Scope wont stay put - The Firearms Forum

Jake · 08-31-2008, 10:49 AM

How in the heck do you get a scope to stay put on a marlin model 70HC? sighted it back in last night and went squirrel hunting today and the scope had slid back about an eight of an inch. I have had this problem with every marlin I have ever owned. What's a guy have to do braze the sucker down?

carver · 08-31-2008, 12:36 PM

Try using some clear finger nail polish. It works for me, comes off easy if you want to take it off, and won't harm your finish. Works about as well as blue locktight, costs less, and has more uses. Plus it dries clear!

Jake · 08-31-2008, 07:42 PM

Tried the finger nail polish and after 25 shots the scope rings had moved back almost 1/4 inch. I'm bout to get ticked! I'm thinking about getting a gun that's drilled and tapped and getting weaver style mounts. That otta cure the problem eh. Any suggestions?

Enfield · 09-01-2008, 02:01 AM

Hi
this a common problem with high powered air rifles - for them you can get seprate clamping blocks that you put on behind the scope mounts - It may be worth looking into

Cheers

Enfield in NZ

AL MOUNT · 09-01-2008, 06:45 AM

h2oking · 09-01-2008, 11:27 AM

Being not familiar with your gun I don't know how the scope is mounted. If the scope is sliding in the rings what would a new style mount do for you that your present mount is not doing. That statement about different style mounts leads me to believe you have a mount problem rather than a ring problem. Please explain if the mount is moving on the rifle or is the scope moving in the rings. The finger nail polish suggestion should have cured the problem if it is the rings but it would not likely fix a mount problem.

Ron

Bindernut · 09-01-2008, 06:08 PM

Assuming your 70 is like pretty much eveyr other marlin semi out there and has the 3/8" dovetail mount intergral to the aluminum receiver.
I'd try a little abrasive grit applied to the mounting surface to give the clamps a little "bite" on the dovetail. A little grit from the sandblasting cabinet, some coarse rubbing compound, or even (gawd-forbid) a little fine sand will work.

If that doesn't work, try a different set of rings. Most of those 3/8" dovetail rings are cheap, cheap, cheap and manufacturing tolerances might be sloppy enough that they won't clamp down tightly to your rifle. Or it's possible that your dovetail is a little undersize too. Both Millet and Redfield make solid steel rings for 3/8" dovetails. I'm partial to the Millet rings myself...they have a wide range of clamp adjustment and should tighten down nicely on even a well worn dovetail.

Or...you could do the drill and tap for a Weaver base like in your second post. I'd try another set of rings first.

Jake · 09-02-2008, 08:21 PM

The problem is indeed that the rings wont bite the receiver. Nail polish didn't work! If fine sand will work I'm in business, we only have about 100 tons of it at work. Not really worried about the finish. The gun has it's 'BEAUTY' marks from butt plate to muzzle, so whats another scratch or a dozen. I would resort back to open sights, but I lost the front sight a few years ago. Just wish the mounts would stay put!

h2oking · 09-03-2008, 12:02 AM

It sounds like a little ugly wouldn't bother you so I would suggest gorilla glue. It isn't pretty but I would guess a little dab on each mount and you give it night to cure it will solve your problem.

Ron

Mark · 09-03-2008, 07:47 AM

Beeman Air Rifles, are they still in business?, has/had a product called a scope stop. This was simply a block made to bite into the dovetail, and provide a stop for the scope mount.
These are extremely effective, and I would be very surprised if it wouldn't work for you.
Good luck,
Mark

dokey · 09-06-2008, 08:24 AM

get yourself some Loctite 420 (you'll have to ge tit at an industrial supply like Fastenall or Graingers). After the scope is set where you want it put a couple of drops on the mounts , the stuff will wick down and lock the mounts to the dovetail. 420 is designed to fasten pre-positioned parts and is amazing

user · 09-06-2008, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dokey

get yourself some Loctite 420 (you'll have to ge tit at an industrial supply like Fastenall or Graingers). After the scope is set where you want it put a couple of drops on the mounts , the stuff will wick down and lock the mounts to the dovetail. 420 is designed to fasten pre-positioned parts and is amazing

Not sure whether 420 is blue, purple, or red. Red will require a torch to get it loose, blue will require elbow grease but not heat. Purple is in the middle. I use blue on gun stuff, and red on the ring gear bolts inside the differential in my truck.

