Snub Nose For Home Defense? - The Firearms Forum

ninjatoth · 07-03-2009, 09:26 PM

I am not trained at all in defense,so I just went it alone with my own thoughts on home defense and ended up with a 2" .357.I figured if I was ever tackled,I could manuveur it enough to shoot the bad guy off of me,and it would also be easier to keep from being snatched from out of my hands.Anyone have any thoughts on my way of thinking?

vytoland · 07-03-2009, 10:37 PM

what ever you choose to use for defense, don't let the BG get close enough to tackle you. you need to take care of business before that happens

don't think about it. DO IT!

woolleyworm · 07-04-2009, 12:28 AM

My thoughts on any defense...............TRAIN, TRAIN AND TRAIN. Hit the books, go to class, learn proper safety tecniques and get to the range to practice; Often. As I've posted before, one of my firearms pet peeves are gunowners who keep a loaded weapon at home, yet don't ever get out to the range.
A .357 snubbie is a fine defensive weapon, very fine; but without knowing any weapon "personally", you may not get the desired effect from it. Knowing what ammo works best and where your aimpoint/bullet impact are at, is what is going to save your butt, not just pulling the trigger.

Welcome to the forums and Enjoy !!

Doc1911 · 07-04-2009, 01:17 AM

IMO, the snubbie is not a good home defense weapon. While it is a great CQ and backup weapon - at least in my home if someone breaks down one of the doors I could be making in excess of 20 yard shots. In such a situation I would rather have a longer barrel on the weapon - especially if I am shooting in low light, etc.

In addition, at least in FL, we are having multiple assailants enter homes - 2-4 BGs - so in such a case I would still desire to be better armed with a shotgun or at least a 4"-5" weapon.

In FL we have a Castle Doctrine. If you enter my home w/o permission, I am not waiting for you to tackle me - if the BG got that far I haven't done my job correctly.

Something to slow down the BGs if they are in complete darkness is to train your children NOT to put their toys up, but rather leave them in strategic positions .... (also arrange your furniture to channel the BGS ... force them to come to you where you already have pre-arranged fields of fire ....).

Pistolenschutze · 07-04-2009, 10:18 AM

I have mixed emotions about a .38 snubbie for home defense. Certainly, it will do the job if you don't get into a sustained firefight with more than one opponent. Unlikely, but always possible. Keep in mind also that a snubbie is not a terribly easy weapon to learn to use accurately due to the short sight radius. Practice, practice, practice is the name of the game if you choose to use one.

Also, I would strongly suggest you load that .38/357 with good hollowpoint .38s, not .357s, for home defense use. The muzzle blast, sound effects, and recoil from a .357 at close quarters in a confined space is unbelievable! Follow up shots are difficult for even a trained user.

Marlin · 07-04-2009, 11:38 AM

I carry a older model S&W 60 as it is lighter than wither the 1911 or the Browning Hi-Power. With the weight of my oxygen bottle and valve, it is easier.

At other times, I have carried it as a back-up in an ankle holster. Once trained, one can do damage with it. Having been on the street years ago, I don't hesitate to carry and use it.

I do agree with the others, though, that it is not the ideal weapon for home defense. I don't have, but would like to, a short 12 gauge with a long tube, i.e., the Remington 870 designed for home and self-defense. That would be the ideal.....

Pistolenschutze · 07-04-2009, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marlin

I don't have, but would like to, a short 12 gauge with a long tube, i.e., the Remington 870 designed for home and self-defense. That would be the ideal.....

Very true, Marlin. Nothing, absolutely NOTHING beats a short-barreled 12 with a full cylinder barrel at close range. I keep a Marlin 500 with an 18 inch barrel for just that reason.

TranterUK · 07-04-2009, 12:52 PM

Have you tried the gun at a range with full power loads? If not it might be an idea.

You will go with Pistols suggestion, and buy some .38spls.

Pistolenschutze · 07-04-2009, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TranterUK

Have you tried the gun at a range with full power loads? If not it might be an idea.

You will go with Pistols suggestion, and buy some .38spls.

You are quite correct, Tranter. Been there, done that, got the T-shirt.

A .357 in a light, short-barreled revolver is by no means easy or comfortable to shoot. In fact, personally I find them actually painful.

LurpyGeek · 07-04-2009, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pistolenschutze

You are quite correct, Tranter. Been there, done that, got the T-shirt.

