Hate crimes

[Bobitis]

Can someone tell me if this is even legal?

1st degree assault carries a punishment.
Muttering a racial/religious/sexual comment prior to the assault should carry a harsher punishment?

Can the hate crime be invoked when 2 parties are of the same persuasion?
If a ripped gay guy thinks someone is hitting on his man and beats the crap out of him; is that a hate crime?

If a black guy calls another 'nigger', it's a term of endearment. If a cracker did that, it's hate speach. If a black guy calls a white guy a honkey, it's no biggy.

What ever happened in the Duke Rape case?
Did that skank ever do jail time, let alone hate rape jail time?
Lives were destroyed, and nothing ever came of it other than lives were destroyed.

It's bad enough we have the race card being played in any possible situation. Now we have the hate card?

When does it stop?

Millions of innocent people die each year from malaria because the world has outlawed the use of DDT. Millions of innocent lives are aborted each year because "I don't want a kid".

Are these hate crimes also? NO?
Why NOT!

I better stop now.

[bcj1755]

Here ya go...

Obama inks defense bill with hate crimes provision
AP

14 mins ago

WASHINGTON – Trumpeting a victory against careless spending, President Barack Obama on Wednesday signed a defense bill that kills some costly weapons projects and expands war efforts. In a major civil rights change, the law also makes it a federal hate crime to assault people based on sexual orientation.

The $680 billion bill authorizes spending but doesn't provide any actual dollars. Rather, it sets guidance that is typically followed by congressional committees that decide appropriations. Obama hailed it as a step toward ending needless military spending that he called "an affront to the American people and to our troops."

Still, the president did not win every fiscal fight. He acknowledged he was putting his name to a bill that still had waste.

The measure expands current hate crimes law to include violence based on gender, sexual orientation, gender identity or disability. To assure its passage after years of frustrated efforts, Democratic supporters attached the measure to the must-pass defense policy bill over the steep objections of many Republicans.

The White House put most of its focus on what the bill does contain: project after project that Obama billed as unneeded. The bill terminates production of the F-22 fighter jet program, which has its origins in the Cold War era and, its critics maintain, is poorly suited for anti-insurgent battles in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Obama and Defense Secretary Robert Gates targeted certain projects for elimination, putting them at odds with some lawmakers. The same spending items deemed unnecessary or outdated by Pentagon officials can mean lost jobs and political fallout for lawmakers back in their home districts.

"When Secretary Gates and I first proposed going after some of these wasteful projects, there were a lot of people who didn't think it was possible, who were certain we were going to lose, who were certain that we were going to get steamrolled," Obama said. "Today, we have proven them wrong."

In another of several examples, the legislation terminates the replacement helicopter program for the president's own fleet. That program is six years behind schedule and estimated costs have doubled to more than $13 billion.

Yet the legislation still contains an effort by lawmakers to continue development — over the president's strong objections — of a costly alternative engine for the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, the Air Force's fighter of the future. A vague White House veto threat about that never came to fruition.

"There's still more fights that we need to win," Obama said. "Changing the culture in Washington will take time and sustained effort."

Obama signed the bill in the East Room, adding some fanfare to draw attention to his message of fiscal responsibility and support for the military.

He spoke more personally about the new civil rights protections. A priority of the late Sen. Edward M. Kennedy, D-Mass., that had been on the congressional agenda for a decade, the measure is named for Matthew Shepard, the gay Wyoming college student murdered 11 years ago.

Obama acknowledged Shepard's mom, Judy, and remembered that he had told her this day would come. He also gave a nod to Kennedy's family. Going forward, Obama promised, people will be protected from violence based on "what they look like, who they love, how they pray or why they are."

"This is a landmark step in eliminating the kind of hate motivated violence that has taken the lives of so many in our community," said Jarrett Barrios, president of the Gay & Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation.

The expansion has long been sought by civil rights and gay rights groups. Conservatives have opposed it, arguing that it creates a special class of victims. They also have been concerned that it could silence clergymen or others opposed to homosexuality on religious or philosophical grounds.

On the military front, the legislation approves Obama's $130 billion request as the latest installment of money toward the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

The far-reaching law also prohibits the Obama administration from transferring any detainee being held at the Guantanamo Bay military prison in Cuba to the U.S. for trial until 45 days after it has given notice to Congress. Guantanamo prisoners could not be released into the U.S.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091028/..._obama_defense
So now we another class of "protected citizen"

[red14]

So if someone murders someone, in a state with capital punishment already, will the convicted be killed twice?

[Bobitis]

3 times as I read it.

[Kieran McCaig]

Up here it's a hate crime when your add your chosen racial slur.

[obxned]

It is only a hate crime if the 'victim' is a member of one of the politically favored groups and the perp is a white male, and not a sodomite nor a muslim.

[red14]

Originally Posted by obxned

It is only a hate crime if the 'victim' is a member of one of the politically favored groups and the perp is a white male, and not a sodomite nor a muslim.

That's racist.


Everyone should be judged by the content of their character, rather than the color of their skin.

[rentalguy1]

white males are the only ones judged by the color of their skin.

[billin]

My personal preference would be, all other things being equal, to be killed by someone who hated me. Would you really want to be killed by someone who really didn't care?

[the morning light]

There is a penalty out their for every crime so why do we need hate crime laws? If it's not a hate crime, is it a love crime? They will add to the hate crimes bill every year until it will be a crime to voice your opinion in public. Then they will be scouring the internet looking for "Thought Criminals".

