medium range (500 yd) sharpshooting/sniping - The Firearms Forum

brockdp · 02-20-2010, 03:19 PM

Anyone with experience, what are your opinions on a rifle in .308 as far as AR-15 vs. M1A vs. M1A Scout? Plan on using with a 10x scope and bipod.

retired grunt · 02-20-2010, 05:59 PM

has to be semi?

cycloneman · 02-20-2010, 06:33 PM

An DPMS LR308 with a 24" bbl should give you 2700 + fps with good standard loads. If you use hornady light mag ammo you can expect 2900 + fps. A 10x scope is fine but why not get a variable say 6 to 24x. I also recommend a mill dot scope and learn how to use it. Once you have the rifle and match ammo I then would chrony the rifle and ammo. Then you can make a cheat sheet for bullet drop compensation. Shooting to 500 yrds is not a problem and actually easy if you buy the right stuff and learn how to use it. As far as a rifle goes the DPMS is very nice. What you are looking for is consistancy in your rifle and ammo. After that it's just a math problem.

AR or any Military type rifle will come with a heavy trigger pull. There is a guy on the net that can fix that problem for you for a couple of hunderd bucks. He installes set triggers. You can find him at williams trigger specialities. Do a search.

You can also look at the savage line of bolt actions. The varmitter comes with a 26" bbl and they even have 30" target mdl. The longer the bbl the slower burning powder you want to use. For hunting purposes the Hornady light mags work extremly well.

old semperfi · 02-20-2010, 07:35 PM

if you dont have to carry it the m1a is your only option as far as i am concerned.the scout has a shorter barrel and i wouldnt think it to be as accurate as the longer barrell.i shoot three savage tacticals.223,308,and 300 win mag.the three rifles are fairly heavy and the canjar triggers in each go for around 100.00 each.those you can install yourself,i keep my trigger pulls on them at six ounces(scary huh) old semperfi

brockdp · 02-22-2010, 03:06 PM

Yes, I am definitely intending on a semi-auto.

And I am mostly interested in comparisons of from-the-factory accuracy potential for the intended purpose.

Thanks.

Old Grump · 02-22-2010, 03:44 PM

Springfield M1A Scout AA9629, 308 Winchester, 16 1/4 inch barrel with muzzle break for just a hair over $2000.

Personally I would go with a Savage Model 10FCM with a 20" barrel for under $700. It will reach out to your 500 yards accurately, the trigger will be nicer and you can buy more ammo for the difference. But it is a bolt action.

cycloneman · 02-22-2010, 04:18 PM

brockdc

i sent you a pm.

brockdp · 02-24-2010, 02:49 PM

Thanks. I will continue to research this subject. I'm beginning to see though that a $1,500 AR is not going to give you the out of box accuracy you need, that's for sure. And curious that Springfield does not have MOA accuracy listed on their spec sheets for the M1A line.

I've been a handgunner for 20 years, but more of a casual rifle shooter. After watching some pretty cool shows this month on the Military Channel during "sniper month", I have developed a new interest in long range rifle shooting for accuracy.

Airdale · 02-24-2010, 06:34 PM

Ditto what Old Grump said. I started lusting after a Semi but after a little research I found a whole sub culture devoted to bolt action rifles. Cost a lot less (until the sickness sets in). Savage comes all dressed up but many start with a Rem. 700 heavy barrel and build from there. Waiting for my 700 with a new stock and other extras and a 20" barrel. Yes it will get way beyond 500 yds. with the shorter barrel.

cbvanb · 02-26-2010, 09:26 AM

You never really defined what your goals are at the intended range. As a former sniper our goal was a hit, which is a reasonable possibility with almost any quality rifle at 500 yards. If you truly want precision I would stick with a bolt action. Semi autos can be brought up to almost the same accuracy as a bolt, but it cost a lot more money to get that done, and they are still much more finicky. A well built bolt rifle can be dragged across the ground for two or three days (in a case of course) and still hit sub MOA when the shot really counts.

02-20-2010, 03:19 PM	#1
brockdp Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Illinois Posts: 6	medium range (500 yd) sharpshooting/sniping Anyone with experience, what are your opinions on a rifle in .308 as far as AR-15 vs. M1A vs. M1A Scout? Plan on using with a 10x scope and bipod. -->

02-20-2010, 05:59 PM	#2
retired grunt V.I.P. Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Northern NY Posts: 416	Re: medium range (500 yd) sharpshooting/sniping has to be semi?

