Red dot scope - The Firearms Forum

pointman41 · 10-11-2010, 08:15 AM

I just purchased a used Ruger Redhawk 44 mag. with a 2X leupold scope attached. I am having trouble acquiring the target through the scope. I am thinking of replacing the scope with a Red Dot. Can anyone suggest what Red Dot might be the right one for this weapon.
Thank you for any assistance

RunningOnMT · 10-11-2010, 01:43 PM

I can't recommend anything as I've never used one, though I'd like to. I've heard some say that the only red dots worth their salt will cost you an arm and a leg. They speak of aimpoint and eotech as the only ones worthy of consideration. I did take a look at a Bushnel for around $150.00 that seemed really nice. Whether it will hold up to repeated concussion is another question.

I will say this about red dots. I have found that for me red dots just seem to make my unsteadiness more noticable. If there is difficulty acquiring a sight picture with a regular scope it is likely because your stance is not steady enough to stay on target, causing the target to bounce in and out of the field of view. The same will be true with a red dot. You'll just see that dot jumping all over the place. Red dots just make target acquisition quicker, not easier.

Shooter45 · 10-11-2010, 03:05 PM

Pointman, the pic in this link is of a S&W 686 I had custom built a few years ago. The red dot is a Tasco PDP5. I had no complaints as the pistol was a real tackdriver. We shot bowling pins at 100 yds with it.

http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/show...ght=custom+686

RunningOnMT · 10-11-2010, 03:40 PM

Shooter, I'm assuming that was from a bench. If so what's the longest range you can shoot effectively with it in an unsupported standing position?

Shooter45 · 10-11-2010, 04:49 PM

Tuckered1 and I were shooting at his friends range. The bowling pins were shot off hand. with the S&W 686 and with my .40 race gun with the C-More Sight.

RunningOnMT · 10-11-2010, 06:40 PM

Wow. That's some shooting.

LDBennett · 10-12-2010, 08:51 AM

pointman41:

There is nothing harder to sight with than a scope on a handgun held at arms length. The higher the magnification the harder it is to use. 2x in my experience is only usable with the gun supported.

Red Dots are typically 1x for power. Indeed they will show you how much you really jiggle around when sighting. It happens with open sights too but you just can not see it. Red Dots are the answer for those of us with aging sight that makes shooting with open sights hard.

The best reasonably priced Red Dot you can buy is the entry level tube type (one inch tube version) single dot size UltraDot from Larry's Guns (the distributor). It is rugged, accurate enough for Bullseye competition, has manual intensity control for the dot, and reasonable priced.

http://www.larrysguns.com/Products/U...ack__UD1B.aspx

To use it you adjust the intensity so that the dot is visible and blooms in size to cover a know part of the paper target. It is usable inside or outside and the dot is small enough for precision shooting. And you shoot with both eyes open and the red dot just seems to hang in the field of view of both eyes.

Avoid the more complex Red Dots that include multiple reticules (different dot sizes and reticule patterns). It is just more stuff to go wrong and some cheapy multiple dot size units can require re-zeroing when you change dot size or patterns (it is done with masks over the Light Emitting Diode and the mechanical alignment is critical and effects the zero if not perfect). A one inch tube is adequate (30 mm tube or bigger is another option but not really necessary or desired unless you are shooting tactical competition). The open frame type Red Dot have a shorter effective sighting plane and are not as precision with sighting as the longer tube types. They also are more complex and more failure prone.

Avoid the bargain Red Dots as they are really failure prone. It is hard to get a good Red Dot without paying at the $135 level of the Ultra Dot. The more expensive units may offer something to some shooters but for us regular shooters, not much except a much lighter wallet.

This, of course, is my opinion, and others opinions may vary, but it is based on buying and using many different Red Dots over the last 20+ years.

LDBennett

carver · 10-12-2010, 09:04 AM

I have a red dot on my .44mag lever gun, and it's comming off right away. Mine has the adjustible size dot, and can't be seen in the day time untill you get to at least the #4 size dot, and it goes to a #11 sized dot. At 100yds the #4 size dot will completly cover the side of a deer, you might get a hit, but where?

RunningOnMT · 10-12-2010, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LDBennett

pointman41:

Red Dots are typically 1x for power. Indeed they will show you how much you really jiggle around when sighting.