A .357 in a light, short-barreled revolver is by no means easy or comfortable to shoot. In fact, personally I find them actually painful.

And that's at a range. I can't imagine the muzzle flash / blast in a confined space like a hallway.

ninjatoth · 07-04-2009, 04:48 PM

I shoot about 50 rounds a month through it,DA,SA, sometimes .357 158s,sometimes .38 158s.I notice even in SA,hitting a target with the .357s is alot harder.I have no problem hitting a notebook sized target at 25 yards with .38s,but the .357s are a different story.I did some DA shooting while moving one handed with .38s also,and could hit my target,I havent tried that with .357 loads yet,but I have a feeling It wouldn't go as well.Can someone tell me why I am way off with full .357s even in SA slow shots,I am way high,.38s arent a problem though?It can't possibly be kicking up before the bullet leaves the barrel can it?!

delta13soultaker · 07-04-2009, 05:33 PM

It's not the ammo, it's you, bud...Pushing in anticipation of recoil breaks the wrist slightly up and causes the shot placements to go high.

You can check this easily by loading 2 or 3 random cylinders and closing it blind...just watch for your behavior on the dry chambers and you'll see what is happening.

**Some people do the opposite and dip their head subconsciously down, causing the muzzle to dip.

Lotsdragon · 07-04-2009, 10:16 PM

Practice practice practice! Thats the key!Switch it up some so you can feel the difference. dont like a snubbie myself but as everyone else will tell you its no the caliber its the placement. IF bg's do come at you dont let them get within grabbing distance. Be safe and have fun but practice is the key!

Pistolenschutze · 07-04-2009, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by delta13soultaker

**Some people do the opposite and dip their head subconsciously down, causing the muzzle to dip.

And most LTs have their heads stuck. . . oh, never mind, that's a different topic.

Maximilian II · 07-05-2009, 02:57 AM

Scientifically: does a .357 Magnum bullet fired from a short barrell like those found in derringers or snubnose revolvers REALLY achieve energy superior to .38 special rounds? I have heard they don't. Anyone checked?
My info, which is hearsay at best, says there's no benefit in using .357 Mag in short barrelled pistols.
I'm assuming factory loads here, but I'd listen to handloaders too.

ninjatoth · 07-05-2009, 09:03 AM

Quote:

My info, which is hearsay at best, says there's no benefit in using .357 Mag in short barrelled pistols

In this test,the best winchester .38+p achieved 258 ft lbs from a 2.5" barrel,as where the same gun fired a remington .357 with 429 ft lbs.That is figured from the winchester .38+p 158 grain at 858fps,and the remington .357 being 125 grain at 1243fps.According to them,there is a huge difference

ninjatoth · 07-05-2009, 09:04 AM

forgot the link,
http://www.snubnose.info/docs/38-snub_vs_357-snub.htm

delta13soultaker · 07-05-2009, 12:28 PM

An opinion to think about...

Looking at ft-lbs in handgun energy is totally pointless.

429 ft-lbs is less than a kid at martial arts practice can deliver with a punch.

I say with some humor...If it is below 1,000 ft-lbs, you're going to get further comparing nail polish colors or Ann Rice novels than you will ft-lbs of energy.

The point is this, in a 2.5" the terminal ballistics difference between .38, .38+P, and .357 Mag is not great enough to warrant the cost the higher power ammo taxes the firer.

.357 Mag indoors will pop ear drums, leave you confused, and the flash is an orange ball everywhere you look for 30 minutes.

.38 +P is just about as bad.

The recoil of these ammunition in lightweight sub-nosed revolvers is a reduction in firepower; you are trading the ability for rapid follow-up shots, recoil management, accuracy and the user forgiveness of standard pressure .38 Special ammunition for this: hard to use ammunition that punishes the firer and has no great terminal ballistics advantage.

You are indoors:

You have 5 rounds...all need to be accurate.

A standard pressure or reduced recoil load (Federal) or even target wadcutters are easy to manage indoors.

The ammunition is not going to keep you alive. The handgun is not going to keep you alive. You're the one everything falls on. So whatever ammunition you choose, go practice with that roscoe often....aimed fire=center mass.

Blackhawk Dave · 07-05-2009, 12:59 PM

RE, long-barrel (shotgun, etc ) vs. pistol. 12 guage is better at at stand-off position. If you're going down the hall, looking for a bad guy, the gun gets to the doorway a long time before you do, giving the BG lots of time to grab it, push it out of the way, whatever. It becomes a lever with you at the fulcrum. A pistol of any type, in hand, puts two hands on the gun and the ability to lever the gun towards the BG, even if he's trying to grapple with you. You pull back, it extends the BG, putting the leverage on your side, and he's toast.

