Venezuelan target rifle - The Firearms Forum

Road America · 01-27-2009, 09:08 PM

I have a military type 7mm FN M98 Mauser that is marked with the Venezuelan crest, but it has a rear sight that is adjustable for windage and elevation. The rifle has a 3 digit serial number. I was told it made for some sort of shooting competion in the early 1950's. Does anyone know any more about this gun? Thanks

300 H&H · 01-27-2009, 09:17 PM

If you would,

Pleas discribe the rear sight....Is it a aperture (peep) sight? Or better yet post a picture....Kirk

flaminjo · 01-28-2009, 04:06 AM

why dont you post a picture of your 7mm FN M98 Mauser! it would be interesting for all of us to see!

Road America · 01-28-2009, 05:45 PM

It's not a peep sight, just an open v notch. The sight assembly is like the regular military with a sliding ramp for elevation. There is a knurled knob on the right side to move the notch for windage.
I'll try to get some pictures posted - if I can figure out how. I don't have a digital camera and I barely know enough about computers to be dangerous.

300 H&H · 01-28-2009, 07:07 PM

Road America,( My favorite race track has this name

)

The windage knob has me interested, as I think the battle sight version had no windage provisions included, as the front sight was moved to zero the rifle in. (if I happen to be wrong about this, others please chime in here) I will do some checking to see if I can find a pic, meanwhile, see if you can find a way to post one. Best regards Kirk

Road America · 01-29-2009, 08:55 PM

Ok, I have a few pictures of it on an email, and I saved them on a disc. Now how do I get them on here? I clicked on a little box with a paper clip thingy, but it got way too complicated after that!
Kirk - Road America is my favorite race track too - I live close enough to hear the cars running - sometimes I can tell which group is out there by the sound.
Jim

300 H&H · 01-29-2009, 10:36 PM

RA,

Wish I could help with the pics, as I am "challenged" to do this myself, unless my 11 year old is around!

I have spent a fair amount of time at the track, used to crew for a regular who raced there, and was part of a parade on track celebrating the 20 aniversary of the Pointiac Trans Am, with one of each year doing laps. Mine was the 1972 example. Fun is not enough to discribe the experiance!

If you go down to the bottom of the home page of TFF, you will find a forum called the members test forum, and if I am not mistaken there is a sticky note there explaining how to post pictures.

I will be watching for your pics, and will help you if I can.

Best regards Kirk

TRAP55 · 01-31-2009, 12:47 PM

Jim, if you can email the pics, send them to me and I'll post them for you. Make sure you put "Mauser pics" in the subject line so I don't dump it with the spam.
dbevans957246887@aol.com

TRAP55 · 02-01-2009, 11:51 AM

Here's the pics of the rear sight:

Road America · 02-01-2009, 05:49 PM

Thanks - jeez my hands look awful in those pictures. I'm 61, but those hands look like I'm about a hundred! Must be the lighting - yea, that's it.

TRAP55 · 02-01-2009, 08:52 PM

Jim, looking 100 ain't half as bad as feeling 100 when I get out of bed.

I ran this by the man I consider an expert, it most definitely got his attention! I think ya found a keeper, here's his reply:

Wow!

Ball's book indicates that Venezuela converted some specially-selected FN M1924/30 Short Rifles into target rifles to use in training for the Olympics. The rear sight pictured looks just like this one. I note the serial number stamped on the receiver ring and stock, something that may be indicative of a low-production piece.

The converted rifles were rebarreled and the target barrel was much longer. However, the stock was the standard short rifle stock, so the barrel went way past the bayonet lug & cleaning rod (as if you put a Gew 98 action in a Kar 98k stock).

