Who killed Yamamoto? - The Firearms Forum

polishshooter · 01-14-2007, 02:52 PM

Read the new book "Lightning Strike" over Christmas, and it was an INTERESTING read...I think the NEXT poll just might be SHOULD we have killed him...

What's funny, is that since I was a kid, I confidently regurgitated the "Official" line that Lanphier was the one, but I NEVER knew the controversy existed, I just must have been oblivious....

But one thing I feel strongly about now after reading it is that he DIDN'T...and I now think he just may have been as slimy as John Kerry....

Pistolenschutze · 01-14-2007, 03:41 PM

I think the evidence, taken all together, is pretty clear, Polish. Barber was the one who actually nailed him, though for many years both Barber and Lanphier were each given 1/2 credit for the kill. It seems apparent that Lanphier later claimed credit knowing full well that Barber got him.

polishshooter · 01-14-2007, 03:48 PM

Yeah, and then it turns out that Lanphier was the one that actually WROTE the "official" report giving him the kill, that became the official Air Force story...

What's kind of neat is the controversy, and the fact the survivors have so much acrimony over it...and that if the Air Force ever DOES officially give the whole credit to Barber, it actually will mean that Lanphier then loses his "Ace" status, because then he would only have 4 1/2 kills....and it would really make them look bad for all the press they gave him, for being a "shill" for the new Air Force with his political connections, his father, and the fact they made him the first President of the "American Aces Association...."

But the only story that has any credibilty is Barber's, and it kind of matches the evidence, and witnesses on both sides....

Plus you throw in Lanphier's history of lying about other things, and what he said earlier about seeking "glory" so he could run for President some day.....

Pistolenschutze · 01-14-2007, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by polishshooter

Plus you throw in Lanphier's history of lying about other things, and what he said earlier about seeking "glory" so he could run for President some day.....

True Polish. Credit for the Zero Lanphier also claimed during the same mission was later stripped from him. It was confirmed after the war that no Zeros were lost, or even damaged on that mission. Plus, the P-38 Lanphier was flying was not equipped with the aileron boost later models possessed, and thus it would have been physically impossible for him to have performed the aerobatics necessary for the kill, as he claimed.

polishshooter · 01-14-2007, 09:38 PM

Yeah, and then his story of his "one handed" death struggle with the Jap soldier who supposedly stabbed him in his left hand with a bayonet when he was a "forward observer" with a patrol, and in the report of the patrol not only is it not mentioned, but there is no record of him seeking medical treatment....you'd think if somebody "strangled to death" an enemy with one hand or not, SOMEBODY with him would have seen it or at least HEARD something....

Plus in his story the wing came off before the Betty went in, and examination of the wreckage even today shows it came off from striking trees on the way in...and nobody else who saw it go in claimed it lost a wing either....

But no matter what, it is pretty amazing that all the Japs used to escort their top admiral to the front was 6 Zeros, none of which had RADIOS even....and that at the same time they are all drawn up in dress uniforms waiting to meet him, NONE of the Bougainville airbases had ANY CAP up....

Pistolenschutze · 01-14-2007, 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by polishshooter

But no matter what, it is pretty amazing that all the Japs used to escort their top admiral to the front was 6 Zeros, none of which had RADIOS even....and that at the same time they are all drawn up in dress uniforms waiting to meet him, NONE of the Bougainville airbases had ANY CAP up....

Fatalism and overconfidence were ever Japanese failings, Polish. It's hard for us to understand, but failure in war, or encountering an enemy more capable than they, were inconceivable conditions to the Japanese of that era. Part of this mindset lies in Shintoism as it was practiced after the Meiji Restoration of the 1870s and became the state religion. Shintoism was used to foster the cult of emperor worship in Japan after the destruction of the shogunate. It created an atmosphere of infallibility around the emperor. Since the emperor was incapable of error (kinda like Papal Infallibility, Polish

), any decision he made must, because the gods will it, be correct.

Xracer · 01-15-2007, 08:34 AM

Best evidence seems to confirm that Barber was the shooter......but we'll probably never know for sure.

BTW.....saw a program on PBS (Secrets Of The Dead) recently that "proved" that von Richtofen was shot down by AnZac ground fire, not Roy Brown.

Again, we'll probably never know for sure.....guess that's what makes history so fascinating!

Pistolenschutze · 02-04-2007, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xracer

BTW.....saw a program on PBS (Secrets Of The Dead) recently that "proved" that von Richtofen was shot down by AnZac ground fire, not Roy Brown.

Again, we'll probably never know for sure.....guess that's what makes history so fascinating!

There's still considerable controversy over the death of the Red Baron, X. I think, based on the best available evidence, it was indeed the AnZacs who zapped him, but like you say, we will probably never know for sure. It does seem ironic though, don't you think? This guy downed 80 aircraft in combat, only to buy the farm from a random ground shot, the "golden BB." This incident reminds me a lot of Richard Ira Bong during WWII. This guy was so good he whacked 40 Jap planes (officially, it was likely twice that in reality) between September 1942 and January 1945, and yet was never shot down himself. He was finally ordered home, married his girlfriend, and then ends up getting killed shortly thereafter while flight-testing a P-80 Shooting Star jet fighter that flamed out at low altitude. Fate is a strange thing.