Not my opinion, but from several experts in the field. Seen it demonstrated as well, and it seems to work.

Now, if I know someone's trying to come in the front door, and I have time, my 12 guage will be the first weapon, with the pistol in my belt. Two loads through the door should discourage ANYONE.

Finally, IMHO, don't worry about foot pounds, etc in close proximity. I shoot both .38 SP and .357 rounds. Both will go through several layers of 3/4" plywood. If it will go through plywood, it will certainly do a job on a person. If the person's on the other side of a sheetrock wall, neither will slow appreciably and both will do the job. The only real reason to worry about speed would be at distance, and in a self-defense issue, that's close quarters and not a real worry.

Pistolenschutze · 07-05-2009, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by delta13soultaker

An opinion to think about...

Looking at ft-lbs in handgun energy is totally pointless.

Quite true, Delta, and that is a mistake that many make. What is so very often forgotten in all the talk about the "power" of one round v. another is the simple fact that only the rounds which impact the target count! You can't stop it if you don't hit it! As you well know, using a weapon that incapacitates the shooter with muzzle blast and recoil is not going to be effective past the first round discharged. I'd much rather have my P230 Sig, or your Walther

, in a closed room fight than any .357 magnum ever made.

delta13soultaker · 07-05-2009, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pistolenschutze

Quite true, Delta, and that is a mistake that many make. What is so very often forgotten in all the talk about the "power" of one round v. another is the simple fact that only the rounds which impact the target count! You can't stop it if you don't hit it! As you well know, using a weapon that incapacitates the shooter with muzzle blast and recoil is not going to be effective past the first round discharged. I'd much rather have my P230 Sig, or your Walther

, in a closed room fight than any .357 magnum ever made.

Yup. A .45 ACP is a pussycat indoors too.

torre · 07-10-2009, 01:15 PM

Target practice target practice. Don't just assume the bad guy is gonn come in and tackle you. What if he is at 15 feet and pointing a gun at you. Your 2" us not gonna be as accurate as you would like with no practice. Hopefully you will never have to use it for defesive purposes so get ou there and enjoy it and practice with it. Then if the day ever does come you will be prepared.

40CalJoe · 07-10-2009, 03:40 PM

If that is all you have then make it work. However, there is a difference between home defense and personal defense. In terms of Home defense, a shotgun will deliver more energy to the intended target than a handgun will.
I have a shotgun and several handguns available for my protection inside my home.

For personal protection a 2" 357 is a good choice in terms of simplicity, point and shoot. The 2" barrells are perfect for concealment under clothing, but are tough to shoot accurately. If that is your choice and it works for you, then practice alot.

I carry a Glock 27 (40 Cal), 10 rounds with a 3.46" barrell. Sits flatter against my body than a wheel gun and 4 more rounds. I shoot it very accurately out to 15 yards. Good luck with your choice.

TranterUK · 07-10-2009, 06:25 PM

I am not convinced a snubby is enough. I want to mount two .30 browning machine guns front and rear of the house. As you can imagine, it's not going to be that straight forward.

First, I dont want to be close to the window, too easily seen and shot at, but still require a good field of fire. Second good mounts, T and E gear. Hopefully we will be able to move them from window to window, thus confusing any incoming and varying the area covered as required.

Ammunition. How much is enough? I mean how many rounds might one expend in an engagement lasting a few hours? Keeping in mind re supply may be difficult.

Noise. .30s are loud. We must consider the neighbours so it might be a quieter calibre would be better, more neighbour friendly. After all, and attack is most likely to come at night, and they will be asleep.

Any ideas?