LDBennett

I want one with an anti-jiggle device.

Man I don't even belong on this forum. I'm so outclassed it's embarrassing. Bowling pins @100 yds with a handgun, indeed.

LDBennett · 10-12-2010, 09:24 AM

carver:

Red Dots were originally developed for use on hand guns. They can work fine on rifles. There are different dot sizes. 4 MOA is about the finest and there are ones out to 10 MOA made for pistol tactical shooting games. Since each MOA is about an inch at 100 yds, a 4 MOA red dot should be usable for deer hunting at 100 yds, I would think. Most 44 mag lever guns (at least the ones I have owned and shot) will not shoot much better that 4 inches at 100 yds. So why would that be a problem? Or did you get the wrong dot size Red Dot?

Anyway the original poster is using a hand gun and the 4 MOA Ultra Dot would be just the thing for him, I would think.

LDBennett

carver · 10-12-2010, 09:30 AM

This was my first purchase of a red dot sight for anything other than my SD shotgun. While the accuracy of the lever gun at 100yds isn't all that great you simply cannot shoot a 4" group in day light with this combo, as the dot at the #4 setting is just too large, it covers the whole target.

Zane71464 · 10-12-2010, 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunningOnMT

I want one with an anti-jiggle device.

Man I don't even belong on this forum. I'm so outclassed it's embarrassing. Bowling pins @100 yds with a handgun, indeed.

Dont feel bad Running, me and a handgun without a bench rest, or some sort of support @ 100yds, it's like taking a 1000yd shot with a 7.62x51 standing up!

10-11-2010, 01:43 PM	#2
RunningOnMT Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Akron, Ohio Contributor Posts: 4,720	Re: Red dot scope I can't recommend anything as I've never used one, though I'd like to. I've heard some say that the only red dots worth their salt will cost you an arm and a leg. They speak of aimpoint and eotech as the only ones worthy of consideration. I did take a look at a Bushnel for around $150.00 that seemed really nice. Whether it will hold up to repeated concussion is another question. I will say this about red dots. I have found that for me red dots just seem to make my unsteadiness more noticable. If there is difficulty acquiring a sight picture with a regular scope it is likely because your stance is not steady enough to stay on target, causing the target to bounce in and out of the field of view. The same will be true with a red dot. You'll just see that dot jumping all over the place. Red dots just make target acquisition quicker, not easier.

10-11-2010, 03:05 PM	#3
Shooter45 Administrator Join Date: Feb 2001 Contributor Posts: 8,755	Re: Red dot scope Pointman, the pic in this link is of a S&W 686 I had custom built a few years ago. The red dot is a Tasco PDP5. I had no complaints as the pistol was a real tackdriver. We shot bowling pins at 100 yds with it. http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/show...ght=custom+686

10-11-2010, 04:49 PM	#5
Shooter45 Administrator Join Date: Feb 2001 Contributor Posts: 8,755	Re: Red dot scope Tuckered1 and I were shooting at his friends range. The bowling pins were shot off hand. with the S&W 686 and with my .40 race gun with the C-More Sight.

10-11-2010, 06:40 PM	#6
RunningOnMT Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Akron, Ohio Contributor Posts: 4,720	Re: Red dot scope Wow. That's some shooting.

10-12-2010, 08:51 AM	#7
LDBennett Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Hesperia, CA Posts: 5,719	Re: Red dot scope pointman41: There is nothing harder to sight with than a scope on a handgun held at arms length. The higher the magnification the harder it is to use. 2x in my experience is only usable with the gun supported. Red Dots are typically 1x for power. Indeed they will show you how much you really jiggle around when sighting. It happens with open sights too but you just can not see it. Red Dots are the answer for those of us with aging sight that makes shooting with open sights hard. The best reasonably priced Red Dot you can buy is the entry level tube type (one inch tube version) single dot size UltraDot from Larry's Guns (the distributor). It is rugged, accurate enough for Bullseye competition, has manual intensity control for the dot, and reasonable priced. http://www.larrysguns.com/Products/U...ack__UD1B.aspx To use it you adjust the intensity so that the dot is visible and blooms in size to cover a know part of the paper target. It is usable inside or outside and the dot is small enough for precision shooting. And you shoot with both eyes open and the red dot just seems to hang in the field of view of both eyes. Avoid the more complex Red Dots that include multiple reticules (different dot sizes and reticule patterns). It is just more stuff to go wrong and some cheapy multiple dot size units can require re-zeroing when you change dot size or patterns (it is done with masks over the Light Emitting Diode and the mechanical alignment is critical and effects the zero if not perfect). A one inch tube is adequate (30 mm tube or bigger is another option but not really necessary or desired unless you are shooting tactical competition). The open frame type Red Dot have a shorter effective sighting plane and are not as precision with sighting as the longer tube types. They also are more complex and more failure prone. Avoid the bargain Red Dots as they are really failure prone. It is hard to get a good Red Dot without paying at the $135 level of the Ultra Dot. The more expensive units may offer something to some shooters but for us regular shooters, not much except a much lighter wallet. This, of course, is my opinion, and others opinions may vary, but it is based on buying and using many different Red Dots over the last 20+ years. LDBennett Last edited by LDBennett; 10-12-2010 at 08:52 AM..

