M&P pistol what caliber should i carry?

[islenos]

Originally Posted by oscarmayer

wow so many people here think the 45 is a magic bullet. it's more about shot placement than caliber....the numbers just dont put the 45 that much ahead of the pack over a 9mm a 40 , and 357

In a running gun battle, shot placement is a pipe dream, your not going to be in your favorite stance you use at the shooting range. Personally being in a JTF Unit with both .45 and 9mm, I must say the .45 is far more devastating then a 9mm on the human body.

side note: I have no practical experience with a .40 so I will devolve that to another.

[oscarmayer]

"running gun battle" yep i've heard of such things but to me that crys untrained..... if you put yourself in a postion to have to be in a "running gun battle", to much has already gone wrong for it to matter if you're packing a 45 or a m14 .........

[zfk55]

The Sentry heard footsteps approaching in the dark. Stepping into the center of the road under his guardpost light, his rifle at Port Arms he challenged the approaching figure. "Halt! Who goes there?!"
From a point in the darkness off to the approaching figure's side came a single flash and a shot.
The Sentry fell.
-------------------------------------------------------------

The Sentry heard footsteps approaching in the dark.
Staying hidden in the shadow of his guardpost just off the road he quietly challenged the approaching figure. "Halt. Who goes there?" No answer.
Seeing a shadow moving just off the road to the approaching figure's side he sighted as best he could and fired. There was an audible "thud". Turning his weapon to the now running figure approaching, he fired again, dropping the unknown encroacher.
--------------------------------------------------------------

That was an excerpt from my Father's Chronicles. Does it tell you anything?

[oscarmayer]

slightly different than a running gun battle.

[zfk55]

Comes under the heading of "How to avoid a................."

[oscarmayer]

yep good point the running gun battle though it does happen is a tactical error and a hit in the arm with a 45 isn;t going to be that much more devestating than a hit in the arm with a 9mm ....

[zfk55]

Unless........ Unless you happen to have the magic, golden .45 projectile.
I carry a .45 most of the time.

[oscarmayer]

every where i check the magic 45 acp's are sold out i have to settle for the ones that require shot placement in order to be effective

[islenos]

Originally Posted by oscarmayer

"running gun battle" yep i've heard of such things but to me that crys untrained..... if you put yourself in a postion to have to be in a "running gun battle", to much has already gone wrong for it to matter if you're packing a 45 or a m14 .........

I have yet to be in a situation where I was defending my car from a would-be carjacker where a simple draw point bang would suffice, or facing a would-be home invader in a three foot wide hallway with a shotgun in hand. In either situation shot placement would be quite achievable.

‘Untrained’, well, I can say the Marine Corps is not so keen on teaching proper table etiquette and ballroom dancing is not in the curriculum. But shot placement is a required course. What I can offer, from personal experiences, is that close up easy well placed shots are not always going to be available.

If one only fires, from a set position, on a stationary target then the well placed shot will come second nature. You can proudly pin your target on your office wall for all your coworkers to drool over.

But when multiple bad guys are coming around the corner, bobbing and weaving and tossing lead in your direction, all the static shooting in the world is not going to give the edge in this fight. (Remember Murphy's Laws of Combat)

Train like you Fight, Fight like you Train.

[oscarmayer]

remember we are talking real world/life experiences not walter mitty situations where you have to defend yourself against hords of bad guys. situational awareness and shot placement are keys. do not allow yourself to be put into a situation where a "running gun battle" is your only option. and my point here was the 45 isn't a end all be all it's just one of many fine calibers that if you do your job can get you out of a bind. now if you expect hords of evil doers to be just around the corner , you're in the wrong neighborhood, and no handgun will save you. you've underestimated badly,you don't own a cell phone... the police have all quit their jobs,you were checking out you're local riot and forgot there might be danger involved.....

[islenos]

Originally Posted by oscarmayer

remember we are talking real world/life experiences not walter mitty situations where you have to defend yourself against hords of bad guys.

I was talking of REAL WORLD experiences to begin with:

Personally being in a JTF Unit with both .45 and 9mm, I must say the .45 is far more devastating then a 9mm on the human body.

My whole point is: Prepare for the worst and hope for the best. But if you only prepare for the best (the perfect shot) then you will not be prepared for the worst.

Much the same way that I feel about bench shooting, if you are in load development then fine but one will rarely find themselves defending their lives from the bench. One must be able to fire from any angle, position, left or right handed etc.

Getting back to the previous question. Given that you may not be able, at all times, to be able to make that 'perfect shot' then you will want a round that does the most damage possible. From my above mentioned statements, I have personally observed the destructive power of both the 9mm and .45acp. Although I am not a trained physician, from my view the .45acp out performs the 9mm. That is, In My Most Humble Opinion!

[DWARREN123]

9mm, 40 S&W, 45 ACP or whatever floats your boat. It is a pesonal decision, all will work very well when used correctly.

[oscarmayer]

Professionals argue tactics. -- Amateurs argue caliber."
Anonymous
not my quote but very fitting...........

[islenos]

Originally Posted by oscarmayer

Professionals argue tactics. -- Amateurs argue caliber."
Anonymous
not my quote but very fitting...........

I hope you are not referring to me

[oscarmayer]

no not at..... all this is a quote from someone that thought the 45acp/1911A1 combination was the only pistol worth a damn. though later in life he changed his mind and acknowledged the fact with the continued research and up-gradeing the other caliber were almost equally effective. he has always professed tactics over caliber perhaps you've heard of him...... jeff cooper

[Charles Butler]

Originally Posted by oscarmayer

Professionals argue tactics. -- Amateurs argue caliber."
...........

i like this quote its very fitting

[islenos]

never mind - statement was struck

[oscarmayer]

When asked to summarize a recent gunfight, Bill Hickock (known for his short answers) was quoted at saying simply, "He missed. I didn't." Bill correctly concluded that his point was made and that additional details would be superfluous. There is no substitute for surgical accuracy, no matter how exciting the situation. "Lots of shooting" doesn't end fights. Hits do!,and caliber matters not...... he carried 36 caliber cap and ball in a time when 45 colts, 44/40 were all the rage