Colorado Boy Suspended for Nobama t-shirt

[45nut]

http://www.myfoxcolorado.com/myfox/p...ollP44Question

5th Grader Suspended For Anti-Obama Shirt
Last Edited: Tuesday, 23 Sep 2008, 7:51 AM MDT
Created: Monday, 22 Sep 2008, 9:15 PM MDT
Aurora fifth-grader suspended for home madetshirt reading "Obama is a terrorist's best friend." 9/22/08
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An 11-year-old boy was reprimanded for wearing a homemade shirt reading "Obama is a terrorist's best friend" to school this week. Do you think it was appropriate for the school to punish the student.


AURORA (MyFOXColorado.com) - An 11-year-old in Aurora says his first amendment rights are being trampled after he was suspended for wearing a homemade shirt that reads "Obama is a terrorist's best friend."

The fifth grader at Aurora Frontier K-8 School wore it on a day when students were asked to wear red, white and blue to show their patriotism.

The boy's father Dann Dalton describes himself as a "proud conservative" who has taken part in some controversial anti-abortion protests. Dalton says the school made a major mistake by suspending his son for wearing the shirt.

"It's the public school system," Dalton says. "Let's be honest, it's full of liberal loons."

According the the boy's father, the school district told the student, Daxx Dalton, that he had the choice of changing his shirt, turning his shirt inside out or being suspended.

Daxx chose suspension.

"They're taking away my right of freedom of speech," he says. "If I have the right to wear this shirt I'm going to use it. And if the only way to use it is get suspended, then I'm going to get suspended."

Daxx's dad agrees with him and is encouraging his son to stand his ground. "The facts are his rights were violated. Period."

Aurora Public Schools would not talk about the case but said the district "Respects a student's right to free speech, such as the right to wear specific clothing," but administrators say they review any situation that interrupts the learning environment.

Paperwork submitted by the school district says Daxx Dalton was not suspended for wearing the shirt, but for willful disobedience and defiance.

The boy's father says he intends to pursue a lawsuit against the district.

[artabr]

I hope they win.


Art

[mrkirker]

I masqueraded as a teacher for a while, so, I'd like to express my .02$, if I may, though it might ruffle a feather or two.

I feel that a school system has to have the authority to monitor each situation in light of what ramifications might occur from the wearing of provocative clothing. In this instance, the statement on the shirt is plainly inflammatory, and could invite strong comments or actions that would interfere with an educational environment.

While the first amendment must be respected, the overall enviornment of the facility must be protected. Wearing this shirt during a tightly contested, emotionaly charged election is akin to shouting "Fire" in a crowded theater. Does one have the 'right' to express an opinion? Of course. However, one must have the common sense as to 'when' to express a dissenting opinion. When common sense fails, a commonly recognized greater authority must step in for the common good of those who must share the situation. Free speech, even in the issuance of dissent, must be exercised wisely.

As stated above, my opinion might have ruffled a feather or two.
"Snipers to the fore!"

[artabr]

You can bet that if the shirt said anything that was a factual put down of McCain not a peep would have been heard.


Art

[mrkirker]

You can bet that if the shirt said anything that was a factual put down of McCain not a peep would have been heard.

Now arta, we don't know that, do we? The school may have a policy of banning any type of political statement. Ours did.

[artabr]

I'd be willing to place a bet on it.



Art

[45nut]

Well mrkirker we will never know will we? The public school system just gave McCain another ad if they choose to make use of this.

While I understand the limitations to the First Amendment, I can't equate this to shouting "fire" in a movie theater. Was it just a bit outside the bounds to wear to a liberal government funded public school? I would say yes. Would you think that you would end up in the principles office if you choose to wear this to school? Yes, I think you would.

On the other hand, if people can burn the American Flag, why can't a 5th grader wear a t-shirt (that fit the parameters of the schools instructions - red, white and blue) that expresses what he feels on a particular subject.

Personally, I think his t-shirt is true. I wonder what would have happened if it had been a vanilla pro McCain t-shirt?

Peace to all, the messiah is on the way (DOWN)

[mrkirker]

If, as you stated, one is aware that one's attire will land them in trouble, why in the world would one wear that attire?

a) To make a statement? Yes, here's a fifth-grader, unable to vote (I assume), who has figured out the intricacies of a particular candidate's political makeup, (intricacies that as of yet, have been seldom defined other than to state "Change-change-change!"), and who wishes to make a political statement regarding that candidate's beliefs. Yes, that is SO believable!

b) Because Daddy needs a mouthpiece? Hmmmm.

Okay, I too am as guilty as you in making rash assumptions regarding the background of the news item!

[graehaven]

It's more than obvious, from the father's comments, that he was seeking a lawsuit opportunity. What a dolt. And he's prostituting his son to do it. Shame on him!

[satellite66]

Uniforms would solve this stuff. Take the fashion show and agenda show out of it.