Bindernut · 09-08-2008, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by user

Not sure whether 420 is blue, purple, or red. Red will require a torch to get it loose, blue will require elbow grease but not heat. Purple is in the middle. I use blue on gun stuff, and red on the ring gear bolts inside the differential in my truck.

I'm not at work either at the moment so I'm not positive but I'm pretty sure 420 is clear. 420 is a thin, wicking, fast-acting adhesive...it's actually Loctite's brand name for the thin formula Crazy Glue (Ethyl Cyanoacrylate adhesive).
We use a lot of Loctite 609 and 680 at work for fastening parts together, but a few small machines spec to use 420.

420 will release with a light hammer tap, but it's a bugger to chip out of threads once it's cured...609 and 680 will take a healthy smack to break loose but it cleans out of threads much easier.

On threads...like scope mounts and such...I prefer 242 thread locker. It's red, but is a light-shear strength very similar to the blue stuff you can buy at any auto parts store.

AngelDeville · 09-08-2008, 06:00 PM

Jake · 09-10-2008, 08:33 PM

Bought some Millet scope rings. I think if these rings slide it will cut the dovetail off the receiver. You talk about bite! Haven't got a chance to shoot it yet, but I will venture a guess and say PROBLEM SOLVED! After seeing the way these rings bite, I don't think I'll ever use anything else on dovetail mounts.

Bindernut · 09-11-2008, 07:36 PM

Sounds like you've got the problem licked. That's why I like those Millet rings...they're stout and will clamp down onto pretty much anything resembling a 3/8" dovetail mount.

358 winchester · 09-12-2008, 09:05 AM

Jake you have solved the problem, they are tops in my book.

Jake · 09-12-2008, 09:03 PM

Well.............................. they won't hold either. They did hold longer but still slipped. Sighted the gun in a 25 yards and proceeded to shoot the bullseye out of the target and my shot started to get lower and a bit to the left. Sure enough the damn rings slid back almost 1/4 inch. When I got home I grabbed the allen wrench and checked the screws. I couldn't budge them. I repositioned the rings on a part of the dovetail that looked like new. Again sighted it in at 25 yards. After about 100 or so rounds the shots started to get lower again. You guessed it, they moved again. There is plenty of room to tighten the screws more but they are tighter than my sister in-law with a dollar bill! Now what, drill and tap it? If that don't work I'll wrap the damn thing around a tree and blow it to hell with a few 12 gauge slugs! Getting the hint this sucker has got me ticked?

canonguy · 09-13-2008, 09:17 PM

I guess what it boils down to...aluminum is not the best material for recievers. $150.00 guns have them and $600.00+ guns don't. Try putting all 4 riings on it. 2 rings in the front of the adjustment knobs and 2 in the back

Bindernut · 09-14-2008, 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jake

Well.............................. they won't hold either. They did hold longer but still slipped.

Now that just stinks! I feel your frustration...and figured for sure those Millet rings would have enough grip on them to keep things from sliding.
What's your Marlin chambered for? 300WinMag?

(Sorry...I couldn't resist that one.)

Another option might be to drill the rings and the receiver for a press fit pin in each ring. This would act like a recoil lug for the ring on the receiver and would eliminate the need for another new mount & ring set and the tapping part of the process. Just drill each ring and press fit & loctite a piece of 1/8" drill rod (welding rod, etc) to it so it protrudes about 1/8" or so from the ring. Then drill the receiver at least a hair over 1/8" deep (or you could drill through completely too I suppose) where you want each ring located and mount the rings that way. They sure as heck shouldn't slide with that setup.

artabr · 09-14-2008, 09:56 AM

Jake,
You may want to try to place a thin brass shim between your mount and the dovetail on your receiver. Remember to shim front and rear rings the same amount.

Art

Jake · 09-27-2008, 10:16 PM

Problem solved! Savage Mark II! NICE!!!

lizardtrack · 10-01-2008, 08:05 PM

I had the same problem with my 717 in M2. I got another set mounts for the grooved receiver and cut the rings off flush. Then I put them behind the mounts holding the scope. That did it for me, now I can remove the variable scope and put on the straight 24X and the poi is very close when replacing either scope. Good luck

08-31-2008, 10:49 AM	#1
Jake V.I.P. Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 176	Scope wont stay put How in the heck do you get a scope to stay put on a marlin model 70HC? sighted it back in last night and went squirrel hunting today and the scope had slid back about an eight of an inch. I have had this problem with every marlin I have ever owned. What's a guy have to do braze the sucker down? __________________ Definition of gun control: USING BOTH HANDS AND HITTING YOUR TARGET!!! -->

08-31-2008, 12:36 PM	#2
carver TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: DAV, Deep in the Pineywoods of East Texas, just west of Shreveport, LA Contributor Posts: 11,283	Re: Scope wont stay put Try using some clear finger nail polish. It works for me, comes off easy if you want to take it off, and won't harm your finish. Works about as well as blue locktight, costs less, and has more uses. Plus it dries clear!