300 H&H · 02-01-2009, 09:44 PM

Road America,

Looks like we need to know if the barrel is looooonnnngggg enough to be one of these rifles!!! Thanks again TRAP55 for your help. Yes it could be a keeper! Best regards Kirk

Road America · 02-02-2009, 06:58 PM

Ok, I have it here with a tape measure. The barrel is 27 and 1/4 inches long (from the face of the bolt to the end). It sticks out past the stock by 9 and 7/16, and is 7 and 5/8 past the end of the bayonett lug. The section of the barrel that sticks out past the stock is turned down slightly in diameter.
The stock is 37 and 5/8 long overall. Is this what would be meant by the barrel "going way past the bayonett lug"?
I wonder how well they did in the Olympics and what year it was.
As far as it being a keeper, well, I have a couple of Swedish Mausers that I really like and this one would probably be more interesting to someone who collects Mausers. I would be willing to sell it I guess.

TRAP55 · 02-11-2009, 02:06 PM

Jim, take a look at the fourth one down!

http://www.collectiblefirearms.com/RiflesMauser.html

Road America · 02-11-2009, 06:22 PM

Hi - That rifle is certainly similar, but not identical. That rear sight goes to 300, mine goes to 100. The windage knob has marks on it, mine doesn't. That receiver is polished and not blued, mine is blued. The barrel on that one seems to be shorter, it ends around where the cleaning rod ends. Mine goes about 4 1/2 inches beyond that. The front sight seems different, but that one has a sight protector (?) on it. Mine has a much lower serial number.
Mine says "FUERZAS ARMADAS DE VENZEZUELA" next to the crest.
I wouldn't describe mine as being in as good a condition as they are saying that one is. The bore is ok, but not real crisp and perfect and my wood has more dings in it than that one seems to have.

I really enjoy this site, thanks guys. Part of the fun in guns is learning about them and the history envolved. Maybe if I do enough reading about this gun I will be able to spell Venezuela without looking it up!
Jim

300 H&H · 02-11-2009, 08:47 PM

Road America,

Yours sounds more like a target rifle, with the exception of the rear sight. But your front sounds like a hooded target sight. Wonder if there were some different versions of this rifle? Kirk

300 H&H · 02-12-2009, 06:28 AM

Jim,

Just looked your rifles pictures over, and I am pretty sure your rear sight goes to 1,000yds. As to the windage markings, well I don't know.....But I sure would be looking to find out more about that rifle, as I think it could still be a special target model, and valuable as well. Kirk

Road America · 02-13-2009, 07:34 PM

The numbers on the sight go from 1-10, but you're right - that must mean 100-1000 yards (or meters maybe). 100 yards maximum wouldn't make any sense. When you slide the bar up to 10 the sight is pretty high, for long range.
Trap55 - what is "Ball's book"? That sounds like something I should try to find.
Jim

TRAP55 · 02-14-2009, 10:38 AM

Best price I could find on the book:
http://www.goldengatebookstore.com/r...64&affnr=-2610

Road America · 02-15-2009, 08:06 AM

Thanks - I should order that. I had forgotten I had "Mauser Bolt Rifles" by Ludwig Olson in my bookshelf. It has a nice section on the Swedish ones but not much on the Venezuelans.

TRAP55 · 02-15-2009, 12:12 PM

That's another good book. Your rifle is another rare piece of Mauser history that I've just learned about. Your serial number indicates it is one of the target rifles built. I'm curious how many variations they may have had on those.
I don't think one author could cram all the interesting Mauser tidbits into one book.

01-27-2009, 09:08 PM	#1
Road America V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 177	Venezuelan target rifle I have a military type 7mm FN M98 Mauser that is marked with the Venezuelan crest, but it has a rear sight that is adjustable for windage and elevation. The rifle has a 3 digit serial number. I was told it made for some sort of shooting competion in the early 1950's. Does anyone know any more about this gun? Thanks -->

01-27-2009, 09:17 PM	#2
300 H&H Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,796	Re: Venezuelan target rifle If you would, Pleas discribe the rear sight....Is it a aperture (peep) sight? Or better yet post a picture....Kirk

01-28-2009, 04:06 AM	#3
flaminjo Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 28	Re: Venezuelan target rifle why dont you post a picture of your 7mm FN M98 Mauser! it would be interesting for all of us to see!