358 winchester · 07-10-2009, 07:15 PM

I have been reading and waiting until now the 30 cal. machine guns are almost enough

Home defense weapons in order of how I can reach them from a dead sleep
Short barrel 12 gauge pump seven shots / same in 20 on her side
Four inch S&W 625 45acp with 10 moon clips / 10 shot 22 S&W 317 with 3 inch barrel on her side
SKS loaded with full chest pack / M1 Carbine three 30 round mags her side
3 inch S&W 686 loaded and two speed loaders / she is now reloading for me
16 inch barrel 45 ACP carbine four ten round mags / she is still reloading
If that isn't enough then we are fight our way to the gun room and starting over with something in a 30-06 auto and a few 44 mags 357 mags in lever rifles and six inch barrels. These are just tools I don't own firearms

07-03-2009, 09:26 PM	#1
ninjatoth Former Guest Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Sanford,Michigan Posts: 369	Snub Nose For Home Defense? I am not trained at all in defense,so I just went it alone with my own thoughts on home defense and ended up with a 2" .357.I figured if I was ever tackled,I could manuveur it enough to shoot the bad guy off of me,and it would also be easier to keep from being snatched from out of my hands.Anyone have any thoughts on my way of thinking? -->

07-04-2009, 12:28 AM	#3
woolleyworm TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: SW Fort Worth Contributor Posts: 4,884	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? My thoughts on any defense...............TRAIN, TRAIN AND TRAIN. Hit the books, go to class, learn proper safety tecniques and get to the range to practice; Often. As I've posted before, one of my firearms pet peeves are gunowners who keep a loaded weapon at home, yet don't ever get out to the range. A .357 snubbie is a fine defensive weapon, very fine; but without knowing any weapon "personally", you may not get the desired effect from it. Knowing what ammo works best and where your aimpoint/bullet impact are at, is what is going to save your butt, not just pulling the trigger. Welcome to the forums and Enjoy !! __________________ . What are you gonna do, talk the alien to death? -- (on Sigourney Weaver's worry about Guns in Aliens) "Safety is something that happens between your ears, not something you hold in your hands." "I carry a small gun to compensate for my huge Blue press." .

07-04-2009, 01:17 AM	#4
Doc1911 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: USA Posts: 874	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? IMO, the snubbie is not a good home defense weapon. While it is a great CQ and backup weapon - at least in my home if someone breaks down one of the doors I could be making in excess of 20 yard shots. In such a situation I would rather have a longer barrel on the weapon - especially if I am shooting in low light, etc. In addition, at least in FL, we are having multiple assailants enter homes - 2-4 BGs - so in such a case I would still desire to be better armed with a shotgun or at least a 4"-5" weapon. In FL we have a Castle Doctrine. If you enter my home w/o permission, I am not waiting for you to tackle me - if the BG got that far I haven't done my job correctly. Something to slow down the BGs if they are in complete darkness is to train your children NOT to put their toys up, but rather leave them in strategic positions .... (also arrange your furniture to channel the BGS ... force them to come to you where you already have pre-arranged fields of fire ....). __________________ _____ Sincerely, Doc NRA Life Member

07-04-2009, 10:18 AM	#5
Pistolenschutze Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 13,094	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? I have mixed emotions about a .38 snubbie for home defense. Certainly, it will do the job if you don't get into a sustained firefight with more than one opponent. Unlikely, but always possible. Keep in mind also that a snubbie is not a terribly easy weapon to learn to use accurately due to the short sight radius. Practice, practice, practice is the name of the game if you choose to use one. Also, I would strongly suggest you load that .38/357 with good hollowpoint .38s, not .357s, for home defense use. The muzzle blast, sound effects, and recoil from a .357 at close quarters in a confined space is unbelievable! Follow up shots are difficult for even a trained user. __________________ --Pistolenschutze (Pistol Shooter)

07-04-2009, 11:38 AM	#6
Marlin TFF Admin Staff Chief Counselor Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: At SouthernMoss' side forever! Contributor Posts: 13,853	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? I carry a older model S&W 60 as it is lighter than wither the 1911 or the Browning Hi-Power. With the weight of my oxygen bottle and valve, it is easier. At other times, I have carried it as a back-up in an ankle holster. Once trained, one can do damage with it. Having been on the street years ago, I don't hesitate to carry and use it. I do agree with the others, though, that it is not the ideal weapon for home defense. I don't have, but would like to, a short 12 gauge with a long tube, i.e., the Remington 870 designed for home and self-defense. That would be the ideal..... __________________ *The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing.* *The only criminal class native to the United States is Congress.*

07-04-2009, 12:52 PM	#8
TranterUK Advanced Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Cambridge UK Posts: 5,103	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? Have you tried the gun at a range with full power loads? If not it might be an idea. You will go with Pistols suggestion, and buy some .38spls. __________________ DVC - Diligentia, Vis, Celeritas - Accuracy, Power, Speed. The light at the end of the recession tunnel IS a train coming the other way! Last edited by TranterUK; 07-04-2009 at 12:53 PM..