[Marlin T]

Originally Posted by mrkirker

Now arta, we don't know that, do we? The school may have a policy of banning any type of political statement. Ours did.

If that was true it would have said so on the paper work. Not some liberal egotistical excuse like they gave.

Are you one of the typical union liberals? Sounds like it to me

[satellite66]

Here is another t shirt school story.
America controversial?

[Marlin T]

I guessed that it was a flag before the site was loaded up.

Please read my Sig below, this applies to most of the teachers in the US as proven once again by your link Sat66


EDIT: Kirker, are you going to stand for the school in this case too? Wouldn't suprise me if you did.

[artabr]

66's story doesn't surprise me at all.


Art

[mrkirker]

Marlin T,
Are you one of the typical union liberals? Sounds like it to me Nope, had to belong to a union once, left it because I HATED having someone tell me how to think, act, and vote. (Our name for our union rep was Scott Free)


Please read my Sig below, this applies to most of the teachers in the US as proven once again by your link Sat66 So, you've gone 'on record' as being anti-teacher now. What happend, did a teacher scrare you when you were a child? That you provided an escape clause word (most) really does not change your intent in penning your comment now, does it?

Marlin, Marlin, Marlin; Lumping ALL of any group and labeling the mass by the (your) definition that might apply to a few of said group is simply weak, an argument by generalization. Much like lumping ALL those of us who 'carry', value the 2nd, and obey the law, with the FEW miscreants who misuse firearms and appear in various news blurbs on a daily basis. It would seem that you hate it when the media uses that technique on 'us', yet you are guilty of the same short-sighted, mean-spirited, small-man attitude where a 'them' is concerned.

. . . in the US as proven once again . . The only thing 'proven' in this instance is "who you are and what you believe" as conveyed by your comments.

EDIT: Kirker, are you going to stand for the school in this case too? Wouldn't suprise me if you did. Glad you aren't "suprised", but before puffing up too big, jump off you hind legs and check your spelling of the word "suprised". Ironic, eh? Perhaps you were mumbling under your breath about the unfairness of life when that mean ole nasty TEACHER was going over the spelling list that day!

I, and my ex-wife were teachers. After several years of budget cuts, poor support from our school administrators in the matter of classroom discipline, and actually having instances where our physical safety was jeopardized in the CLASSROOM, we decided to seek other areas of employment. (We wern't alone.) That I earn substantially more as a janitor than I did as a teacher says volumes about the condition of our educational system in this country, and the attitude toward those who seek to provide the tools for our young people to succeed in today’s world, an attitude that you seem to reflect through your typed comments.

Please understand that we didn't want to get rich. We wanted to earn enough to start a family, buy a home (with a dog or two), take a couple of weeks off in the summer to hike and camp. Most of all, we wanted to try to return something that the both of us had been given while attending school in a rural, poverty-stricken, pocket of Appalachia. Something that TEACHERS gave us: Hope.

I am way off thread, and I apologize to our members for the 'rant' portion. I'm relatively new here, and I'm quilty of speaking like one of the Forum Fathers. Seriously, I hope that the young man can learn that there are situations in which one must diminish his expectations regarding the 1st; and that his dad can learn that there are instances in when the child is best served by NOT supporting each and every action that his child may have taken.
Good day!

[GoodOl'12gauge]

Im anti teacher. My son was talking to ,his friends about shooting at my house. They were at lunch and a teacher told them to stop talking about violent things. My son (hes a 6th grader) told her that it wasnt violent and he wasnt going to stop talking at luch. They took him to the office and called me in. I told them it wasnt violent and it was a right. After saying a few more "nice" words to the teacher I took Jared home.

[SolidVFR]

I've seen firsthand how liberal many public school teachers are. I'm not anti-teacher, I'm anti- Liberal-anti-America teacher.

GoodOl'12gauge, your son seems like a fine kid, and he did a great job standing up to that teacher.

Let me tell you this: In all the public schools I've been to, I've never heard or seen a teacher tell a student to stop making fun of Bush or making anti-Bush remarks. I have, however, seen TWO TEACHERS intimidate and corner a student(7th grade) when he asked "Why al gore and not Bush" (Intentionally not capitalized). It is WRONG, and these teachers are influencing impressionable students to be Anti-America. That is much greater crime than a 5th grader being bold enough to stand up for what is right. Who cares if the father was looking for a lawsuit...the school deserves it.

[45nut]

mrkirker,

Rants are okay in this thread, because the whole thread is a rant in itself. One must take for granted that at times, our love of firearms is the only major thing we have in common and in fact we may be polar opposites on all other issues at hand.

It is an honorable thing to want to give back to the community by being teachers. It is also sad that the pay is too low to attract good people who want to educate young minds and make a decent living.

It is also sad that school districts have made it impossible to remove bad teachers, or to have any way to hold them accountable. It is also sad that so many school teachers follow the liberal mantra like a bunch of sheep. Is it a wonder that so many people under 25 are so taken with Nobama?

