Post '86 Loophole? - The Firearms Forum

kurtzbm · 05-18-2004, 09:41 PM

From what I understand, only law enforcement can purchase post '86 full-auto weapons.

Does this mean that if you get yourself deputized and work part-time at the local sherrif dept. you can purchase newer weapons?

LIKTOSHOOT · 05-18-2004, 10:05 PM

Yes, with a letter from the CLEO. But who will pay??? Not exactly a needed item in many LEO offices. AND it is theirs.....not yours. By the way.....it`s a loophole about like the gunshow loophole.

LTS

CountryGunsmith · 05-19-2004, 07:16 AM

Exactly right.

The firearm MUST be transferred to the AGENCY, not the individual officer. Upon leaving employment with that agency, the firearm is either retained by the agency, transferred to another agency or transferred to a licensed SOT/dealer who can only transfer to another agency.

The kicker is that the post-'86 guns are MUCH less expensive, because of this.

45Smashemflat · 05-19-2004, 04:31 PM

Its a great lesson in supply and demand. The supply of individually transferrable Class III guns is fixed. Dealer Samples/LEO units are not. Go to ImpactGuns.com and look at the basic M16 and the diff in price between the transferrable units and the Dealer Samples - OUCH. What a bummer....

Although - that makes transferrable Class II weapons a decent investment - interest is certainly there!!

kurtzbm · 05-19-2004, 06:21 PM

How do personal security companies get them?

Newer weapons have a greater appeal to me.

It would be real nice to be able to get a new H&K XM8 when they come out. I would like to try out a .223 weapon that has little to no recoil on full auto.

I was thinking that if I could establish a "personal security company" that would own the weapons, the corporation could own the weapons.

In the end, I guess I could plan a decade out to open a gun shop and become a dealer.

You can fire the weapons if you're a dealer, right?

stash247 · 06-05-2004, 01:26 PM

Under the law, the only "persona security companies" eligable to purchase post '86 class III weapons, are companies like the FBI, CIA, DEA, ATF, etc. If it's not governmental, it's not eligable.
Now, such a civilian company could legally buy pre-86, resistered firearms, but "Deep Pockets" would likely be required.
Yes, as a Special Occupational Taxpayer, you can shoot your 'dealer samples', but, no, they will never be yours, as personal property, because they are only transferable to a police or other government agency. And, there is a small matter of the annual tax, and license fee, to consider.

SOT_II · 08-08-2004, 03:01 PM

ABSOLUTELY NOT!

Only Departments, Agencies or Organizations that are legitimate law enforcment or Military can. Individual officers MAY NOT personally own a post sample MG.

The only other allowence is FFL's with a SOT. They can buy and sell post samples. )7/C2's like me can buy, sell, and make post samples.

In the instances of buying and selling you need a CLEO letter for buying and if selling to another dealer. For making, an 07/C2 can build them without a letter.

SOT_II · 08-08-2004, 03:06 PM

This is not entirely true...there are TWO types of dealer samples. Pre May dealer samples, that can be owned by SOT while a dealer or MFG...and can be kept after they quit being an FFL/SOT....

Post samples can only be owned by a dealer (SOT) while a dealer (SOT)...when done they have to be sold or destroyed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stash247

Under the law, the only "persona security companies" eligable to purchase post '86 class III weapons, are companies like the FBI, CIA, DEA, ATF, etc. If it's not governmental, it's not eligable.
Now, such a civilian company could legally buy pre-86, resistered firearms, but "Deep Pockets" would likely be required.
Yes, as a Special Occupational Taxpayer, you can shoot your 'dealer samples', but, no, they will never be yours, as personal property, because they are only transferable to a police or other government agency. And, there is a small matter of the annual tax, and license fee, to consider.

05-18-2004, 09:41 PM	#1
kurtzbm Member Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3	Post '86 Loophole? From what I understand, only law enforcement can purchase post '86 full-auto weapons. Does this mean that if you get yourself deputized and work part-time at the local sherrif dept. you can purchase newer weapons? -->

05-19-2004, 07:16 AM	#3
CountryGunsmith Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Deep Piney Woods of East Texas Posts: 5,116	Exactly right. The firearm MUST be transferred to the AGENCY, not the individual officer. Upon leaving employment with that agency, the firearm is either retained by the agency, transferred to another agency or transferred to a licensed SOT/dealer who can only transfer to another agency. The kicker is that the post-'86 guns are MUCH less expensive, because of this. __________________ The autonomic nervous system provides for involuntary muscle function - the work of breathing, digestion, and so forth. On some folks, that's a pure waste of ingenuity.

05-19-2004, 06:21 PM	#5
kurtzbm Member Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3	How do security teams get them? How do personal security companies get them? Newer weapons have a greater appeal to me. It would be real nice to be able to get a new H&K XM8 when they come out. I would like to try out a .223 weapon that has little to no recoil on full auto. I was thinking that if I could establish a "personal security company" that would own the weapons, the corporation could own the weapons. In the end, I guess I could plan a decade out to open a gun shop and become a dealer. You can fire the weapons if you're a dealer, right?

06-05-2004, 01:26 PM	#6
stash247 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Central Texas Posts: 2,815	Under the law, the only "persona security companies" eligable to purchase post '86 class III weapons, are companies like the FBI, CIA, DEA, ATF, etc. If it's not governmental, it's not eligable. Now, such a civilian company could legally buy pre-86, resistered firearms, but "Deep Pockets" would likely be required. Yes, as a Special Occupational Taxpayer, you can shoot your 'dealer samples', but, no, they will never be yours, as personal property, because they are only transferable to a police or other government agency. And, there is a small matter of the annual tax, and license fee, to consider. __________________ Don't start no s**t and there won't be none, Terry

08-08-2004, 03:01 PM	#7
SOT_II V.I.P. Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: The Berkshires Posts: 80	Re: Post '86 Loophole? ABSOLUTELY NOT! Only Departments, Agencies or Organizations that are legitimate law enforcment or Military can. Individual officers MAY NOT personally own a post sample MG. The only other allowence is FFL's with a SOT. They can buy and sell post samples. )7/C2's like me can buy, sell, and make post samples. In the instances of buying and selling you need a CLEO letter for buying and if selling to another dealer. For making, an 07/C2 can build them without a letter.

05-18-2004, 10:05 PM	#2
LIKTOSHOOT Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Posts: 9,367	Yes, with a letter from the CLEO. But who will pay??? Not exactly a needed item in many LEO offices. AND it is theirs.....not yours. By the way.....it`s a loophole about like the gunshow loophole. LTS

05-19-2004, 04:31 PM	#4
45Smashemflat Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 1,494	Its a great lesson in supply and demand. The supply of individually transferrable Class III guns is fixed. Dealer Samples/LEO units are not. Go to ImpactGuns.com and look at the basic M16 and the diff in price between the transferrable units and the Dealer Samples - OUCH. What a bummer.... Although - that makes transferrable Class II weapons a decent investment - interest is certainly there!!