the rifle. Other than that, BP, as Alpo mentions, is the only other way to go __________________ It takes 43 muscles to frown, 17 to smile, and 3 for proper trigger squeeze. The latest caliber or gear is no substitute for experience and skill. Rifles and cartridges don't make hits -- shooters do. Fact of life: After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF!

12-02-2012, 06:17 PM	#4
time2shoot Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Brandon SD Contributor Posts: 2,612	Re: 45/70 gvt. Ok thanks. This one is new to me. I would hate to ruin such a beautiful firearm __________________ I AM A VETERAN MY OATH OF ENLISTMENT HAS NO EXPIRATION DATE!

12-02-2012, 06:35 PM	#5
time2shoot Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Brandon SD Contributor Posts: 2,612	Re: 45/70 gvt. 1 more thing what would be the overall cartridge length be. do they even make a gage cartridge that I can you check that with? __________________ I AM A VETERAN MY OATH OF ENLISTMENT HAS NO EXPIRATION DATE!

12-02-2012, 07:22 PM	#6
JLA TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Heart Of Texas Contributor Posts: 17,407	Re: 45/70 gvt. those single shots are not at all COAL sensitive. Just seat the bullet tot he cannelure and use a charge of TB that fills the case to 90% capacity. prolly be around about 12 gr or so right off the top of my head for a 405 gr bullet.. __________________ It takes 43 muscles to frown, 17 to smile, and 3 for proper trigger squeeze. The latest caliber or gear is no substitute for experience and skill. Rifles and cartridges don't make hits -- shooters do. Fact of life: After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF! Last edited by JLA; 12-02-2012 at 07:25 PM.. Reason: Spelling

12-02-2012, 07:25 PM	#7
JLA TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Heart Of Texas Contributor Posts: 17,407	Re: 45/70 gvt. Cartridge: 45-70 Government (Trapdoor Rifles)* Load Type: Rifle Starting Loads -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Maximum Loads -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bullet Weight (Gr.) Manufacturer Powder Bullet Diam. C.O.L. Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 300 GR. CAST LFP IMR Trail Boss .458" 2.465" 14.0 1199 19,400 CUP 16.5 1285 20,900 CUP 385 GR. CAST LFP IMR Trail Boss .458" 2.505" 14.0 1075 19,400 CUP 16.0 1142 23,200 CUP 405 GR. CAST LFP IMR Trail Boss .458" 2.540" 12.0 971 24,500 CUP 13.0 1007 25,600 CUP 485 GR. CAST LFP IMR Trail Boss .458" 2.540" 8.0 699 17,100 CUP 10.0 804 23,300 CUP __________________ It takes 43 muscles to frown, 17 to smile, and 3 for proper trigger squeeze. The latest caliber or gear is no substitute for experience and skill. Rifles and cartridges don't make hits -- shooters do. Fact of life: After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF!

12-02-2012, 07:26 PM	#8
JLA TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Heart Of Texas Contributor Posts: 17,407	Re: 45/70 gvt. Wasnt too far off eh.. __________________ It takes 43 muscles to frown, 17 to smile, and 3 for proper trigger squeeze. The latest caliber or gear is no substitute for experience and skill. Rifles and cartridges don't make hits -- shooters do. Fact of life: After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF!

12-03-2012, 10:11 AM	#9
time2shoot Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Brandon SD Contributor Posts: 2,612	Re: 45/70 gvt. nope. thanks guys. __________________ I AM A VETERAN MY OATH OF ENLISTMENT HAS NO EXPIRATION DATE!

12-07-2012, 01:02 AM	#10
bluesea112 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: West, TX Contributor Posts: 1,262	Re: 45/70 gvt. If you load them with BP, don't forget to remind him to run hot water through the barrel after shooting. Potassium Nitrate can only be disolved with water. An oiled patch alone will not clean it. Water first, then oil. I know it sounds obvious, but it is easy to forget when you are used to shooting smokeless. Last edited by bluesea112; 12-07-2012 at 01:06 AM..

12-07-2012, 04:21 AM	#11
XP100 V.I.P. Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 75	Re: 45/70 gvt. Look up load data for the BP substitute Blackhorn 209.

12-07-2012, 10:28 PM	#12
JLA TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Heart Of Texas Contributor Posts: 17,407	Re: 45/70 gvt. Hey charles.. I need some BP. You got any left in your concrete mixer? __________________ It takes 43 muscles to frown, 17 to smile, and 3 for proper trigger squeeze. The latest caliber or gear is no substitute for experience and skill. Rifles and cartridges don't make hits -- shooters do. Fact of life: After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF!