Rifle for shots up to 1000yds

[LongRifles]

Originally Posted by DeViNe

LongRifles that is amazing! How much does one of those run?

How is everyones feelings on a 7mm magnum?

Assuming you go top shelf on all components, figure a break down like this:

Barrel: 300-350
Action: 1200-1500 (depending on features)
Stock: 250-350
R. Sight: 550
R. Sight Aperture: 100-200
F sight assy: 200 (my design)
F sight globe: 200
Trigger: 600 installed (my design)
Assorted small parts: 300
Labor:

Thread/chamber/crown/polish/engrave: 250
"Stock" the b. Action: 1,500
Paint: From 200

This works up to around $6,200.00

The rifle with the wood stock is my personal. It appraises for about 9K. This is largely due to the grade of wood used. Special Select English Walnut.

The "nesika" on the forend is inlaid with pewter.

A few other features are in this gun also that make it different from main stream Palma rifles.

Here's one more example. This belongs to a friend who lives down in Colorado. He shot for the 2003 US team. This one was professionally photographed by a guy in Seattle. Looks pretty cool. The paint is "2001 Suzuki GSX-R600 Gas tank blue".

[JLA]

HOLY CRAP!!!, with an investment like that, it better be able to cook dinner, and clean the house...

[stash247]

JLA, the reason divorces are expensive, is because they are WORTH IT; either of those rifles is much less than half the legal expense, for my last!
Spend the money, and buy a quality rifle, one with a verifiable 'pedigree', and 'history', or wail in the woods, wishing you had!
Sorry about the numbers, I wish the were all 3 digits, and low threes, but that ain't how it works!
Think about what you are asking; a man spends half his life, learning his trade, some better than most, and he should work for little to nothing?
I do a small gunsmithing business, 'on the side', for projects that interest me, if they do not, there is not enough money...
But, If I tell you it will shoot 'under a dime' at 100 yds, I will also send the target, and a flap from the ammo used, for confirmation.
I do little but serious rimfire rifles, and generally, work without a 'budget', unless the project was one of my own rifles, sinse there is no telling what problems may be encountered, when it arrives.
My 44 1/2 Stevens, I have about $1600 in 'real money' in, and it is my own (read that, all the work was free) rifle! A high end barrel can be in and of itself, a big bunch of money, fitting it, chambering it, etc, requires a ton of money in machinery that does not exist in most shops.
The Sheldon, and Cadillac, lathes in my shop I could not replace for less than about 6K, each, in their present condition; I neither sleep with,nor desire to, with either, but they gotta be there, for me to do my business; who, then, should pay for them; me, or the folks for whom I do the near impossible work?
I offer, quality costs money, high quality, a lot more, and perfection is priceless!
More than one rifle having gone thru my shop was shipped with 'invoice to follow' status, yet never have I been 'stiffed' by the shooter; often the check comes in, before the bill goes out, and I have to send 'change'!
No matter, except to emphasize the point; a 'really good rifle' is the product of a 'really good' 'smith, who spent alot of time and money, to get there!
Pay the two dollars, or build it yourself.
In the hallway is a rifle, a 52-D Winchester, with a Canjar set trigger, a Clyde Hart (1 1/2", end to end) Barrel that I paid more for, than a cheap car should cost.
Took me three months to get it home, as i was 100 miles from there, on a motorcycle, when I bought it; no matter.
Fine rifle, cost too much, shoots well, and mine for less than I could build it, but a lotta money, just the same.
Simply, the price of quality.

[LongRifles]

Originally Posted by JLA

HOLY CRAP!!!, with an investment like that, it better be able to cook dinner, and clean the house...

Well they don't and these are not examples of what you must have in order to play in this arena. They are examples of what ends people go to when they take a very serious and committed approach to LR shooting.

There are many a hard hitting Remmy 700's on the firing points of 1000 yard matches all over the US. There's also a number of other action manufacturers besides Nesika.

Some guns look like they were stocked with a fence post. Others look as though they were patterned from a science fiction movie.

Common denominators to all good LR guns:

The meat of your budget must go to a perishable item, the barrel.

Second is sights/scope.

Tasco isn't going to cut it here.

A Leupold is the bare minimum

If you go irons, then Warner Tool Company is the only place to do your shopping.

Stocks can range from mild to wild. It's what fits well that matters.

Notice trigger isn't mentioned. I personally feel that a lousy trigger will still yield respectable results if a person practices with it and applies the fundamentals.



Triggers have nothing to do with accuracy, they just release the firing pin. They do have influence on how we are able to break shots though and that can be overcome with practice.

The rack grade M-16 or AR 15 trigger is a prime example.

You can do all this for about 3500 bucks. Any less and I really feel you are sacrificing points/accuracy.


Just get out the Visa and get to it. It's why they space the payments 30 days apart right?

[stash247]

Originally Posted by LongRifles

Well they don't and these are not examples of what you must have in order to play in this arena. They are examples of what ends



Triggers have nothing to do with accuracy, they just release the firing pin. They do have influence on how we are able to break shots though and that can be overcome with practice.



Just get out the Visa and get to it. It's why they space the payments 30 days apart right?

Long Rifle, you are correct that a trigger just releases the firing pin, but, as it is the ultimate 'interface' between man and machine,I feel you are a bit lacking in reverence for this 'little piece', the single 'point of contact, between shooter, and his gear.
I just spent the price of a 'beater' car, with a barrel maker, and, while it does not make me happy to do so, I buy 'Cadillac' quality barrels, and no other, because they are truly the heart and soul of accuracy, well fitted.
Douglass has provided some awesome tubes for hunting, and other 'fun guns', and with them I have no issues; Krieger, OTOH, has provided stress free, paper punch accuracy barrels, that simply shoot into one hole, until you wear them out.
They got a bunch of my money, earlier today,
But triggers, bro! They are the heart and soul of an accurate rifle! if you cannot loose a round, as conditions are right, without 'fighting' your gear, you are working very much 'uphill', in this game, to your disadvantage!
Most of my 'accuracy' rifles wear triggers, in the two ounce range, some, without even provision for a safety, but the rifle cannot fire, with the bolt up, so this is a 'non issue'
Respectfully, I suggest that no rifle can shoot better than it's operator allows, and the trigger is the 'interface', between them; the best is the only answer, if one truly strives for accuracy!

[LongRifles]

Originally Posted by stash247

Long Rifle, you are correct that a trigger just releases the firing pin, but, as it is the ultimate 'interface' between man and machine,I feel you are a bit lacking in reverence for this 'little piece', the single 'point of contact, between shooter, and his gear.
I just spent the price of a 'beater' car, with a barrel maker, and, while it does not make me happy to do so, I buy 'Cadillac' quality barrels, and no other, because they are truly the heart and soul of accuracy, well fitted.
Douglass has provided some awesome tubes for hunting, and other 'fun guns', and with them I have no issues; Krieger, OTOH, has provided stress free, paper punch accuracy barrels, that simply shoot into one hole, until you wear them out.
They got a bunch of my money, earlier today,
But triggers, bro! They are the heart and soul of an accurate rifle! if you cannot loose a round, as conditions are right, without 'fighting' your gear, you are working very much 'uphill', in this game, to your disadvantage!
Most of my 'accuracy' rifles wear triggers, in the two ounce range, some, without even provision for a safety, but the rifle cannot fire, with the bolt up, so this is a 'non issue'
Respectfully, I suggest that no rifle can shoot better than it's operator allows, and the trigger is the 'interface', between them; the best is the only answer, if one truly strives for accuracy!

Ok, you got me. I said what I said earlier with the pretext of working within a rigid budget. I failed to mention that though. I'm also a bit of a hypocrite I guess because everyone one of my rifles either has a jewel set up to go off with the squeeze of a good fart. My palma rifle has a 500 dollar Grunig and Elmiger trigger on it and I recently spent another four hundred on a Carl Kenyon trigger.

I've also been developing a true two stage for Remingtons that will work on international palma rifles and course guns.

So I'll go eat one of my shoes now.

Thanks, I hate the taste of shoes. Especially mine cause my feet are rotten

OK, buy the best of everything and be done with it. Then bring it to me to fit up and just smile and grit your teeth as you sign the CC slip.

"Lean on the pen a little harder sir, you'll be allright. . ."

[JLA]

Dont get me wrong guys, i do spend a ton of money on firearms, i just never really took a fancy to those real shiney lookin ones like the one LongRifles posted above. It is indeed a very nice weapon, but to me, just a toy. My interests lie with precision usage of practical weapons, by this, i mean a well fitted M1A, or a heavy barrelled bolt gun would be on the most expensive side of my wish list.

[LongRifles]

Originally Posted by JLA

Dont get me wrong guys, i do spend a ton of money on firearms, i just never really took a fancy to those real shiney lookin ones like the one LongRifles posted above. It is indeed a very nice weapon, but to me, just a toy. My interests lie with precision usage of practical weapons, by this, i mean a well fitted M1A, or a heavy barrelled bolt gun would be on the most expensive side of my wish list.

So perhaps something along these lines then?

[stash247]

Longrifle, I am impressed, not just with the rifles, but that tasteful Gerstner Toolbox, on the bench, behind!
You really do go First Class!
My tastes run to Single shot, falling block actions, and pretty wood; their would really be some howls of pain, if a few of these fellers really knew what exceptonal wood can cost, and how quickly getting in a hurry, instead of 'making haste slowly' , can provide some of the most expensive firewood on the planet!
Me, I drive an old truck, all my dogs are 'free dogs', as in 'rescues' from hopeless situations, owners, or both; they take a while to 'retrain' but it is a pleasureable 'break', from the bench, just to go out and work with them for a hour or two, making notes, all the while, about the progress they are making, and areas in need of more work; but even the dogs, unfortunately, I seem to have "Cadillac" taste; there's not a one that could have been bought, at 10-12 weeks, for three figures!
The good news, once you have 'ruined', or someone else has, a dog, repair is possible!
I have a five year old Australian Cattle Dog bitch (Many would call these 'Red', or 'Blue' 'Heelers', from the way they work stock), but there are no cheap, quality pups.
Brandy has been here almost a year and a half, and has come from a too early and too often bred , and abused, terribly timid (Heelers bite, release, bite again, when scared, as a rule, OK on a ranch, not OK in town, but I have seen only two that would run from the sound of a strange voice, at the door, both had the physical and emotional scars of a lot of abuse.
Both were successfully 'salvaged'; one placed on a ranch, north of here, in exchange for the use of the rancher's stock, pens, and land, to train others; the other will never leave my side!
In both cases, the dogs are a tremendous asset, in 'retraining others' because they are as close to 'perfect' examples of what a good stock dog can, and should be, and the younger animals follow quickly, behavior they can watch, and see, bringing praise, and treats.
Either would fetch 'mid fours', if offered for sale, but, obviously they will never be sold.
Now, if I were a rich rancher, I don't know that the time I spent on dogs, would be well spent; I'm not, and they, like fine rifles, are worth the time and money to make as perfect as man's hand can make them!
When I tell you I live in town, understand, it is the seventh largest city in the nation; the only time Brandy's on a lead is twice a year, at the vet's, because he chews my ass, if she is not! Interestingly, she has both ends of the leash, causes no problems, and out of the waiting room, we laugh about the fact!
To those of you who wince at the cost of a good rifle, think about what one 'bite' off lead, could be worth!
I offer this analogy simply to put some 'real world numbers' on things, and totally agree with Long Rifle.
I know an Ex Air Force Shooter, who reads wind, mirage, light, like a book; the best spotter a shooter could ask for, since he quit shooting, and I love to have him on my scope, for the advice.
When he was shooting, his rifles always cost more than his cars; go figger!
But tell me a sport, where the sportsman could do better than his gear would allow!
If you are a member of the Texas Rifle Association, the 'JJ Conway' Trophy may ring a bell; that's the guy; three or four years ago, in Canada, he 'out pointed' the guy who won the 'Queen's Medal' but could not claim it, as it must be awarded to a Canadian Citizen.
That's "Cadillac Gear", and has a bit of expense, but as Longrifle said, "for everything else, there's Mastercard"

[JLA]

very nice, however, still probably a tad overdone.

[stash247]

JLA, your reference was a bit vague; overdone? How can one have too much rifle, or too good a dog?'
I suggest, the best is none too good enough, anything less, is lacking.

[LongRifles]

Stash,

thanks for the kind remarks.

If you have a stiffy for falling blocks there is someone I encourage you to talk to.

My old boss, Cyle Miller. 2nd gen owner of Miller Arms.

Cyle was the VP of manufacturing for Dakota Arms/Nesika prior to the "big ugly" in July of 2006.

Miller Arms is quite arguably the most over engineered, over acheiving falling block single shot out there.

I mean that in a good way. It's pretty nice stuff.

Dern nice.

Cyle is in St Onge, SD. Give him a call. He's listed.

Again, thanks for the remarks. This bench and tool box represents my reloading room at the house. I'm bummed though. No one said anything about the two grand in Mitutoyo micrometers sitting off to the left there.

Here's real work getting done:

[LongRifles]

While some may view my taste in bolt guns as "too much" or gawdy.
I promise you these are working guns. Not trailer queens who spend life on a bench.

