Got a call from Wayne Lapierre last night

[45nut]

Looking for money talking about HR 45??

I thought that bill was lying dead on the floor, so what is the NRA talking about? I checked govtrack.us and the last update they had was in April.

So WTH is Wayne doing??

[mrkirker]

So WTH is Wayne doing??

Trolling for Bucks?

[45nut]

Originally Posted by mrkirker

So WTH is Wayne doing??

Trolling for Bucks?

I know how to troll for fish, but how do you kill a deer trolling?

Yeah, I didn't even finish the pre-recorded message.....as if there is any other kind of recorded message.

[gdmoody]

I really get tired of getting the calls and all of the mass mailings looking for money. In my humble opinion, if they would quit sending the millions of letters and making the phone calls, they would have enough money!

[mrkirker]

Know what you mean. I got so tired of the NRA phone calls, the NRA 'disaster of the month/week' solicitation letters, and the constant ‘NRA drum roll of doom’ that I dropped my membership a few years ago. Same with the SCV. I review the candidates and vote accordingly. Takes a bit more effort, though.

"Pre-recorded message" LOL! Kinda ranks up there with a 'cured ham' eh?

[45nut]

Cured Ham must have been a marketing phrase meant for city slickers.

[Blackhawk Dave]

Yes, they troll for money. However, if you send the price of a couple of cups of Starbucks to the NRA, GOA, etc every month, it's well worth it. Don't complain right now, because the alternative is too scary to consider. And it's quite possible.

Consider that under the Health Care laws, they could attempt to outlaw guns as being harmful and increasing health care costs. Carbon tax ammo out of existance. Or any other number of things just depending on which set of knuckleheads try to issue regulations.

[armedandsafe]

I really get tired of getting the calls and all of the mass mailings looking for money.

Know what you mean. I got so tired of the NRA phone calls, the NRA 'disaster of the month/week' solicitation letters, and the constant ‘NRA drum roll of doom’

All it takes is an email or a free phone call to NRAILA to get dropped to 2 or 3 contacts per year. It is sad that so few people are willing to pick up the phone or a keyboard.

Pops

[mrkirker]

Pops, sad that they are not a little more forthcomming 'bout the optin' out option. But, why even "two or three calls" a year?

[Southern Boy]

Well, i guess I dont like telemarketing either, but.. NRA dont call me but I do get 4 or 5 letters a year, I usually give what i can spare. I would not if they did not send the letters."out of sight out of mind" The NRA-ILA spends a lot of money on pro gun lobbying and lawyers so it's worth it to me.In Florida alone they got the Castle doctrine enacted, the 'stand your ground law, and helped alot with concealed carry so I guess I owe them something. Without them I doubt any handguns or "black" rifles would be legal here. I would be willing to bet, if the marketing stopped, so would the money. just one rednecks opinion.

[Hardballer]

OK. For anyone not involved in a non-profit or not for profit; I am, if
you do not constantly, continually, daily, hourly etc. ad nauseum,
infinitum, fund raise, guess what? No funds magically show up on your
door step.

As a matter of fact, if you are off the radar for any amount of time at
all, you are out of business. This I know from copious amounts of
research on the subject and personal efforts in fund-raising.

Not paying the NRA your dues or the GOA or whatever gun group you
choose to support; because they contact you for money, is like shooting
yourself in the foot because your toe hurts.

I don't care what the excuse you have for not paying; other than food,
house payment/rent, or you died, they are all a crock. These
organizations are our only voice with any pull at all in Washington and
without them, we would be in a far worse place.

What I want to know is where are the 70 or 80 million gun owners. I am
tired of carrying them.

I just duck hunt, it doesn't affect me. Oh heck, I just target shoot, it
doesn't affect me. I'm just a collector, no worries here. Well DU and the
rest of these groups have been so silent for so long, nobody hears them
any more. They have no voice. Unless you want to save a swamp.

All that great duck hunting land is not worth a damn except to the ducks
if you can't own a gun.

Just ask an Australian who had his fine collection destroyed by the powers
that be.

You all are going to be a sad bunch of reactors when you finally realize it
was way too little far too late. Wait and see is fine for growing corn or
waiting for the rain but it does not work for human rights, civil rights or
God given rights. Oh and for those of you who don't believe in God, just
realize the Universe has given you the right to defend yourself by
whatever means necessary. It is in your DNA. No brain workin' necessary.