02-20-2010, 06:33 PM	#3
cycloneman Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Louisiana Posts: 7,401	Re: medium range (500 yd) sharpshooting/sniping An DPMS LR308 with a 24" bbl should give you 2700 + fps with good standard loads. If you use hornady light mag ammo you can expect 2900 + fps. A 10x scope is fine but why not get a variable say 6 to 24x. I also recommend a mill dot scope and learn how to use it. Once you have the rifle and match ammo I then would chrony the rifle and ammo. Then you can make a cheat sheet for bullet drop compensation. Shooting to 500 yrds is not a problem and actually easy if you buy the right stuff and learn how to use it. As far as a rifle goes the DPMS is very nice. What you are looking for is consistancy in your rifle and ammo. After that it's just a math problem. AR or any Military type rifle will come with a heavy trigger pull. There is a guy on the net that can fix that problem for you for a couple of hunderd bucks. He installes set triggers. You can find him at williams trigger specialities. Do a search. You can also look at the savage line of bolt actions. The varmitter comes with a 26" bbl and they even have 30" target mdl. The longer the bbl the slower burning powder you want to use. For hunting purposes the Hornady light mags work extremly well. __________________ Who are you going to serve today?

02-20-2010, 07:35 PM	#4
old semperfi Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: i live in southern indiana,old country boy at heart Posts: 1,506	Re: medium range (500 yd) sharpshooting/sniping if you dont have to carry it the m1a is your only option as far as i am concerned.the scout has a shorter barrel and i wouldnt think it to be as accurate as the longer barrell.i shoot three savage tacticals.223,308,and 300 win mag.the three rifles are fairly heavy and the canjar triggers in each go for around 100.00 each.those you can install yourself,i keep my trigger pulls on them at six ounces(scary huh) old semperfi

02-22-2010, 03:06 PM	#5
brockdp Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Illinois Posts: 6	Re: medium range (500 yd) sharpshooting/sniping Yes, I am definitely intending on a semi-auto. And I am mostly interested in comparisons of from-the-factory accuracy potential for the intended purpose. Thanks.

02-22-2010, 03:44 PM	#6
Old Grump Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Little hut in the woods near Blue River Wisconsin Posts: 2,286	Re: medium range (500 yd) sharpshooting/sniping Springfield M1A Scout AA9629, 308 Winchester, 16 1/4 inch barrel with muzzle break for just a hair over $2000. Personally I would go with a Savage Model 10FCM with a 20" barrel for under $700. It will reach out to your 500 yards accurately, the trigger will be nicer and you can buy more ammo for the difference. But it is a bolt action. __________________ "When once a republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil."~~- Thomas Jefferson Roman Catholic, Life Member of American Legion, VFW, Wisconsin Libertarian party, Wi-FORCE, WGO, NRA, JPFO, GOA, SAFand CCRKBA

02-22-2010, 04:18 PM	#7
cycloneman Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Louisiana Posts: 7,401	Re: medium range (500 yd) sharpshooting/sniping brockdc i sent you a pm. __________________ Who are you going to serve today?

02-24-2010, 02:49 PM	#8
brockdp Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Illinois Posts: 6	Re: medium range (500 yd) sharpshooting/sniping Thanks. I will continue to research this subject. I'm beginning to see though that a $1,500 AR is not going to give you the out of box accuracy you need, that's for sure. And curious that Springfield does not have MOA accuracy listed on their spec sheets for the M1A line. I've been a handgunner for 20 years, but more of a casual rifle shooter. After watching some pretty cool shows this month on the Military Channel during "sniper month", I have developed a new interest in long range rifle shooting for accuracy.

02-24-2010, 06:34 PM	#9
Airdale Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: N.W. Arkansas Contributor Posts: 750	Re: medium range (500 yd) sharpshooting/sniping Ditto what Old Grump said. I started lusting after a Semi but after a little research I found a whole sub culture devoted to bolt action rifles. Cost a lot less (until the sickness sets in). Savage comes all dressed up but many start with a Rem. 700 heavy barrel and build from there. Waiting for my 700 with a new stock and other extras and a 20" barrel. Yes it will get way beyond 500 yds. with the shorter barrel. __________________ "The Utopian schemes of leveling [redistribution of the wealth] and a community of goods [central ownership of the means of production and distribution], are as visionary and impractical as those which vest all property in the crown.[These ideas] are arbitrary, despotic, and, in our government, unconstitutional." Samuel Adams

02-26-2010, 09:26 AM	#10
cbvanb Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Southern Arizona Posts: 6	Re: medium range (500 yd) sharpshooting/sniping You never really defined what your goals are at the intended range. As a former sniper our goal was a hit, which is a reasonable possibility with almost any quality rifle at 500 yards. If you truly want precision I would stick with a bolt action. Semi autos can be brought up to almost the same accuracy as a bolt, but it cost a lot more money to get that done, and they are still much more finicky. A well built bolt rifle can be dragged across the ground for two or three days (in a case of course) and still hit sub MOA when the shot really counts.