08-31-2008, 07:42 PM	#3
Jake V.I.P. Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 176	Re: Scope wont stay put Tried the finger nail polish and after 25 shots the scope rings had moved back almost 1/4 inch. I'm bout to get ticked! I'm thinking about getting a gun that's drilled and tapped and getting weaver style mounts. That otta cure the problem eh. Any suggestions? __________________ Definition of gun control: USING BOTH HANDS AND HITTING YOUR TARGET!!! Last edited by Jake; 08-31-2008 at 07:43 PM..

09-01-2008, 02:01 AM	#4
Enfield V.I.P. Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: NZ Posts: 302	Re: Scope wont stay put Hi this a common problem with high powered air rifles - for them you can get seprate clamping blocks that you put on behind the scope mounts - It may be worth looking into Cheers Enfield in NZ

09-01-2008, 06:45 AM	#5
AL MOUNT Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Cleaning my Thompson in The Foothills of the Ozark Mountains Posts: 3,108	Re: Scope wont stay put __________________ 501st Parachute Infantry Regiment 101st Airborne Division Vietnam 67-68

09-01-2008, 11:27 AM	#6
h2oking Former Guest Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Carson City Nevada Posts: 145	Re: Scope wont stay put Being not familiar with your gun I don't know how the scope is mounted. If the scope is sliding in the rings what would a new style mount do for you that your present mount is not doing. That statement about different style mounts leads me to believe you have a mount problem rather than a ring problem. Please explain if the mount is moving on the rifle or is the scope moving in the rings. The finger nail polish suggestion should have cured the problem if it is the rings but it would not likely fix a mount problem. Ron Last edited by h2oking; 09-01-2008 at 11:33 AM..

09-01-2008, 06:08 PM	#7
Bindernut Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ND, USA Posts: 2,453	Re: Scope wont stay put Assuming your 70 is like pretty much eveyr other marlin semi out there and has the 3/8" dovetail mount intergral to the aluminum receiver. I'd try a little abrasive grit applied to the mounting surface to give the clamps a little "bite" on the dovetail. A little grit from the sandblasting cabinet, some coarse rubbing compound, or even (gawd-forbid) a little fine sand will work. If that doesn't work, try a different set of rings. Most of those 3/8" dovetail rings are cheap, cheap, cheap and manufacturing tolerances might be sloppy enough that they won't clamp down tightly to your rifle. Or it's possible that your dovetail is a little undersize too. Both Millet and Redfield make solid steel rings for 3/8" dovetails. I'm partial to the Millet rings myself...they have a wide range of clamp adjustment and should tighten down nicely on even a well worn dovetail. Or...you could do the drill and tap for a Weaver base like in your second post. I'd try another set of rings first. Last edited by Bindernut; 09-01-2008 at 06:11 PM..

09-02-2008, 08:21 PM	#8
Jake V.I.P. Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 176	Re: Scope wont stay put The problem is indeed that the rings wont bite the receiver. Nail polish didn't work! If fine sand will work I'm in business, we only have about 100 tons of it at work. Not really worried about the finish. The gun has it's 'BEAUTY' marks from butt plate to muzzle, so whats another scratch or a dozen. I would resort back to open sights, but I lost the front sight a few years ago. Just wish the mounts would stay put! __________________ Definition of gun control: USING BOTH HANDS AND HITTING YOUR TARGET!!!