[red14]

Originally Posted by the morning light

There is a penalty out their for every crime so why do we need hate crime laws? If it's not a hate crime, is it a love crime? They will add to the hate crimes bill every year until it will be a crime to voice your opinion in public. Then they will be scouring the internet looking for "Thought Criminals".

Scary but true. We already have too many laws.

Of the 10 Commandments, only 2 are against the law always, sometimes 3 depending on where or when you live. Everything is so easy, if the 'Golden Rule' is followed!

Are you any less (or more) dead, if you were killed by a enemy, than a friend?

You are right, it is a veiled attempt to take away our freedoms little by little.

[bcj1755]

Get ready for the thought police people. Now we need the feds to protect us from our own evil and incorrect thoughts They have already demonstrated that they think we aren't intelligent enough to be able to handle freedom of speech, so therefore we aren't intelligent enough to handle freedom of thought, either.

Now don't get me wrong, I despise racism, REAL racism. It is wrong and I do NOT agree with it. However, if someone wants to have racist feelings, that is their right, just as it is my right to disagree with it. But we DO NOT need the government telling us what to think and say.

[Trouble 45-70]

Called Sens. Lincoln and Prior and Cong. Berrys offices. I found out the bill does not mean what is says and that it is important. It does not penalize speech etc. and will not silence or imprison or fine preachers. It won't censor the Bible. And pigs will fly. The staffers all appear to have been coached. Disgusted! Another attack on the citizens of this country by the 111th Congress. We are all more free now.

[Trouble 45-70]

It just hit me. If we are charged with a hate crime do we loose our 2nd amendment rights?

[Bobitis]

Originally Posted by bcj1755

Get ready for the thought police people. Now we need the feds to protect us from our own evil and incorrect thoughts They have already demonstrated that they think we aren't intelligent enough to be able to handle freedom of speech, so therefore we aren't intelligent enough to handle freedom of thought, either.

Now don't get me wrong, I despise racism, REAL racism. It is wrong and I do NOT agree with it. However, if someone wants to have racist feelings, that is their right, just as it is my right to disagree with it. But we DO NOT need the government telling us what to think and say.

Ahhhhh, but they already do.
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/assault

Verbal assault.

Combine that with an outburst from a Christian vs a Muslim, and you have hate verbal assault. Wonder what the penalty for that is?
Doesn't seem to be an issue if a Muslim cuts off the head of a Christian.
It's all in a days brain washing. No biggy.

Why is that?

[Trouble 45-70]

Originally Posted by red14

So if someone murders someone, in a state with capital punishment already, will the convicted be killed twice?

Interesting thought. In merry old England, crimes against the King were punishable by strangulation, revival followed by disembowelment often with entrails being burnt followed by drawing and quartering. This is the Cruel and Unusual punishment spoken of in our Constitution which is used to keep those so in need of capital punishment unharmed today.

[red14]

Originally Posted by Trouble 45-70

Interesting thought. In merry old England, crimes against the King were punishable by strangulation, revival followed by disembowelment often with entrails being burnt followed by drawing and quartering. This is the Cruel and Unusual punishment spoken of in our Constitution which is used to keep those so in need of capital punishment unharmed today.

Interesting points!

Some may believe capital punishment is cruel (I do not). But, it is by no means unusual.

Our own Navy (inspired by the aforementioned England) used to keel haul sailors. Many times the guilty were given x# of lashes. When a man died, he was still given the total of lashes accorded to him.

[Terry_P]

Originally Posted by red14

Our own Navy (inspired by the aforementioned England) used to keel haul sailors. Many times the guilty were given x# of lashes. When a man died, he was still given the total of lashes accorded to him.

That is just plain wierd. All that's doing is punishing the guy flogging him.

[red14]

Originally Posted by Terry_P

That is just plain wierd. All that's doing is punishing the guy flogging him.

I agree! That's why hate crimes are stupid. If you kill someone, does it matter if you hated or loved them. They're still dead.

Hating someone doesn't hurt them, Actions hurt, not thoughts.

I once had my nose broken before a softball game. Someone threw the ball to me when I wasn't looking. He didn't mean it. It was still broke. It still hurt. It still bled for 2 days. I still can't smell decent anymore.

[jacksonco]

Originally Posted by red14

I agree! That's why hate crimes are stupid. If you kill someone, does it matter if you hated or loved them. They're still dead.

Hating someone doesn't hurt them, Actions hurt, not thoughts.

I once had my nose broken before a softball game. Someone threw the ball to me when I wasn't looking. He didn't mean it. It was still broke. It still hurt. It still bled for 2 days. I still can't smell decent anymore.

You really should be paying better attention to what is going on around you. Sounds to me like you were making too many trips to the keg.

[red14]

Originally Posted by jacksonco

You really should be paying better attention to what is going on around you. Sounds to me like you were making too many trips to the keg.

It was before the even game started. I was the catcher, and talking to the umpire. The first baseman was warming up the infield. I have no idea why he threw the ball home. Someone yelled Wood! I turned to the sound, and the ball crashed into my nose. BAM! And the pain was tremendous.

[deanooo]

i suppose its just my thinking, but any crime committed is out of hate, there is no color, religion, or sexual orientation about it. my thinking again, but how many hate crimes do you see against white folks? and if the "hate crime" was committed against a white person do you suppose it would be a issue?

[el gato]

We have now reached a point in our history when to speak the TRUTH is no longer a virtue. Now it's hate speach.