01-28-2009, 05:45 PM	#4
Road America V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 177	Re: Venezuelan target rifle It's not a peep sight, just an open v notch. The sight assembly is like the regular military with a sliding ramp for elevation. There is a knurled knob on the right side to move the notch for windage. I'll try to get some pictures posted - if I can figure out how. I don't have a digital camera and I barely know enough about computers to be dangerous.

01-28-2009, 07:07 PM	#5
300 H&H Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,796	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Road America,( My favorite race track has this name) The windage knob has me interested, as I think the battle sight version had no windage provisions included, as the front sight was moved to zero the rifle in. (if I happen to be wrong about this, others please chime in here) I will do some checking to see if I can find a pic, meanwhile, see if you can find a way to post one. Best regards Kirk

01-29-2009, 08:55 PM	#6
Road America V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 177	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Ok, I have a few pictures of it on an email, and I saved them on a disc. Now how do I get them on here? I clicked on a little box with a paper clip thingy, but it got way too complicated after that! Kirk - Road America is my favorite race track too - I live close enough to hear the cars running - sometimes I can tell which group is out there by the sound. Jim

01-29-2009, 10:36 PM	#7
300 H&H Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,796	Re: Venezuelan target rifle RA, Wish I could help with the pics, as I am "challenged" to do this myself, unless my 11 year old is around! I have spent a fair amount of time at the track, used to crew for a regular who raced there, and was part of a parade on track celebrating the 20 aniversary of the Pointiac Trans Am, with one of each year doing laps. Mine was the 1972 example. Fun is not enough to discribe the experiance! If you go down to the bottom of the home page of TFF, you will find a forum called the members test forum, and if I am not mistaken there is a sticky note there explaining how to post pictures. I will be watching for your pics, and will help you if I can. Best regards Kirk

01-31-2009, 12:47 PM	#8
TRAP55 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Occupied Territory Of Kalifornia Posts: 1,834	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Jim, if you can email the pics, send them to me and I'll post them for you. Make sure you put "Mauser pics" in the subject line so I don't dump it with the spam. dbevans957246887@aol.com __________________ Aim small...Miss small www.mausercentral.com/forum

02-01-2009, 11:51 AM	#9
TRAP55 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Occupied Territory Of Kalifornia Posts: 1,834	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Here's the pics of the rear sight: __________________ Aim small...Miss small www.mausercentral.com/forum

02-01-2009, 05:49 PM	#10
Road America V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 177	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Thanks - jeez my hands look awful in those pictures. I'm 61, but those hands look like I'm about a hundred! Must be the lighting - yea, that's it.

02-01-2009, 08:52 PM	#11
TRAP55 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Occupied Territory Of Kalifornia Posts: 1,834	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Jim, looking 100 ain't half as bad as feeling 100 when I get out of bed. I ran this by the man I consider an expert, it most definitely got his attention! I think ya found a keeper, here's his reply: Wow! Ball's book indicates that Venezuela converted some specially-selected FN M1924/30 Short Rifles into target rifles to use in training for the Olympics. The rear sight pictured looks just like this one. I note the serial number stamped on the receiver ring and stock, something that may be indicative of a low-production piece. The converted rifles were rebarreled and the target barrel was much longer. However, the stock was the standard short rifle stock, so the barrel went way past the bayonet lug & cleaning rod (as if you put a Gew 98 action in a Kar 98k stock). __________________ Aim small...Miss small www.mausercentral.com/forum Last edited by TRAP55; 02-01-2009 at 08:55 PM..