My M-40 wanna be shown above is the best example.

I've thrown this rifle off of two story buildings.
I've pitched it across parking lots.
I've stood on it.
I've beat the piss out of it

Yet it still keeps chugging along.

There's also a $2500 dollar piece of glass sitting on it that has a chromoly steel body built specifically to withstand this kind of abuse.

There's more to that gun than what you see also. The stock has been heavily modified internally. It's a baseball bat now for all intents and purposes.

I have another rifle that I've built for a friend that is this way. It served well over here in Iraq during the first two years of the war. Its a Winchester P64 M70 with a one piece billet bolt and a scope mount TIG welded to the action.

It's also taken its share of spills and bumps yet it keeps on kicking out 1/3moa groups no matter what.

My 22-250 has its own little history. That's the black stocked rifle with the shorter barrel shown above. I built that rifle start to finish in 7 hours. It is an example of every way you should not build a rifle that is meant to be highly accurate.

I did it to prove some points to people getting on my nerves.

No recoil lug
No bedding
It's a repeater
It's got a plunger eject
It's got a muzzle brake.

This gun shouldn't shoot according to many.

.098" spread for five shots with factory loaded black hills 55 grain ballistic tips. It's most accurate gun I own.

The big boomer there is a 300 338 Lapua Magnum.

My 4400fps Prairie dog killing machine. Yes, you can sling a 125 grainer that fast.
You can also wipe a dog mound off the map.

The green monster is my 6.5-284 heavy deer gun. 600 yard shots are easy when you have a cartridge designed for 1000 yard shooting. V max bullets are naaaasty on white tails.

Anyways, as a gun maker I have an obligation to build the best product I can for a customer. It'll be a hard sell to ever convince me this is a bad way to operate.

Again, thanks for the kind words guys.

[stash247]

Longrifles: Saw the mikes, but, as they are the same Carbide Anviled, green 'C Clamps', that I thought everyone used, it came as no surprise, really!
But the tool box, that is different; My Gertsner, I waited 50 years for, and cried, when I finally inherited it, not that I wanted the box, so much, but for the fact that it cost me my grandfather, and my dad, for it to arrive here!
My tastes run to wood, over any other medium, in rifles, furniture, etc, and the box on your bench is a piece of extremely high quality; Kennedy, Craftsman, Snap On, a hundred others, can not do as much, so simply stated, and well executed, even if price is set aside.
The big old T&D Maker's box, on my bench will one day, belong to my Grandson, Giovanni, and I hope he enjoys just dusting, and waxing, and loving on it half as much as I do!
Part of it is provenance, as my Grandpa was the major male figure, in my growing up; I thoght, for years, the moon rose, on his shoulders.
He's been dead nearly forty years, yet the sights, and smells of him, are still close by, and familiar; he was my mentor, my judge, and my model.
"One good job, done right", a thing I heard, from my youth, still rings clear; finish this project, with honor, before moving on to the next.
He had a sense of integrity next to one; if you offered a dollar, you got a buck and a quarter's worth of value, from him, as it should be.
Just part of my 'hang up', on the 'old ways', but, I think, relevant.
I do no job, "good enough", only "right"; if I must do less than my best work, I need to 'opt out' of the situation, and move on.
I guess this is the difference, between professionals, and tradesmen.
To the subject of dogs, my other passion, a hour ago, about 03:15, my bitch was in my face, wanting to go out; she did what she needed to do, and is again, asleep, while I sit here, typing this; angry, no, tired, yes, but she is good to me, and for me, and if all I have to do is get up, and go out with her, that's pretty small change, for an animal, of her stature; she has litrally changed the lives of more than a dozen other animals, by her presence, and teaching.
Have a wonderful New Year!

[Tom Militano]

We could use a lot more men like your grandfather today Stash.

[stash247]