The only thing that will work now is to “act” and act now.

Please do not waste any pixels on how the NRA doesn't do this or does
too much of that or whatever. It is a lame excuse to cheap out and let
the other guy do it. Not a word of it holds a buckets worth of water.

The next thing I'll hear is how you feel Disenfranchised or disaffected so
your not paying. Waaaaaa!

Whatever!

Speak, write, do!

P.S. If you are a member of the NRA and can read and write or you can
manage speaking with little difficulty, you may at your whim or will,
decide to opt out with nothing more than a phone call or email. This is
not difficult or hidden. Just requires the barest amount of effort. There's
the hitch.

[pickenup]

Originally Posted by mrkirker

So WTH is Wayne doing??

Trolling for Bucks?

Yup!!!

[Pistolenschutze]

Everybody has their respective buttons, so to speak, and the big red one with me is telemarketers and money solicitors! I am NEVER nice to them; indeed, they tend to evoke language from me that I haven't used since my Army days! For a while there, I was getting 3-5 calls a week from NRA soliciting money for one thing or another, or trying to sell me Xmas cards or some other stupid thing. I finally told the last one that if I received just one more call from NRA on ANY subject, I would drop my membership immediately. Apparently they listened since I haven't heard from them since, and I am still a member. As for NRA itself, while I believe in the cause they represent with all my heart and soul, I do believe NRA has become far too commercial and money oriented over the last few years. Yes, they are a voice for us--sometimes an effective one--but they are risking that voice by the sheer stridency of their money-making calls aimed at their membership. Just my $.02 worth.

[45nut]

Originally Posted by Hardballer

The next thing I'll hear is how you feel Disenfranchised or disaffected so
your not paying. Waaaaaa!

Whatever!

Yo dude,

I've been a member for a long time. Got the hat and T-shirt. My (apparently too subtle) point was more along the lines of manufacturing a crisis to raise money. (Never let a good crisis go to waste - Mr. Emanuel) We know that HR45 is as good as dead now, although it will probably come up again in some form or fashion. And while I don't like telemarketers much, for the right causes I endure them.

Having said that, why didn't the NRA call / write when this was first introduced? GOA sends alerts on current legislation as needed. The NRA has done and will do a lot of good, although I am not a fan of some of their compromises unlike GOA. I support both because we can't afford not to.

Peace

[mrkirker]

As for NRA itself, while I believe in the cause they represent with all my heart and soul, I do believe NRA has become far too commercial and money oriented over the last few years. Yes, they are a voice for us--sometimes an effective one--but they are risking that voice by the sheer stridency of their money-making calls aimed at their membership.

Well said!

Additionally; What's with the notion that if one doesn't belong to one of these money-grubbing groups, that one somehow is incapable of voicing an opinion to an elected official? That's 'money grubber' propaganda. Perhaps I am the exception, but I manage to contact and track my reps regarding their voting record.

[Hardballer]

Originally Posted by mrkirker

I do believe NRA has become far too
commercial and money oriented over the last few years.

Please see above. #11

Originally Posted by mrkirker

Additionally; What's with the notion that if one doesn't belong to one of
these money-grubbing groups, that one somehow is incapable of voicing
an opinion to an elected official? That's 'money grubber' propaganda.
Perhaps I am the exception, but I manage to contact and track my reps
regarding their voting record.

This is the one I love to hear. When you get tired of receiving a form
letter in return sent by some 26 year aid old who probably didn't read it
anyway, you'll understand why an organization with 5 million plus members
has some pull.

Remember the old, very old saying, Ibi victoria, ubi concordia (United we
stand, divided we fall!)? That saying exists for a reason. It is true.
Remember? Divide and conquer?

Granted, you may be an exceptional human being but you do stand
alone. Money grubbers or not, we need the power of the people united.

No. I do not believe your voice can be heard or appreciated by any
elected official. Especially those who already think you are the enemy.
Just how naive does one need to be to believe that?

If your voice is heard, your not being counted. It is simply a tick on a
white board. or a notation of agreement or decent in some computer.
Ignored if you don't happen to agree with the sitting Representative.

Over 15 elected representatives recently on various issues, stabbed us
collectively in our backs. Think. Did your voice mean anything to them.
You have no power. No voice. No authority. Nothing as an individual.
The same was true more than 200 years ago, perhaps more so today.

