9mm

[Wambi]

I started reloading a few months back... started with 44 specials... for my blackhawk... Its nice being able to make afordable target loads... 7.00 per 50 rather than 27.00 per 50...

I just setup my dies for the 9mm for my cougar... and it took a while to get the taper crimp right so it would fit in the barrel round after round... anyone have any tips for reloading 9mm ammo.. using the hornady dies... I think I have it now but not sure if the crimp is enough... I have slamed the bullets on the table (no powder or primer) and they don't slip acording to the calipars... so is that good enough? seems like the cassings are just snug against the bullet with no crimp like the 44 cassings dig into the lead.

Thank you.

[dusty9]

It sounds like you are right on with the taper crimp. Taper crimping is harder to gauge than a roll crimp. When taper crimping, all you want to do is remove the bell from the brass. If the bullet is indented, there is too much crimp. Remember, 9mm headspaces on the case, not the rim. Remove the barrel from your pistol and be sure the loaded round will chamber properly. The overall length of all rimless semi auto rounds is important. Too long and it will not chamber. If it is shorter than necessary it will raise pressures rapidly. The design of different bullets can require different OAL's.

[Wambi]

I am using the lyman 38th edition... so I have all the numbers by the book... the one strange thing... my 44 loads... the powder is just a small bit in the case... my 38 loads... the powder is just a small bit in the case... the 9mm the powder takes up 1/2 of the case... I know it is a smaller case... but just seems funny that the case to powder ratio is different... I am using alliant unique for all of the rounds... I will test fire the 9mm reloads tonight if the range is not to busy..

[dusty9]

For the 3 calibers you are loading, Unique is an excellent powder. If your batch of Unique is relatively new, I would suggest going to the Alliant web site and checking the recommended charges. The newer Unique has been changed somewhat from the old. It is supposed to be cleaner burning and somewhat less coarse so as to meter better. The burning rate is apparently a little faster than it used to be, as the current loading data shows some changes from the older. I don't think it would cause problems except for someone loading maximum loads.

Your thoughts on the case to powder ratio on these different calibers are totally understandable. The reason for this is the old original .38 and .44 cartridges were both black powder cartridges. Black powder is much bulkier than smokeless powder so the cases had to be large enough to hold enough powder. When smokeless powder began to be used the cases were actually too large. .45 Colt (aka .45 Long Colt) is the most extreme example of this. The .45 Colt cases are so large and the amount of smokeless powder needed is so small it can actually affect the velocity and accuracy of those rounds. With the advent of Cowboy Action shooting, in which very light loads are normally used, a new powder, IMR Trail Boss, has been developed. It is a very bulky powder that will pretty well fill up the case and still develop low velocities.

The 9mm Parabellum is a different story. It was developed specifically for smokeless powder and for a semi auto handgun. All semi autos, both handgun and rifle, need the shortest action possible for good functioning, so the smallest case possible was used. The downside to this is that the pressures are much higher. .38 Special pressures max out at around 16,000, the .44 Special at around 13,000, and the 9mm Parabellum at about 30,000. With 9mm pressures being this high, reloaders have less margin for error than with the over capacity revolver cartridges. Any variation in powder charges and bullet seating depth has a much greater effect on pressure than it does in the big over capacity cases. On the other hand, it is virtually impossible to double charge a 9mm, whereas it is easy (and has been done too many times) to double or triple charge .38 special, .44 special, and .45 Colt cases. This has resulted in blown up guns and in many cases injuries to the shooter.

[Contenderizer]

Great info Dusty9, especially regarding Trail Boss. The only thing I can add is that one of the primary reasons Trail Boss was developed was to prevent accidental double charging, an all too common mistake when cartridge capacity is two or more times the volume of the charge. Ouch, that hurts!

[Wambi]

I shot my reloads at the range today... the .38's were right on with my S&W 686 6"... but my 9mm were about 3" low... these are compaired to factory ammo.. I fired factory first... then my reloads... I used about 5 grains of unique and followed the OVL guidline... for the 9mm... these were at 10 yards... do I need more powder? the max load is like 5.4 grains... the min load is 4.5... they grouped just like the factory... but shot low...

[dusty9]

On your 9mm loads, I would try reducing the load slightly before increasing it. I have not tried it with 9mm, but I have noticed .357 loads will group lower than light .38 special loads in my revolvers, and I have heard similar comments on all of the (few) forums I frequent. If lighter loads print more near where your .38's do, well and good. If they are even lower than before, then increase your beginning load about .2 gr at a time and see what happens. Increase loads very cautiously with a 9mm. They are pretty hot little cartridges and changes in any component can cause substantial changes in pressures.

[Wambi]

THANKK YOU.... I will make a few at the min and a few at the max and see if I have to go up or down... thanks for your help... It would be nice to understand the physics of this a little better....