Marlin · 03-18-2007, 04:25 PM

Speaking of Richard Bong, the Military channel has a very good 30 minute documentary in it's series on "Legends of Air Power." Saw it about a week ago. Very heartbreaking, indeed.

Tom Militano · 03-27-2007, 11:26 AM

I don't really see what difference it makes who got yamamoto, at least they got him. Just my opinion.

View Poll Results: Who killed Yamamoto?
Tom Lanphier	2	10.53%
Rex Barber	6	31.58%
Besby Holmes	3	15.79%
Nobody REALLY will ever know for sure....	8	42.11%
Voters: 19. You may not vote on this poll

01-14-2007, 02:52 PM	#1
polishshooter Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Indiana Contributor Posts: 7,860	Who killed Yamamoto? Read the new book "Lightning Strike" over Christmas, and it was an INTERESTING read...I think the NEXT poll just might be SHOULD we have killed him... What's funny, is that since I was a kid, I confidently regurgitated the "Official" line that Lanphier was the one, but I NEVER knew the controversy existed, I just must have been oblivious.... But one thing I feel strongly about now after reading it is that he DIDN'T...and I now think he just may have been as slimy as John Kerry.... __________________ The problems we face today are there because the people who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living. -->

01-14-2007, 03:41 PM	#2
Pistolenschutze Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 13,094	Re: Who killed Yamamoto? I think the evidence, taken all together, is pretty clear, Polish. Barber was the one who actually nailed him, though for many years both Barber and Lanphier were each given 1/2 credit for the kill. It seems apparent that Lanphier later claimed credit knowing full well that Barber got him. __________________ --Pistolenschutze (Pistol Shooter)

01-14-2007, 03:48 PM	#3
polishshooter Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Indiana Contributor Posts: 7,860	Re: Who killed Yamamoto? Yeah, and then it turns out that Lanphier was the one that actually WROTE the "official" report giving him the kill, that became the official Air Force story... What's kind of neat is the controversy, and the fact the survivors have so much acrimony over it...and that if the Air Force ever DOES officially give the whole credit to Barber, it actually will mean that Lanphier then loses his "Ace" status, because then he would only have 4 1/2 kills....and it would really make them look bad for all the press they gave him, for being a "shill" for the new Air Force with his political connections, his father, and the fact they made him the first President of the "American Aces Association...." But the only story that has any credibilty is Barber's, and it kind of matches the evidence, and witnesses on both sides.... Plus you throw in Lanphier's history of lying about other things, and what he said earlier about seeking "glory" so he could run for President some day..... __________________ The problems we face today are there because the people who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.

01-14-2007, 09:38 PM	#5
polishshooter Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Indiana Contributor Posts: 7,860	Re: Who killed Yamamoto? Yeah, and then his story of his "one handed" death struggle with the Jap soldier who supposedly stabbed him in his left hand with a bayonet when he was a "forward observer" with a patrol, and in the report of the patrol not only is it not mentioned, but there is no record of him seeking medical treatment....you'd think if somebody "strangled to death" an enemy with one hand or not, SOMEBODY with him would have seen it or at least HEARD something.... Plus in his story the wing came off before the Betty went in, and examination of the wreckage even today shows it came off from striking trees on the way in...and nobody else who saw it go in claimed it lost a wing either.... But no matter what, it is pretty amazing that all the Japs used to escort their top admiral to the front was 6 Zeros, none of which had RADIOS even....and that at the same time they are all drawn up in dress uniforms waiting to meet him, NONE of the Bougainville airbases had ANY CAP up.... __________________ The problems we face today are there because the people who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.

01-15-2007, 08:34 AM	#7
Xracer TFF Admin Staff Mediator Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Minn-eeee-sota, ya, sure, you bet! Posts: 9,144	Re: Who killed Yamamoto? Best evidence seems to confirm that Barber was the shooter......but we'll probably never know for sure. BTW.....saw a program on PBS (Secrets Of The Dead) recently that "proved" that von Richtofen was shot down by AnZac ground fire, not Roy Brown. Again, we'll probably never know for sure.....guess that's what makes history so fascinating!

03-18-2007, 04:25 PM	#9
Marlin TFF Admin Staff Chief Counselor Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: At SouthernMoss' side forever! Contributor Posts: 13,853	Re: Who killed Yamamoto? Speaking of Richard Bong, the Military channel has a very good 30 minute documentary in it's series on "Legends of Air Power." Saw it about a week ago. Very heartbreaking, indeed. __________________ *The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing.* *The only criminal class native to the United States is Congress.*

03-27-2007, 11:26 AM	#10
Tom Militano Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Jacksonville, AL Posts: 1,255	Re: Who killed Yamamoto? I don't really see what difference it makes who got yamamoto, at least they got him. Just my opinion.