10-11-2010, 08:15 AM	#1
pointman41 Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 7	Red dot scope I just purchased a used Ruger Redhawk 44 mag. with a 2X leupold scope attached. I am having trouble acquiring the target through the scope. I am thinking of replacing the scope with a Red Dot. Can anyone suggest what Red Dot might be the right one for this weapon. Thank you for any assistance -->

10-11-2010, 03:40 PM	#4
RunningOnMT Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Akron, Ohio Contributor Posts: 4,720	Re: Red dot scope Shooter, I'm assuming that was from a bench. If so what's the longest range you can shoot effectively with it in an unsupported standing position?

10-12-2010, 09:04 AM	#8
carver TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: DAV, Deep in the Pineywoods of East Texas, just west of Shreveport, LA Contributor Posts: 11,301	Re: Red dot scope I have a red dot on my .44mag lever gun, and it's comming off right away. Mine has the adjustible size dot, and can't be seen in the day time untill you get to at least the #4 size dot, and it goes to a #11 sized dot. At 100yds the #4 size dot will completly cover the side of a deer, you might get a hit, but where? __________________ Y'all be safe now, ya hear! Lamentations Chapter 5: 1. Remember, O LORD, what is come upon us: consider, and behold our reproach. 2. Our inheritance is turned to strangers, our houses to aliens. 3. We are orphans and fatherless, our mothers [are] as widows. 5. Our necks [are] under persecution: we labour, [and] have no rest. 16. The crown is fallen [from] our head: woe unto us, that we have sinned! 21. Turn thou us unto thee, O LORD, and we shall be turned; renew our days as of old.

10-12-2010, 09:24 AM	#10
LDBennett Advanced Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Hesperia, CA Posts: 5,719	Re: Red dot scope carver: Red Dots were originally developed for use on hand guns. They can work fine on rifles. There are different dot sizes. 4 MOA is about the finest and there are ones out to 10 MOA made for pistol tactical shooting games. Since each MOA is about an inch at 100 yds, a 4 MOA red dot should be usable for deer hunting at 100 yds, I would think. Most 44 mag lever guns (at least the ones I have owned and shot) will not shoot much better that 4 inches at 100 yds. So why would that be a problem? Or did you get the wrong dot size Red Dot? Anyway the original poster is using a hand gun and the 4 MOA Ultra Dot would be just the thing for him, I would think. LDBennett

10-12-2010, 09:30 AM	#11
carver TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: DAV, Deep in the Pineywoods of East Texas, just west of Shreveport, LA Contributor Posts: 11,301	Re: Red dot scope This was my first purchase of a red dot sight for anything other than my SD shotgun. While the accuracy of the lever gun at 100yds isn't all that great you simply cannot shoot a 4" group in day light with this combo, as the dot at the #4 setting is just too large, it covers the whole target. __________________ Y'all be safe now, ya hear! Lamentations Chapter 5: 1. Remember, O LORD, what is come upon us: consider, and behold our reproach. 2. Our inheritance is turned to strangers, our houses to aliens. 3. We are orphans and fatherless, our mothers [are] as widows. 5. Our necks [are] under persecution: we labour, [and] have no rest. 16. The crown is fallen [from] our head: woe unto us, that we have sinned! 21. Turn thou us unto thee, O LORD, and we shall be turned; renew our days as of old.