Question on a VERY odd bullet - The Firearms Forum

ampaterry · 08-17-2010, 06:55 AM

About 35 years ago, I worked with a guy that found this bullet at a VERY old range. Now civilian, the range had at one time been military. When he first found it, he thought he had found one of those bullets that was used for the patient to bite down on during surgery, when anesthetics were unavailable. But when he cleaned it up, he realized this was not the case. I took a picture of it and sent it to the NRA along with a description of where it had been found. They said none of their experts had any idea what it could be.
Well the picture is long gone, and I have lost contact with the bullet owner many years ago, but here is what he found.

The bullet was solid lead, about .30 cal and round nosed. The rear of it was still inside the brass case mouth, which had all corroded away except for just the mouth that enclosed the rear of the bullet. The exposed portion of the bullet was about 1" long.

Now for the screwy part.

The bullet had two deep indentations in the lead, each a curved section like it had been squeezed REAL hard between thumb and forefinger. The indentations were each about .080 deep, on opposit sides of the bullet, and IDENTICAL in all respects.
BUT - there were absolutely no signs of lead deformation around these dents. IOW, they were MOLDED into the bullet, or possibly MACHINED into it after molding, not made by any squeezing or smashing after it was finished.

The only thing that came to mind with me was possibly these indentations were originally filled with a pyrotechnic compound in some sort of experimental tracer round, but I would think rubbing on the rifling would dislodge it from the lead - -

Anyway, can anyone hazard a guess from my poor description?

jack404 · 08-17-2010, 07:02 AM

the only thing even close was a book about the history of bullet design for the "new age" M16 etc , they had dual or twin projectile loads, the had offset rounds, they had a twisty flechette type round , and they had one that may be similar to what you are describing ,

impact twists the tails round and you get a bigger wound pattern was the idea

otherwise i dont have a clue ..

EDIT ,

there's a Czech made grenade launching system that uses a collapsible projectile instead of a ballisite round no pic of the round though

the bullet is fired as normal guided by the site integrated into the launcher attachment

the bullet travels up the barrel and get caught in the bullet trap driving the grenade forward the bullet is weak in the mid section and this collapses firing the propellant charge approx 3-4M from the soldier firing it propelling the grenade a max of 65 meters

could this be your critter ?

ampaterry · 08-17-2010, 08:43 AM

Jack, it sure could be -
The center of this bullet WOULD be weaker due to the two big chunks missing, causing the middle to be much thinner -

jack404 · 08-17-2010, 09:04 AM

and you can ID it in the dark by feel, its was a feel good solution , ( found a few bit's here, no pic's yet)

jack404 · 08-17-2010, 09:07 AM

the system was Licenced in a couple of arms places in South america and south Africa and they got everywhere apparently i think i have seen em in Cambodia but it was just more junk to be carted away

08-17-2010, 06:55 AM	#1
ampaterry TFF Admin Staff Chaplain Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: West Tennessee Contributor Posts: 6,291	Question on a VERY odd bullet About 35 years ago, I worked with a guy that found this bullet at a VERY old range. Now civilian, the range had at one time been military. When he first found it, he thought he had found one of those bullets that was used for the patient to bite down on during surgery, when anesthetics were unavailable. But when he cleaned it up, he realized this was not the case. I took a picture of it and sent it to the NRA along with a description of where it had been found. They said none of their experts had any idea what it could be. Well the picture is long gone, and I have lost contact with the bullet owner many years ago, but here is what he found. The bullet was solid lead, about .30 cal and round nosed. The rear of it was still inside the brass case mouth, which had all corroded away except for just the mouth that enclosed the rear of the bullet. The exposed portion of the bullet was about 1" long. Now for the screwy part. The bullet had two deep indentations in the lead, each a curved section like it had been squeezed REAL hard between thumb and forefinger. The indentations were each about .080 deep, on opposit sides of the bullet, and IDENTICAL in all respects. BUT - there were absolutely no signs of lead deformation around these dents. IOW, they were MOLDED into the bullet, or possibly MACHINED into it after molding, not made by any squeezing or smashing after it was finished. The only thing that came to mind with me was possibly these indentations were originally filled with a pyrotechnic compound in some sort of experimental tracer round, but I would think rubbing on the rifling would dislodge it from the lead - - Anyway, can anyone hazard a guess from my poor description? __________________ A woman who demands further gun control legislation is like a chicken who roots for Colonel Sanders. Larry Elder -->

08-17-2010, 07:02 AM	#2
jack404 Former Guest Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Australia Contributor Posts: 17,622	Re: Question on a VERY odd bullet the only thing even close was a book about the history of bullet design for the "new age" M16 etc , they had dual or twin projectile loads, the had offset rounds, they had a twisty flechette type round , and they had one that may be similar to what you are describing , impact twists the tails round and you get a bigger wound pattern was the idea otherwise i dont have a clue .. EDIT , there's a Czech made grenade launching system that uses a collapsible projectile instead of a ballisite round no pic of the round though the bullet is fired as normal guided by the site integrated into the launcher attachment the bullet travels up the barrel and get caught in the bullet trap driving the grenade forward the bullet is weak in the mid section and this collapses firing the propellant charge approx 3-4M from the soldier firing it propelling the grenade a max of 65 meters could this be your critter ? Last edited by jack404; 08-17-2010 at 07:15 AM..

08-17-2010, 08:43 AM	#3
ampaterry TFF Admin Staff Chaplain Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: West Tennessee Contributor Posts: 6,291	Re: Question on a VERY odd bullet Jack, it sure could be - The center of this bullet WOULD be weaker due to the two big chunks missing, causing the middle to be much thinner - __________________ A woman who demands further gun control legislation is like a chicken who roots for Colonel Sanders. Larry Elder

08-17-2010, 09:04 AM	#4
jack404 Former Guest Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Australia Contributor Posts: 17,622	Re: Question on a VERY odd bullet and you can ID it in the dark by feel, its was a feel good solution , ( found a few bit's here, no pic's yet) Last edited by jack404; 08-17-2010 at 09:05 AM..

08-17-2010, 09:07 AM	#5
jack404 Former Guest Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Australia Contributor Posts: 17,622	Re: Question on a VERY odd bullet the system was Licenced in a couple of arms places in South america and south Africa and they got everywhere apparently i think i have seen em in Cambodia but it was just more junk to be carted away