Need Help on Presentation Rifle - The Firearms Forum

zwara1 · 03-07-2010, 01:58 PM

I need some help identifing a early percussion firearm I have. I will attach images for a better idea. It has a detachable stock and is very ornate tooling on the stock and appears to be some type of presentation piece, It appears to have silver inlay and has the words CHARTER OAK along the bottom plate of stock and a inlay of who appears to be Grover Cleveland on the stock with a bowie knife that inserts into end of stock marked E.C.C.Kellog. This piece was in a fire several years ago and some of the pieces have been lost, any help would be greatly appreciated.

Jim K · 03-07-2010, 04:35 PM

That looks very much like an Allen & Thurber target pistol with stock (Flayderman 5A-010). It does not conform exactly to Flayderman's picture, but those guns were semi-custom.

As to the Charter Oak marking, the famous Connecticut Charter Oak fell in 1856, the same era as those pistols. The wood was used to make a special chair for the State of Connecticut, but there was plenty sold for other purposes. So the stock on that gun could very well have been made from a piece of the Charter Oak, making it a very valuable collector piece.

Flayderman gives a value of over $7000 for a gun in "fine" condition, with the stock, but if the stock was made from the Charter Oak, I think the value would about double.

I admit that I am in no way qualified to either identify that gun with absolute certainty or even guess at its value. If it were mine, I would take some excellent color pictures (professional grade 8x10's, not your cell phone camera) and send them to places like the Connecticut State Historical Society, the Smithsonian, and maybe the National Firearms Museum (NRA). Make sure you have clear photos of the lockplate and any markings, as well as the top of the barrel. Look carefully, as time, dirt, and soot may have obscured the markings.

Jim

zwara1 · 03-08-2010, 06:23 PM

Many thanks Jim for the very helpful information, I am going to take your advice and get some good pictures made, thanks again and best regards, mark

03-07-2010, 01:58 PM	#1
zwara1 Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 2	Need Help on Presentation Rifle I need some help identifing a early percussion firearm I have. I will attach images for a better idea. It has a detachable stock and is very ornate tooling on the stock and appears to be some type of presentation piece, It appears to have silver inlay and has the words CHARTER OAK along the bottom plate of stock and a inlay of who appears to be Grover Cleveland on the stock with a bowie knife that inserts into end of stock marked E.C.C.Kellog. This piece was in a fire several years ago and some of the pieces have been lost, any help would be greatly appreciated. -->

03-07-2010, 04:35 PM	#2
Jim K Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 6,408	Re: Need Help on Presentation Rifle That looks very much like an Allen & Thurber target pistol with stock (Flayderman 5A-010). It does not conform exactly to Flayderman's picture, but those guns were semi-custom. As to the Charter Oak marking, the famous Connecticut Charter Oak fell in 1856, the same era as those pistols. The wood was used to make a special chair for the State of Connecticut, but there was plenty sold for other purposes. So the stock on that gun could very well have been made from a piece of the Charter Oak, making it a very valuable collector piece. Flayderman gives a value of over $7000 for a gun in "fine" condition, with the stock, but if the stock was made from the Charter Oak, I think the value would about double. I admit that I am in no way qualified to either identify that gun with absolute certainty or even guess at its value. If it were mine, I would take some excellent color pictures (professional grade 8x10's, not your cell phone camera) and send them to places like the Connecticut State Historical Society, the Smithsonian, and maybe the National Firearms Museum (NRA). Make sure you have clear photos of the lockplate and any markings, as well as the top of the barrel. Look carefully, as time, dirt, and soot may have obscured the markings. Jim

03-08-2010, 06:23 PM	#3
zwara1 Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 2	Re: Need Help on Presentation Rifle Many thanks Jim for the very helpful information, I am going to take your advice and get some good pictures made, thanks again and best regards, mark