Tom, read the previous post, or two, from Longrifle; you may just have met one!
He's likely got only one or two 'set up' indicators, that read in thousandths, but I'll bet, a dozen that are 'tenth reading' (.0001") for those of you who did not grow up, or don't now 'live' in a machine shop.
That is how you get started; with every thing either concentric, or perpendicular, to it's mating parts, if you really want accuracy!
Often, it takes a toolmakers skills to simply build the fixturing, before there is any way to begin the job, because no product is gonna be closer to the 'split', in dimension, ie 'zero' tolerance, than the tools on which it was made.
And the point he made about the best possible work; this was my Grandfather, speaking through another mouth, as I read it!
Tom, they be out there, our job is to find them!
Look to our schools, today, and today's parents, if you question this; we sell millions of dollars in books that 'Teach The Test', not the subject, and millions of parents buy them, to get Johnny thru the fifth grade!
Here's the scary part.
I had the wife of a young Mechanical Engineer, a couple with whom I am close, call, to settle an arguement they were having, about whether it was possible to calculate 'square roots', without a calculator! My tastless. offhand answer was "how was the Golden Gate Bridge, or the Panama Canal, constructed?" "With a freaking PENCIL!"
Then I spent about twenty minutes showing her husband the 'Modified Newtonian Method' over the phone.
High school 'plane, and spherical geometry', 'Trigonometry', and believe it or not, 'English', were the subjects I worked hardest in, the first two, because I loved the subject matter, and saw practical application, the third because I needed four years of passing grades, to graduate.
The geometry, and trig, are 'shop math'; english, the way to communicate, with your clients; screw any of these up, and you are out of business!
Get active in your community, and insist on 'teaching the subject, not the test', and save the long range rifle for 'extreme circumstances'; with good education, and time, the prices might actually come down!
Few choose, today, to work in a hostile (I actually gotta DO something?) environment, and the gunshops are all of this; the 'flip side' is, I have been out of the Army, since 1973, and have amassed a total of eleven 'unemployed days', in that time, eleven, of which, were spent fishing, with a buddy, because I needed it; some 'down time' after three 'back to back' tours, in RVN.
Might be something to be said for the educational system, as it is, today!

[JLA]

Originally Posted by stash247

JLA, your reference was a bit vague; overdone? How can one have too much rifle, or too good a dog?'
I suggest, the best is none too good enough, anything less, is lacking.

stash, LongRifles, i apologize, if it makes sense in my own mind, i tend to not be so clear about things. LongRifles, i really think you do grade A work, that is professionalism at its finest. Everyone i know would hock an "unnecessary to shooting" bodypart for one of your examples above, including me. What i meant by "overdone" was, what you guys offer to the sport is generally a market for shooters that either have 1 hell of a job, or they make a living out of the sport. As a practicing gunsmith beginning his own journey to professionalism, my reasoning behind some of the comments i have posted is this. Most shooters in this sport, including me, are average, hardworking, individuals that have families to feed and bills to pay, and a day job that just barely allows them to eat and keep the bills paid. let alone fork over 6500 bucks for thier dream rifle. So, my area of interest lie with getting the most out of a production grade, or even a mil-surp grade weapon. My interests are in trying to open a "more accurate option" for shooters on a tight budget. While, most of the rifles i service wouldn't even come close to minute of angle shots @ 1000 yds. They will accomplish what most shooters are capable of. One example of this is the mosin 91/30 i accurized for my dad last christmas, when i finished that rifle it would shoot 1/2" groups @ 100 yds with handloads worked out specifically for that rifle, and just a couple weeks ago my dad dropped a 340 puound feral hog @ just over 300 yds. My dad and I have probably 400 bucks invested in that rifle in real money, all work was performed in my bedroom @ my desk in my spare time, mostly with hand tools. Sorry im rambling now, Dont get me wrong, you guys do beautiful work and offer a great service to the sport. keep up the fine work.

[USMC-03]

Gentlemen,

This has by far been one of the most interesting threads. Thought I'd throw out my two long range rifles. Neither are in the top competitor class but for now at least get me in the game.

The one on top is a model 70 Winchester in .308 originally set up for across the course highpower matches. I found it several years ago at a local gun shop for about $500 and put another $200 or so making it fit me. It has a McMillian Prone stock that I had converted to left hand and a Mo's rear sight. I believe the barrel is a Krieger.

The bottom rifle is an M1903A1 with a Redfield target sight on the receiver and a Dockendorf crosshair tube on front. I did a bit of horse trading for it 15 years ago at a gun show mainly as a collector but I used it in my first few 1,000 yard matches. With good hand loads it really shoots surprisingly well at that range even if I'm in no danger of winning with it.

[Pistolenschutze]

USMC, I must admit to just a wee bit of envy (drooling!) over that 1903A1.

[JLA]

me too USMC, i haven't as of yet had the pleasure of delving into such a fine example of military history with my notepad and pencil close at hand... truly are works of art.

[USMC-03]

Thanks, Pistol and JLA.