He is their messiah as prophesied by the liberal socialist who head up our school systems from college to kindergarten.

Is it then any wonder that the incendiary t-shirt that caused the uproar was slamming THEIR messiah? Not one bit

I don't expect anything different or better from a bunch of socialistic fascist liberal wackos. IMHO, liberals are the problem, not part of it.

[mrkirker]

. . . . our love of firearms is the only major thing we have in common . . .
And that is enough, 45! Though, I'd venture a guess that we share more than a few views that have not yet seen light on the fourm!

[Prizefighter]

Was it a good idea to wear the shirt? Depends on your point of view, but it isn't a clear yes or no. I think the question is arguable.

Was the child within his rights to wear the shirt? Yes. It was not speech that endangered anyone, such as the old fire-theatre example.

Was the school within their rights to suspend him? No. Had it been a private school, then the issue would have much more grey. But as a public school, they have no place censoring anything that does not have profane language or imagery, or does sufficiently cover the student's body.

Maybe the school officials even believe that they were protecting the "learning environment," but deep down their motivation for suspending the student is as politically motivated as the boy's motivation for wearing the shirt.

Where's the ACLU when you need them?

[flopshot]

Originally Posted by satellite66

Uniforms would solve this stuff. Take the fashion show and agenda show out of it.

the only solution.
but then,,, we wouldn't want to stiffle the "creativity and individualism' of those not inclined to think along the less conservative side of the fence.
i would imagine whatever sings the song of the teachers union would be quite acceptable.

[Prizefighter]

I could get on board with putting kids in uniforms, but it will not happen in this century. The schools don't have enough money to buy pencils and paper for the classrooms (at least not without cutting their precious two-bit sports programs, for some) so uniforms are right out for public schools.

It would have been wiser for the school to simply call the boy's family and try to respectfully make their case for putting him in a different shirt. The father probably would have still refused, but it would look much better for them if they could at least have shown an attempt to be... oh, what's that word we all like so much? Oh right, tolerant.

[Marlin T]

Kirker, thanks for your reply, it made my day. J I didn’t really mean to get you that riled up.

Ya know, I hated english and spelling both, I was and am more of hands on kind of guy. However, I had to really laugh when I saw that you misspelled some things too. So if you find any more misspellings, please point em out if you feel the need , as there is no better way to learn.

No, I’m not anti teacher, I’m anti liberal and that goes back to what I said. Most teachers are liberal, and I think you would have a real hard time disproving that even if you wanted to.

I had to deal with these libs when my step son was going through school not so long ago, it really made me sick. He was the kind of kid that had funny haircuts, likes holes in his jeans, draws stuff on his shirts… I’m sure you know the kind. The kind that likes to stand apart from the crowd.

This led to the usual problems, the kids liked to pick on him as the employees of the school were not any better. The breaking point was when the school told him that he couldn’t defend himself against other students, even with the prior notification that he was going to get his ass beat. Well the beating of his ass didn’t happen, it was the other way around and he got in trouble for it! The principle knew that this event was going to happen, and did nothing to those that truly initiated everything.

He dropped out of high school, got his GED over a year in advance compared to when he would have graduated; then continued his education at the local community college.

This time when he was dealing with the teachers, he was well aware that the “teachers” were actually HIS employees and took none of their crap. Those teachers that didn’t like him, didn’t like it when he would explain why they were ANTI American, in his opinion, and usually stuck to the topic of their teaching schedule after that.

But back on topic, if the school doesn’t want politics involved in the classroom, that should be clearly stated in the rules and regs. It would appear that was not the case; so the kid should not have been kicked out for doing something that was within the rules.

More cases like this should make their way to the courtroom and have the ____ sued out of them. Maybe then, the teachers would be a little less inclined to express their liberal views and actions onto anybody.

[mrkirker]

Marlin, sorry that you've had such a 'tuff' interlude in your life. It seems to have effected you in a very negative fashion. However, it is wonderful that your step-son has grown beyond his home environment, and (from your implications), seems to have become both an example for the impressionable youth, and an asset for his community!

RE: my misspellings. Yep, I have a few. And normally, I would NEVER call anyone out on theirs. HOWEVER, the ironic moment of reading someone bashing teachers in general with a misspelling in the same sentence simply was not to be missed. Talk about making someone's day! Well, actually several 'someone's', to be honest.

. . ."as there is no better way to learn." I'll help you with your problem, since you've expressed an interest in working on it. For instance: principle, (as used in your thoughtful reply): An important underlying law or assumption required in a system of thought, or; a standard of moral or ethical decision-making. I would wager that you really wanted to use the word 'principal'.

Riled? Nope. Nothing in your reply that would evoke that type of response. Keep 'em coming! .[/SIZE]

[Mjolnir]

Originally Posted by satellite66

Uniforms would solve this stuff. Take the fashion show and agenda show out of it.

9 years of catholic school have convinced me of this as well.