02-01-2009, 09:44 PM	#12
300 H&H Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,796	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Road America, Looks like we need to know if the barrel is looooonnnngggg enough to be one of these rifles!!! Thanks again TRAP55 for your help. Yes it could be a keeper! Best regards Kirk

02-02-2009, 06:58 PM	#13
Road America V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 177	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Ok, I have it here with a tape measure. The barrel is 27 and 1/4 inches long (from the face of the bolt to the end). It sticks out past the stock by 9 and 7/16, and is 7 and 5/8 past the end of the bayonett lug. The section of the barrel that sticks out past the stock is turned down slightly in diameter. The stock is 37 and 5/8 long overall. Is this what would be meant by the barrel "going way past the bayonett lug"? I wonder how well they did in the Olympics and what year it was. As far as it being a keeper, well, I have a couple of Swedish Mausers that I really like and this one would probably be more interesting to someone who collects Mausers. I would be willing to sell it I guess.

02-11-2009, 02:06 PM	#14
TRAP55 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Occupied Territory Of Kalifornia Posts: 1,834	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Jim, take a look at the fourth one down! http://www.collectiblefirearms.com/RiflesMauser.html __________________ Aim small...Miss small www.mausercentral.com/forum

02-11-2009, 06:22 PM	#15
Road America V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 177	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Hi - That rifle is certainly similar, but not identical. That rear sight goes to 300, mine goes to 100. The windage knob has marks on it, mine doesn't. That receiver is polished and not blued, mine is blued. The barrel on that one seems to be shorter, it ends around where the cleaning rod ends. Mine goes about 4 1/2 inches beyond that. The front sight seems different, but that one has a sight protector (?) on it. Mine has a much lower serial number. Mine says "FUERZAS ARMADAS DE VENZEZUELA" next to the crest. I wouldn't describe mine as being in as good a condition as they are saying that one is. The bore is ok, but not real crisp and perfect and my wood has more dings in it than that one seems to have. I really enjoy this site, thanks guys. Part of the fun in guns is learning about them and the history envolved. Maybe if I do enough reading about this gun I will be able to spell Venezuela without looking it up! Jim

02-11-2009, 08:47 PM	#16
300 H&H Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,796	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Road America, Yours sounds more like a target rifle, with the exception of the rear sight. But your front sounds like a hooded target sight. Wonder if there were some different versions of this rifle? Kirk

02-12-2009, 06:28 AM	#17
300 H&H Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,796	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Jim, Just looked your rifles pictures over, and I am pretty sure your rear sight goes to 1,000yds. As to the windage markings, well I don't know.....But I sure would be looking to find out more about that rifle, as I think it could still be a special target model, and valuable as well. Kirk

02-13-2009, 07:34 PM	#18
Road America V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 177	Re: Venezuelan target rifle The numbers on the sight go from 1-10, but you're right - that must mean 100-1000 yards (or meters maybe). 100 yards maximum wouldn't make any sense. When you slide the bar up to 10 the sight is pretty high, for long range. Trap55 - what is "Ball's book"? That sounds like something I should try to find. Jim

02-14-2009, 10:38 AM	#19
TRAP55 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Occupied Territory Of Kalifornia Posts: 1,834	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Best price I could find on the book: http://www.goldengatebookstore.com/r...64&affnr=-2610 __________________ Aim small...Miss small www.mausercentral.com/forum

02-15-2009, 08:06 AM	#20
Road America V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 177	Re: Venezuelan target rifle Thanks - I should order that. I had forgotten I had "Mauser Bolt Rifles" by Ludwig Olson in my bookshelf. It has a nice section on the Swedish ones but not much on the Venezuelans.

02-15-2009, 12:12 PM	#21
TRAP55 Advanced Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Occupied Territory Of Kalifornia Posts: 1,834	Re: Venezuelan target rifle That's another good book. Your rifle is another rare piece of Mauser history that I've just learned about. Your serial number indicates it is one of the target rifles built. I'm curious how many variations they may have had on those. I don't think one author could cram all the interesting Mauser tidbits into one book. __________________ Aim small...Miss small www.mausercentral.com/forum