Like I said, I've never been in any danger of winning any matches when competing against modern technology but usually get an honorable mention for nostalgia. One nice thing, I have the same Redfield rear sight on my hunting rifle, also a Springfield. Always on the lookout for 1903's that haven't been screwed up to bad when sporterized so I can either restore them into military form or turn them into a target rifle.

In the next few years I'm hoping to build a good custom rifle similar to those LongRifles has displayed that will keep up with the pack. Until then I'll shoot what I've got, learn what I can and have fun doing it.

[stash247]

Marine, we need to go fishing.
Everybody I know, and shoot with, knows my story; it's about shooting, not winning, or, in different terms, fishing, not catching!
When the 'shooting' part ceases to be fun, I will quit the sport, with no regard to the 'winning' issues; for me, how I spend a Sunday is important, and a good day with the dogs trumps a Trophy, won in stress.
This is my approach; pick your own poison!
I shoot single shot, falling block, rimfire rifles, with all their disadvantges; ie, 2 piece stocks, etc, almost exclusively; and shoot well, in spite of the handicap.
The only person I have to shoot against, is ME.
If I take a match, WOW! But if I had a good day, according to my personal 'bests', it's all I really came out to do, so I am not in any way, shape, or form, disappoiinted.
My gear is the best I can afford, but everybody has a budget, and mine is tight (I support three households), so there are those with better equipment, at the line. No matter.
On a good day, I will shoot with all of that money, and beat their scores, out of pure stubborness, and the intimate knowledge of my gear.
It ain't the gear, but the shooter.
To paraphrase, "It ain't the size of the dog, in a fight, but the size of the 'fight', in the dog!"
My little girl, Brandy, at almost 50 pounds, recently sent an overly agressive, 110 pound lab, to the vet, with 'marks' on both heels, and muzzle.
Stepson's lab, and a good, but mannerless, animal, but not real cognizant of his 'betters'. I had little dog, in the scrap, but the dog I had, had a lot of fight in her, thus the result.
Never apologise for your gear, simply learn it well, and make it work!
Brandy earns her keep, moving cattle 15 times her weight, and knows no better way to spend an afternoon; she will 'load' the meanest bull you've ever seen, into a trailer, in 90 seconds, or less, because she does not know this is an impossible task, for a 'normal' dog!
Friend, understand, shooting is a long standing hobby; my ACD's (Heelers, to most) are my life; the animals teach me far more than I have, to teach them, but what I learn, I share.
My dogs are 'rescues', so come seldom to never with papers, or pedigrees, yet work with the best stock dogs in the state; perhaps, knowing your gear?
Every one was a step from being 'put down', some, with serious behavioral problems, when they came to me; every one is 'productive', and manageable, today.
Now, this is working with 'junk equipment' at the highest order!
We were in Houston, at the China Air Freight Terminal, a couple of weeks ago, to pick up a box of airplane parts, and deliver them, to a local aircraft shop, for a 'downed' aircraft; first thing I heard, was that the dog could not be in the terminal; I offered that she was a 'service dog', my bodyguard, but, that, if it was an issue, my truck was parked, and running, the second stall from the entrance. If it was an issue, I'd collect my package, and he could move the dog to the truck, with two other dogs,in the cab. Offer declined, with apologies.
We did our business, and left.
My point is, to me, these dogs are 'familiar gear' and respond, often, without a word, to a 'situation' that we have dealt with, before; so a familiar rifle, regardless of pedigree, will respond to familiar hands, with no apology, or excuse, needed.

[USMC-03]

Stash,

Next time I'm in Houston on business I may take you up on that fishing offer. I've found a great fish house where I have dinner at lease once and would love to try going after some of that Gulf Coast stuff.

Your right about the shooting and fun over winning. One of the most enjoyable matches I've been to was our state long range championship several years ago. I shot some of my personal best scores, 185+ out of 200 for each stage, and still came in dead last. But the opportunity to shoot along side of some of the finest shots in the world, have some of them checking out my gear and learning from them was more than worth the effort.

The main thing is getting out and doing instead of just talking. Taking the shot and missing is better than not shooting at all. And that goes for most everything in life.

[Rat~Man]

Originally Posted by LongRifles

The green monster is my 6.5-284 heavy deer gun.

As in .284 win? If so, you would only be the second person I've run across who owns one. Tack driver of a wildcat round.

[LongRifles]

Yep, it's a 284 Win necked down to 6.5mm. Pretty much dominated(s) the 1000 yard "any/any" classes at Camp Perry.

Load up a 140 grain SST from Hornady and it'll put a hurtin on some white tails.

It's a hammer.

Thanks.

C~