09-03-2008, 12:02 AM	#9
h2oking Former Guest Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Carson City Nevada Posts: 145	Re: Scope wont stay put It sounds like a little ugly wouldn't bother you so I would suggest gorilla glue. It isn't pretty but I would guess a little dab on each mount and you give it night to cure it will solve your problem. Ron

09-03-2008, 07:47 AM	#10
Mark V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 314	Re: Scope wont stay put Beeman Air Rifles, are they still in business?, has/had a product called a scope stop. This was simply a block made to bite into the dovetail, and provide a stop for the scope mount. These are extremely effective, and I would be very surprised if it wouldn't work for you. Good luck, Mark

09-06-2008, 08:24 AM	#11
dokey Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 20	Re: Scope wont stay put get yourself some Loctite 420 (you'll have to ge tit at an industrial supply like Fastenall or Graingers). After the scope is set where you want it put a couple of drops on the mounts , the stuff will wick down and lock the mounts to the dovetail. 420 is designed to fasten pre-positioned parts and is amazing

09-08-2008, 06:00 PM	#14
AngelDeville Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: ABQ Posts: 644	Re: Scope wont stay put __________________ Why don't guns go off "accidentally" when people aren't around?

09-10-2008, 08:33 PM	#15
Jake V.I.P. Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 176	Re: Scope wont stay put Bought some Millet scope rings. I think if these rings slide it will cut the dovetail off the receiver. You talk about bite! Haven't got a chance to shoot it yet, but I will venture a guess and say PROBLEM SOLVED! After seeing the way these rings bite, I don't think I'll ever use anything else on dovetail mounts. __________________ Definition of gun control: USING BOTH HANDS AND HITTING YOUR TARGET!!! Last edited by Jake; 09-10-2008 at 08:34 PM..

09-11-2008, 07:36 PM	#16
Bindernut Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ND, USA Posts: 2,453	Re: Scope wont stay put Sounds like you've got the problem licked. That's why I like those Millet rings...they're stout and will clamp down onto pretty much anything resembling a 3/8" dovetail mount.

09-12-2008, 09:05 AM	#17
358 winchester TFF Admin Staff Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Pensacola Fl. area Posts: 7,335	Re: Scope wont stay put Jake you have solved the problem, they are tops in my book. __________________ Administrator & Owner RangeDay.com Proud, White, Heterosexual, Gun Owning, Southern American, Christian. Any question about where I stand?

09-12-2008, 09:03 PM	#18
Jake V.I.P. Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 176	Re: Scope wont stay put Well.............................. they won't hold either. They did hold longer but still slipped. Sighted the gun in a 25 yards and proceeded to shoot the bullseye out of the target and my shot started to get lower and a bit to the left. Sure enough the damn rings slid back almost 1/4 inch. When I got home I grabbed the allen wrench and checked the screws. I couldn't budge them. I repositioned the rings on a part of the dovetail that looked like new. Again sighted it in at 25 yards. After about 100 or so rounds the shots started to get lower again. You guessed it, they moved again. There is plenty of room to tighten the screws more but they are tighter than my sister in-law with a dollar bill! Now what, drill and tap it? If that don't work I'll wrap the damn thing around a tree and blow it to hell with a few 12 gauge slugs! Getting the hint this sucker has got me ticked? __________________ Definition of gun control: USING BOTH HANDS AND HITTING YOUR TARGET!!!

09-13-2008, 09:17 PM	#19
canonguy Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Kalamazoo, Michigan Posts: 15	Re: Scope wont stay put I guess what it boils down to...aluminum is not the best material for recievers. $150.00 guns have them and $600.00+ guns don't. Try putting all 4 riings on it. 2 rings in the front of the adjustment knobs and 2 in the back

09-14-2008, 09:56 AM	#21
artabr Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: New Iberia, Louisiana Contributor Posts: 7,859	Re: Scope wont stay put Jake, You may want to try to place a thin brass shim between your mount and the dovetail on your receiver. Remember to shim front and rear rings the same amount. Art __________________ God and the soldier we like adore, In times of trouble, not before. When troubles ended and all things righted, God is forgotten and the soldier is slighted. Francis Quarles 1592 - 1644 __________________ When asked for my race, I answer CauCajun. Hope is not a plan, and not all change is good. The resistance is here; the resistance is now. RESIST! These hands are neither cold nor are they dead!!

09-27-2008, 10:16 PM	#22
Jake V.I.P. Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 176	Re: Scope wont stay put Problem solved! Savage Mark II! NICE!!! __________________ Definition of gun control: USING BOTH HANDS AND HITTING YOUR TARGET!!!

10-01-2008, 08:05 PM	#23
lizardtrack Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 12	Re: Scope wont stay put I had the same problem with my 717 in M2. I got another set mounts for the grooved receiver and cut the rings off flush. Then I put them behind the mounts holding the scope. That did it for me, now I can remove the variable scope and put on the straight 24X and the poi is very close when replacing either scope. Good luck