Conyers showed us all what money and power can do. See ACORN
investigation. Oh, I mean what investigation.

I am ashamed to say that there are 80 million gun owners in this country
and only 4-5 million are members of the NRA or far fewer, the GOA. If
you fall into this group, you are clearly independent and you have that
right but we may all fall because of people like you. I for one do not want
to be alone with my back against the wall!!!

The NRA or GOA is not just three guys with hats. This money gets used
to do a job in a world where money talks. Don't you see the power we
have together, every gun owner standing side to side? 80 million gun
owners shouting different things at different times is a whisper compared
to 80 million gun owners shouting one thing at the same time. The roar
would be deafening. That's how it's done!

I hope you and those like you wake up before you and your single voice
ruin it for the rest of us. Stand with us and we all win, stand alone and
we all lose. I welcome you to stand with me by joining the NRA or GOA.

Just IMHO. Speak,

Write, Do!

[DebS]

Originally Posted by Hardballer

Over 15 elected representatives recently on various issues, stabbed us
collectively in our backs. Think. Did your voice mean anything to them.
You have no power. No voice. No authority. Nothing as an individual.

Truer words were never spoken. I studied and voted for candidates that did not win. I have written hundreds of letters sent via email and snail mail that have all gone unanswered or form lettered. I spend hours a day on research and over a thousand dollars so far this year alone on everything from membership fees, contributions, phone calls all the way down to envelopes and stamps.

Originally Posted by Hardballer

....80 million gun owners shouting different things at different times is a whisper compared to 80 million gun owners shouting one thing at the same time. The roar would be deafening. That's how it's done!

I hope you and those like you wake up before you and your single voice
ruin it for the rest of us. Stand with us and we all win, stand alone and
we all lose. I welcome you to stand with me by joining the NRA or GOA.

Yes, if you want your Rights, join those of us that contribute. I'm tired of contributing while there are those of us that make excuses for why they can't or won't join/contribute/participate. I recommend joining/contributing the NRA-ILA which was created just for legislative purposes only. I would also recommend the Second Amendment Foundation as a solid, highly litigious group that is getting their attention. But it too, can only survive with our contributions.

I am only one person and can only work so hard and spend so much money on preserving our rights. I can't do it alone.

[pickenup]

General question, aimed at no one in particular.

Are you a veteran?
Do you know a vet?

Did you ask the NRA why they SUPPORTED
the Veterans Disarmament Act?

When every PRO-gun group,
as well as veterans organizations OPPOSED it!!!

IF you asked them why, did you get an answer?

I asked, no answer.

[45nut]

My point exactly pickenup.

[Bobitis]

My take on the NRA.
They need to cut their overhead.
They spend far too much money begging for money.
Printing is expensive. Postage is expensive. That BIG AZZ glitzy office is expensive.

http://www.graphicnet.net/photo/nra-headquarters

How many people do they need to employ?
How much money do they spend galavanting around the country side at the members expense? Wish I could afford Waynes suits and collect his frequent flyer miles.

IMHO, the NRA has long gone by the wayside as a grass roots organization.
They are a political organization with all the trademarks thereof.

Do they do good work? Yes.
Could they do better? HELL yes.

Maybe they should appoint a committee to examine how to better serve the members.

[Hardballer]

Originally Posted by pickenup

General question, aimed at no one in particular.

Are you a veteran?
Do you know a vet?

Did you ask the NRA why they SUPPORTED
the Veterans Disarmament Act?

When every PRO-gun group,
as well as veterans organizations OPPOSED it!!!

IF you asked them why, did you get an answer?

I asked, no answer.

Please read here.

Anybody else who needs their hand held, please apply elsewhere.

[DebS]

Originally Posted by pickenup

General question, aimed at no one in particular.

Are you a veteran?
Do you know a vet?

Did you ask the NRA why they SUPPORTED
the Veterans Disarmament Act?

When every PRO-gun group,
as well as veterans organizations OPPOSED it!!!

IF you asked them why, did you get an answer?

I asked, no answer.

I assume your rant was directed at me or maybe Hardballer. I'll be happy to reply.

Yes, I know a vet. I married a vet; USMC HMX-1 Presidential Helicopter Squadron. Instructed to get the President to a safe location in case of severe emergencies, then give up his life because of what he'd know.

