Iver Johnson and cycle works - The Firearms Forum

mittelmeier · 06-19-2006, 08:11 PM

I recently purchased an Iver Johnson and Cycle Works .38 breaktop revolver. It is hammerless. The gun has a 3 1/4 inch barrel. The serial number on the gun is D21242. On the butt of the gun it says jun 16 96 aug. 25 then below it I can make out p(?) t 16 04 pats pend. On the top of the barrel it reads iver johnson arms and cycle works, below that it reads something burg mass. usa. If anyone could tell me the year of the gun and what kind or cartridge it fires I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks. Greg

southernshooter · 06-19-2006, 10:17 PM

Welcome Mittel, can you get me some pictures of the whole gun?

mittelmeier · 06-20-2006, 07:05 AM

Xracer · 06-20-2006, 07:18 AM

Hi Mittelmeier......and welcome to TFF.

What you have is an Iver Johnson Safety Automatic Double-Action (also known as the Safety Hammerless). The caliber is .38 Smith & Wesson (not .38 Special). The address you can't read is Fitchburg, Mass.

IJ made many hundreds of thousands of these guns between 1893 and 1950, so they're not rare or very collectable. Your gun appears to have aftermarket grips, but that doesn't hurt the value much.

Blue Book value:

98% - $100
95% - $95
90% - $80
80% - $75
70% - $65

b.goforth · 06-20-2006, 01:10 PM

greg,
when you asked about this gun on armscollectors.com you failed to say any thing about the third patent date (sept.6.04). i answered your question there using just the two patent date marking that was used between 1905 and 1906. the three patent date marking was used between 1907 and 1911. this era takes in parts of the second and third models. the third model was manufactured 1909-1941. this revolver is a large frame 38 S&W caliber third model safety automatic hammerless revolver. serial number D21242 was manufactured in 1911, there were 21,800 of this model manufactured that year. if in good condition it should be safe with modern standard velocity ammo. the values already given you are good except the pictures show this revolver has little of the original blue finish, replacement grips, repair to the exector mechannism and a replacement hinge screw. as a collector of iver johnson's arms & cycle works firearms the top dollar i would offer for this revolver would be the blue book's low figure of $65.
bill

mittelmeier · 06-20-2006, 02:38 PM

I would like the thank everyone for the information they provided me. That was all very helpful and know how much it is worth makes me glad I paid what I did for it and not more. Again, thank you all very much.

Xracer · 06-21-2006, 07:05 AM

You're most welcome Mittlemeier......lots of good info, and lots of fine people here on TFF. We hope you'll stick around and become a regular visitor here.

06-19-2006, 08:11 PM	#1
mittelmeier Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 6	Iver Johnson and cycle works I recently purchased an Iver Johnson and Cycle Works .38 breaktop revolver. It is hammerless. The gun has a 3 1/4 inch barrel. The serial number on the gun is D21242. On the butt of the gun it says jun 16 96 aug. 25 then below it I can make out p(?) t 16 04 pats pend. On the top of the barrel it reads iver johnson arms and cycle works, below that it reads something burg mass. usa. If anyone could tell me the year of the gun and what kind or cartridge it fires I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks. Greg -->

06-19-2006, 10:17 PM	#2
southernshooter Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Deep South Mississippi Posts: 5,943	Re: Iver Johnson and cycle works Welcome Mittel, can you get me some pictures of the whole gun? __________________ Only you can see this

06-20-2006, 07:05 AM	#3
mittelmeier Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 6	Re: Iver Johnson and cycle works

06-20-2006, 07:18 AM	#4
Xracer TFF Admin Staff Mediator Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Minn-eeee-sota, ya, sure, you bet! Posts: 9,144	Re: Iver Johnson and cycle works Hi Mittelmeier......and welcome to TFF. What you have is an Iver Johnson Safety Automatic Double-Action (also known as the Safety Hammerless). The caliber is .38 Smith & Wesson (not .38 Special). The address you can't read is Fitchburg, Mass. IJ made many hundreds of thousands of these guns between 1893 and 1950, so they're not rare or very collectable. Your gun appears to have aftermarket grips, but that doesn't hurt the value much. Blue Book value: 98% - $100 95% - $95 90% - $80 80% - $75 70% - $65

06-20-2006, 01:10 PM	#5
b.goforth Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: houston, tx Posts: 3,174	Re: Iver Johnson and cycle works greg, when you asked about this gun on armscollectors.com you failed to say any thing about the third patent date (sept.6.04). i answered your question there using just the two patent date marking that was used between 1905 and 1906. the three patent date marking was used between 1907 and 1911. this era takes in parts of the second and third models. the third model was manufactured 1909-1941. this revolver is a large frame 38 S&W caliber third model safety automatic hammerless revolver. serial number D21242 was manufactured in 1911, there were 21,800 of this model manufactured that year. if in good condition it should be safe with modern standard velocity ammo. the values already given you are good except the pictures show this revolver has little of the original blue finish, replacement grips, repair to the exector mechannism and a replacement hinge screw. as a collector of iver johnson's arms & cycle works firearms the top dollar i would offer for this revolver would be the blue book's low figure of $65. bill __________________ Author: Iver Johnson's Arms & Cycle Works 1871-1993 H&R Arms Company 1871-1986 (due spring 2010) available from www.gunshowbooks.com website; iverjohnsoncollector.x10hosting.com

06-20-2006, 02:38 PM	#6
mittelmeier Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 6	Re: Iver Johnson and cycle works I would like the thank everyone for the information they provided me. That was all very helpful and know how much it is worth makes me glad I paid what I did for it and not more. Again, thank you all very much.

06-21-2006, 07:05 AM	#7
Xracer TFF Admin Staff Mediator Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Minn-eeee-sota, ya, sure, you bet! Posts: 9,144	Re: Iver Johnson and cycle works You're most welcome Mittlemeier......lots of good info, and lots of fine people here on TFF. We hope you'll stick around and become a regular visitor here.