handgun ID

[jimmybaby]

I recently acquired an Italian made replica of the 58 Army Remington. On the right side of the barrel it's marked "Hopkins & Allen Arms Corp., USA". The left side of the barrel has standard markings for black powder, 44 cal., Made in Italy. On the right side of the frame, below the cylinder are the regular Italian proof-marks. On the left side, under the cylinder, is a stylized upper-case "A" with the cross bar going from right to left, ending past the left leg of the "A" in an arrowhead. This piece looks like it may have a kit gun; it is extremely poorly designed and assembled. In spite of all this, I would like to have any and all information I can get as to who manufactured it, or anything else to be had about it. Thanks up front. Jimmybaby

[southernshooter]

Pictures help with ideas of value

[polishshooter]

Only because I am the proud owner and shooter of a Hopkins Allen Flinlock Minuteman Brush rifle, and have read a little about the "modern" HA firearms, I think I can guess a little about it...

Hopkins Allen was a fairly popular gun manufacturer in the late 1800s, famous for "underhammer" BP target and hunting rifles and target and "boot" pistols, along with others, but like a lot of them, went out of business.

The name "Hopkins Allen" was resurrected by a new company in either the 50s or 60s, and started making the BP underhammers again, (or actually, having them made in Italy and Spain, and MARKETING them here....)and it caught the wave of the "first blackpowder rennaissance" in the 60s when it became fashionable again to shoot, and states started coming up with special Muzzleloading Hunting Seasons....and they started making all kinds of replicas of famous BP guns too, like the Minuteman, which was a factory "repro" of a Kentucky LR.......


I bought my Hopkins Allen FL "New in the box" from Dixie Gunworks at Friendship in the early 90s, HOWEVER it was an "attic cleanout special" for them, and they said it was at LEAST 25 years old at that point, making it's date of manufacture sometime in the late 60s or early 70s....and it too was made in Italy....


Numrich Atrms bought all the inventory and name of HA in the 70s, and continued to have most of their line made under the HA/Numrich name.

Numrich went out of business, or rather became "Gun Parts Corp" sometime in the 90s....


I would GUESS then that yours is a QUALITY replica of the Remington made along with many others by one of the "famous" Italian BP manufacturers, like Pietta, in the 60s ot 70s,....and sold under the Hopkins Allen name....rather inexpesively at the time, like most of the others.


It should be worth if in good shape maybe just a little more than a modern quality replica of a remington would bring...

While there is SUPPOSED to be a "budding'' interest in collectors wanting these "early" replicas, I haven't found any yet


It should be a good quality 'shooter" worth between $100 and $200 depending on condition, as a WAG....


Now I paid only $100 for mine, and the original "MSRP" on the paperwork in the box was something like $59.99...

Now I HAVE been offered $300 for it since, but it's my first BP rifle, the I got my first "BP Deer" with it, so it's a keeper. I also like it because it's a much better gun than other comparable "cheap" flintlocks like Traditions and CVA, which use coil springs, mine is a leaf spring bridled action, maybe not as well made as "real" ones, but at least in the "spirit" of them....

Incidenrally, Dixie MAY still have parts for it, they still list parts for a lot of Hopkins Allen guns....

[jimmybaby]

Originally Posted by southernshooter

Pictures help with ideas of value

Hey, southernshooter;
I appreciate the input but value is not the point right now. As per the description, I will accept, "not much". Origin is the main question. Thanks, though. jimmybaby

[jimmybaby]

Originally Posted by polishshooter

Only because I am the proud owner and shooter of a Hopkins Allen Flinlock Minuteman Brush rifle, and have read a little about the "modern" HA firearms, I think I can guess a little about it...

Hopkins Allen was a fairly popular gun manufacturer in the late 1800s, famous for "underhammer" BP target and hunting rifles and target and "boot" pistols, along with others, but like a lot of them, went out of business.

The name "Hopkins Allen" was resurrected by a new company in either the 50s or 60s, and started making the BP underhammers again, (or actually, having them made in Italy and Spain, and MARKETING them here....)and it caught the wave of the "first blackpowder rennaissance" in the 60s when it became fashionable again to shoot, and states started coming up with special Muzzleloading Hunting Seasons....and they started making all kinds of replicas of famous BP guns too, like the Minuteman, which was a factory "repro" of a Kentucky LR.......


I bought my Hopkins Allen FL "New in the box" from Dixie Gunworks at Friendship in the early 90s, HOWEVER it was an "attic cleanout special" for them, and they said it was at LEAST 25 years old at that point, making it's date of manufacture sometime in the late 60s or early 70s....and it too was made in Italy....


Numrich Atrms bought all the inventory and name of HA in the 70s, and continued to have most of their line made under the HA/Numrich name.

Numrich went out of business, or rather became "Gun Parts Corp" sometime in the 90s....


I would GUESS then that yours is a QUALITY replica of the Remington made along with many others by one of the "famous" Italian BP manufacturers, like Pietta, in the 60s ot 70s,....and sold under the Hopkins Allen name....rather inexpesively at the time, like most of the others.


It should be worth if in good shape maybe just a little more than a modern quality replica of a remington would bring...

While there is SUPPOSED to be a "budding'' interest in collectors wanting these "early" replicas, I haven't found any yet


It should be a good quality 'shooter" worth between $100 and $200 depending on condition, as a WAG....


Now I paid only $100 for mine, and the original "MSRP" on the paperwork in the box was something like $59.99...

Now I HAVE been offered $300 for it since, but it's my first BP rifle, the I got my first "BP Deer" with it, so it's a keeper. I also like it because it's a much better gun than other comparable "cheap" flintlocks like Traditions and CVA, which use coil springs, mine is a leaf spring bridled action, maybe not as well made as "real" ones, but at least in the "spirit" of them....

Incidenrally, Dixie MAY still have parts for it, they still list parts for a lot of Hopkins Allen guns....

[jimmybaby]

Hey, polishshooter, All your info hit it right on the nail; I still have some copies of Dixie and Numrich catalogues from the '70's showing both kit and gun of the under-hammer type. And I got a new hand and trigger from Dixie for the piece. so again, right on. But, what does that big Arrow-A stand for on the frame? Got any ideas?
By the way, is your polish witha big "P" or little "p"? Thanks, jimmybaby.

[LEE3370]

Hey jimmybaby,
If you could post a picture of the logo, it would help. It may be the Armi San Marco logo but I would have to see it to be sure.
Lee