And yes, he did ask the NRA-ILA why they supported the VDA. They did answer. He received a very informative letter back, explaining their position and why they supported it. He also received a phone call asking if he had any other questions or concerns about it. They discussed this issue in detail to his satisfaction. He did not totally agree with their support of it, but they did have valid arguements as to why they were supporting it.

If you don't like the NRA, then don't join/contribute. If you are interested in contributing to legislative issues ONLY, then contribute to the NRA-ILA. The NRA cannot legally use NRA membership money's for legislative issues.

I have contacted the ILA for support in the House of my State and have gotten legislation scheduled for a fair hearing on a pro-2A bill with their help. That's why I contribute to the ILA. You don't have to.

But not helping to keep your 2A rights in this environment is not acceptable. Contribute to another group; you've already been directed to consider GOA and SAF. Excuses for not supporting ANY group because you don't like one, aren't valid.

When the rest of us that are funding and working for your 2A Rights end up not being able to give enough, don't complain when you lose YOUR rights along with the rest of us.

[pickenup]

Calling members, trying to put the boogy man scare into them, just to raise funds, on a basically DEAD BILL, is just another straw on the camels back concerning the NRA.

Everyone has their own threshold.
A bit of research, and I reached mine.
Some people need more straws than others.

Some of that research is posted here......
http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/showthread.php?t=46537

And just for the record, I belong to a number of PRO-firearms organizations. Just because I do, unlike many who do nothing more than send in their dues, leaving it up to the organization to speak for them. I STILL contact ALL of my representatives personally (not saying it does any good) but if 90 or 100 MILLION gun owners spoke out, the ONE compromising voice of the NRA would be drowned out.

[alhefner]

It boils down to what you are willing to do right now to preserve/ restore the Second Amendment.

Most of us here want to follow a peaceful route to the restoration of the Second Amendment to its original intention. That the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed...period!

To do that, we must be able to speak as a collective voice. As stated above, one voter flooding politicians offices with emails, letters, and phone calls is seldom really heard. It is when thousands or millions of persons are able to do that that the politician will begin to pay attention.

Now, thousands or millions of individuals, acting separately, with the same grievance can get a politician's attention and that is certainly important. One problem though is that those individuals need a method of finding out what requires action on their part and a fairly simple means of taking that action. That is where groups such as GOA, NRA-ILA, SAF, and others come into play.

By joining one of these pro-Second Amendment groups, choose the one you like best, your voice then becomes part of a collective and that group now has a way to notify you whenever they feel action is required on your individual part. They can also provide you with a very simple means of taking that action!

Most of the pro-Second Amendment groups also provide information around election times of politicians who are either pro-Second Amendment or anti-Second Amendment. Some use member contributions to advertise for or against politicians!

Member contributions to pro-Second Amendment groups are used in a wide variety of ways. One of those uses is recruiting new members! Other uses are for legal advisers to pick apart legislation. Some of the $$$ is spent sending representatives around the country to drum up support for the organization and inform members in person of just what is going on in the group.

I am not a huge fan of the NRA-ILA but I do support the GOA! I am a bit radical in my view...I feel that every law restricting firearms ownership is unconstitutional. Because of that, I'll support only the group that comes closest to my personal view.

Complaining about endless calls begging for $$$ from the NRA or GOA is not the answer! What do you think would happen if you were to lose every brain cell you had and joined ACORN or PETA? You would get a call daily from each group as well as everyone they sold your contact info to!

As for the OP, HR-45 may not be showing any progress but it STILL EXISTS! It is still there, just waiting to be revived, in hibernation. Until it is thrown on the fire, it remains a potential threat.

[Hardballer]

I am not advocating drinking the NRA Koolaid either. I don't like compromise. I just know that together we stand. This is no longer a private issue. I you said you have found something that works better, out with it. This is not about hurt feelings, disgruntled attitudes about marketing etc. This is about survival.

I am not even the extremist here. It is almost universally recognized that we are in the fight of our lives. Lets put this stuff aside and get to it. "they" will take away your liberty and freedom to choose an advocate just to give some slacker, your money, your livelihood, your future.

Rhetoric like this whining is pointless so speak, write, do and get-r-done. Let the NRA know that you will not put up with the direction they are going in any longer. Tell your friends to make the case as well. But lets not take the bite out of this dog before he has a chance to change.