07-04-2009, 04:48 PM	#11
ninjatoth Former Guest Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Sanford,Michigan Posts: 369	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? I shoot about 50 rounds a month through it,DA,SA, sometimes .357 158s,sometimes .38 158s.I notice even in SA,hitting a target with the .357s is alot harder.I have no problem hitting a notebook sized target at 25 yards with .38s,but the .357s are a different story.I did some DA shooting while moving one handed with .38s also,and could hit my target,I havent tried that with .357 loads yet,but I have a feeling It wouldn't go as well.Can someone tell me why I am way off with full .357s even in SA slow shots,I am way high,.38s arent a problem though?It can't possibly be kicking up before the bullet leaves the barrel can it?!

07-04-2009, 05:33 PM	#12
delta13soultaker Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Depends on Uncle Sam's whim every 3 yrs. Posts: 2,948	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? It's not the ammo, it's you, bud...Pushing in anticipation of recoil breaks the wrist slightly up and causes the shot placements to go high. You can check this easily by loading 2 or 3 random cylinders and closing it blind...just watch for your behavior on the dry chambers and you'll see what is happening. Some people do the opposite and dip their head subconsciously down, causing the muzzle to dip. __________________ Never say die!** "A nation who forgets its defenders is soon forgotten itself." "A good shot must necessarily be a good man since the essence of good marksmanship is self-control and self-control is the essential quality of a good man." – Theodore Roosevelt

07-04-2009, 10:16 PM	#13
Lotsdragon Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Potosi, Mo Posts: 813	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? Practice practice practice! Thats the key!Switch it up some so you can feel the difference. dont like a snubbie myself but as everyone else will tell you its no the caliber its the placement. IF bg's do come at you dont let them get within grabbing distance. Be safe and have fun but practice is the key! __________________ "First comes smiles,then lies.Last is gunfire" Roland Deschain

07-05-2009, 02:57 AM	#15
Maximilian II Advanced Senior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Northwest GA Posts: 1,383	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? Scientifically: does a .357 Magnum bullet fired from a short barrell like those found in derringers or snubnose revolvers REALLY achieve energy superior to .38 special rounds? I have heard they don't. Anyone checked? My info, which is hearsay at best, says there's no benefit in using .357 Mag in short barrelled pistols. I'm assuming factory loads here, but I'd listen to handloaders too. __________________ Karma is just justice, without the satisfaction. And I don't believe in justice. -Joe Sarno, bagman.

07-05-2009, 09:04 AM	#17
ninjatoth Former Guest Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Sanford,Michigan Posts: 369	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? forgot the link, http://www.snubnose.info/docs/38-snub_vs_357-snub.htm

07-05-2009, 12:28 PM	#18
delta13soultaker Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Depends on Uncle Sam's whim every 3 yrs. Posts: 2,948	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? An opinion to think about... Looking at ft-lbs in handgun energy is totally pointless. 429 ft-lbs is less than a kid at martial arts practice can deliver with a punch. I say with some humor...If it is below 1,000 ft-lbs, you're going to get further comparing nail polish colors or Ann Rice novels than you will ft-lbs of energy. The point is this, in a 2.5" the terminal ballistics difference between .38, .38+P, and .357 Mag is not great enough to warrant the cost the higher power ammo taxes the firer. .357 Mag indoors will pop ear drums, leave you confused, and the flash is an orange ball everywhere you look for 30 minutes. .38 +P is just about as bad. The recoil of these ammunition in lightweight sub-nosed revolvers is a reduction in firepower; you are trading the ability for rapid follow-up shots, recoil management, accuracy and the user forgiveness of standard pressure .38 Special ammunition for this: hard to use ammunition that punishes the firer and has no great terminal ballistics advantage. You are indoors: You have 5 rounds...all need to be accurate. A standard pressure or reduced recoil load (Federal) or even target wadcutters are easy to manage indoors. The ammunition is not going to keep you alive. The handgun is not going to keep you alive. You're the one everything falls on. So whatever ammunition you choose, go practice with that roscoe often....aimed fire=center mass. __________________ Never say die! "A nation who forgets its defenders is soon forgotten itself." "A good shot must necessarily be a good man since the essence of good marksmanship is self-control and self-control is the essential quality of a good man." – Theodore Roosevelt

07-05-2009, 12:59 PM	#19
Blackhawk Dave Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Denton, TX Posts: 593	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? RE, long-barrel (shotgun, etc ) vs. pistol. 12 guage is better at at stand-off position. If you're going down the hall, looking for a bad guy, the gun gets to the doorway a long time before you do, giving the BG lots of time to grab it, push it out of the way, whatever. It becomes a lever with you at the fulcrum. A pistol of any type, in hand, puts two hands on the gun and the ability to lever the gun towards the BG, even if he's trying to grapple with you. You pull back, it extends the BG, putting the leverage on your side, and he's toast. Not my opinion, but from several experts in the field. Seen it demonstrated as well, and it seems to work. Now, if I know someone's trying to come in the front door, and I have time, my 12 guage will be the first weapon, with the pistol in my belt. Two loads through the door should discourage ANYONE. Finally, IMHO, don't worry about foot pounds, etc in close proximity. I shoot both .38 SP and .357 rounds. Both will go through several layers of 3/4" plywood. If it will go through plywood, it will certainly do a job on a person. If the person's on the other side of a sheetrock wall, neither will slow appreciably and both will do the job. The only real reason to worry about speed would be at distance, and in a self-defense issue, that's close quarters and not a real worry.

07-10-2009, 01:15 PM	#22
torre Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 5	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? Target practice target practice. Don't just assume the bad guy is gonn come in and tackle you. What if he is at 15 feet and pointing a gun at you. Your 2" us not gonna be as accurate as you would like with no practice. Hopefully you will never have to use it for defesive purposes so get ou there and enjoy it and practice with it. Then if the day ever does come you will be prepared. __________________ tactical gear

07-10-2009, 03:40 PM	#23
40CalJoe V.I.P. Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: In the middle Posts: 421	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? If that is all you have then make it work. However, there is a difference between home defense and personal defense. In terms of Home defense, a shotgun will deliver more energy to the intended target than a handgun will. I have a shotgun and several handguns available for my protection inside my home. For personal protection a 2" 357 is a good choice in terms of simplicity, point and shoot. The 2" barrells are perfect for concealment under clothing, but are tough to shoot accurately. If that is your choice and it works for you, then practice alot. I carry a Glock 27 (40 Cal), 10 rounds with a 3.46" barrell. Sits flatter against my body than a wheel gun and 4 more rounds. I shoot it very accurately out to 15 yards. Good luck with your choice. __________________ *I will give hussein obama exactly the same respect liberals gave George W Bush: NONE.*

07-10-2009, 06:25 PM	#24
TranterUK Advanced Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Cambridge UK Posts: 5,103	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? I am not convinced a snubby is enough. I want to mount two .30 browning machine guns front and rear of the house. As you can imagine, it's not going to be that straight forward. First, I dont want to be close to the window, too easily seen and shot at, but still require a good field of fire. Second good mounts, T and E gear. Hopefully we will be able to move them from window to window, thus confusing any incoming and varying the area covered as required. Ammunition. How much is enough? I mean how many rounds might one expend in an engagement lasting a few hours? Keeping in mind re supply may be difficult. Noise. .30s are loud. We must consider the neighbours so it might be a quieter calibre would be better, more neighbour friendly. After all, and attack is most likely to come at night, and they will be asleep. Any ideas? __________________ DVC - Diligentia, Vis, Celeritas - Accuracy, Power, Speed. The light at the end of the recession tunnel IS a train coming the other way!

07-10-2009, 07:15 PM	#25
358 winchester TFF Admin Staff Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Pensacola Fl. area Posts: 7,335	Re: Snub Nose For Home Defense? I have been reading and waiting until now the 30 cal. machine guns are almost enough Home defense weapons in order of how I can reach them from a dead sleep Short barrel 12 gauge pump seven shots / same in 20 on her side Four inch S&W 625 45acp with 10 moon clips / 10 shot 22 S&W 317 with 3 inch barrel on her side SKS loaded with full chest pack / M1 Carbine three 30 round mags her side 3 inch S&W 686 loaded and two speed loaders / she is now reloading for me 16 inch barrel 45 ACP carbine four ten round mags / she is still reloading If that isn't enough then we are fight our way to the gun room and starting over with something in a 30-06 auto and a few 44 mags 357 mags in lever rifles and six inch barrels. These are just tools I don't own firearms __________________ Administrator & Owner RangeDay.com Proud, White, Heterosexual, Gun Owning, Southern American, Christian. Any question about where I stand?