Crazy little sniper shotgun Idea? - The Firearms Forum

gendoikari87 · 12-29-2010, 08:21 PM

so we all know we can get slugs for shotguns, and that's nice and all, they come in a small sabot to increase accuracy and all... but what about those of us wanting a rifle... something so increadibly high velocity that the standard .308, won't do it. I'm talking about making a true sabot shell for a shotgun. Nothing you'd want to hunt with or stake your life on but a shotgun shell converted to fire a 3-5mm sabot rod much like the abrams does. (only ten times smaller)

Granted it's just an idea and would require extremely high tech equipment to make but what do you guys think? Abrams Sabot in your home. Cool idea if utterly useless for hunting/home defense, or even plinking, unless you want to plink at two miles away (like my crazy ass would do if I could find a two mile long strip of land.

Boris · 12-29-2010, 08:38 PM

I'll have what you're drinkin........

all funnin' aside, sounds cool, for nailing a tree rat to the side of a tree. I gather there would not be enough weight to carry it very far at all.

Maybe in a 410. Anything larger would be too much bore to sabot ratio, if that makes any sense........

gendoikari87 · 12-30-2010, 08:33 AM

well it would have very little weight but also a very little cross sectional area so I wouldn't quite that bad, but it would be worst than most. Could still probably hit a rat at a 1/2 mile though.

Edit: oh and what i'm drinking is called absinth

carver · 12-30-2010, 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gendoikari87

so we all know we can get slugs for shotguns, and that's nice and all, they come in a small sabot to increase accuracy and all... but what about those of us wanting a rifle... something so increadibly high velocity that the standard .308, won't do it. I'm talking about making a true sabot shell for a shotgun. Nothing you'd want to hunt with or stake your life on but a shotgun shell converted to fire a 3-5mm sabot rod much like the abrams does. (only ten times smaller)

Granted it's just an idea and would require extremely high tech equipment to make but what do you guys think? Abrams Sabot in your home. Cool idea if utterly useless for hunting/home defense, or even plinking, unless you want to plink at two miles away (like my crazy ass would do if I could find a two mile long strip of land.

In order to get the speed on the bullet/sabot you're talking about, you would have to build a "cannon" that would withstand the presures generated to launch the sabot. But that's already been done!

22shot · 12-30-2010, 10:26 AM

Don't know if you guys are old enough to remember; but a "sabot" bullet was made for the .30/06 and the .30-30. These smaller caliber bullets were encased in plastic.
Kind of like the equivelent of a .22-250...
They were marketed for "varmit hunters".

They were pulled by the BATF; no tell tale rifleing left on the bullet; couldn't be traced.

So far; the saboted "Black Powder" bullets are safe...

Boris · 12-30-2010, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 22shot

Don't know if you guys are old enough to remember; but a "sabot" bullet was made for the .30/06 and the .30-30. These smaller caliber bullets were encased in plastic.
Kind of like the equivelent of a .22-250...
They were marketed for "varmit hunters".

They were pulled by the BATF; no tell tale rifleing left on the bullet; couldn't be traced.

So far; the saboted "Black Powder" bullets are safe...

Remington stopped making them because people expected them to be accurate to an extreme.

You can roll your own and I know a few guys that do it for CZ52s. Its an easy way to get 22 Reeds express performance from your regular barrel.

http://www.sabotreloadingpro.com/

You can get upto 4700fps with some loads, but I bet they are not too accurate, but are like little bombs inside critters up close.......

gendoikari87 · 12-30-2010, 02:42 PM

Dang a .308 lapua in sabot, that's nasty.

armedandsafe · 12-30-2010, 10:25 PM

Roy Weatherby played with a .223 built on his .300 Magnum case. He was pushing 125 gr solid bronze, copper coated bullets at about 4500 fps. He told me that he was getting about 800 to 1000 rounds out of a barrel, so he didn't think it would sell very well.

Pops

ofitg · 12-31-2010, 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 22shot

Don't know if you guys are old enough to remember; but a "sabot" bullet was made for the .30/06 and the .30-30. These smaller caliber bullets were encased in plastic.
Kind of like the equivelent of a .22-250...
They were marketed for "varmit hunters".

They were pulled by the BATF; no tell tale rifleing left on the bullet; couldn't be traced.

So far; the saboted "Black Powder" bullets are safe...

I believe you are referring to the Remington Accelerators..... the US military developed similar ammo for 7.62 NATO and .50 BMG rounds, called Saboted Light Armor Penetrator (SLAP), which utilized tungsten projectiles.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/slap.htm

A few months ago the US Govt ordered another $43 million worth of the .50 SLAPs. I doubt that they have tack-driving accuracy, but with a "Ma Deuce", it doesn't really matter.

GunHugger · 12-31-2010, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ofitg

I believe you are referring to the Remington Accelerators..... the US military developed similar ammo for 7.62 NATO and .50 BMG rounds, called Saboted Light Armor Penetrator (SLAP), which utilized tungsten projectiles.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/slap.htm

A few months ago the US Govt ordered another $43 million worth of the .50 SLAPs. I doubt that they have tack-driving accuracy, but with a "Ma Deuce", it doesn't really matter.

I still have a few boxes of 30.06 Remington Accelerators. I shot 5 of them and found them worthless for long range hog hunting. They weren't accurate enough for hogs at 400 yards.

There was a guy asking for them at a local gunshow. I overheard him asking so I told him I know where there's a box and asked him what he was willing to pay. He offered $75. I told him no, but thanks for the offer, he countered with $100. I said I would think about it so he gave me his cell phone number but I never called him.

I know they were stopped from making them, but is it illegal to own them...or sell them? They stopped production of Black Talon ammo but I still see them for sale at gun shows. Just wondering.

carver · 12-31-2010, 08:51 AM

The Black Talon ammo was pulled by the company that made them, not by the BATF.

GunHugger · 12-31-2010, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carver

The Black Talon ammo was pulled by the company that made them, not by the BATF.

Yes and still made, but they look different and have a non scary name.

That whole deal was a mess. I shot and tested the Black Talon's and wasn't impressed with their abilities. But they did look cool.

I was just wondering the law with owning Accelerators. I had a thought when that guy wanted them so bad, willing to pay $100 for a box of 20.

carver · 12-31-2010, 10:35 AM

Really, you can make your own, paper patch. The concept has been around just about as long as firearms.

RustyBarrel111 · 12-31-2010, 10:55 AM

This whole thing spells disaster.

gendoikari87 · 12-31-2010, 12:54 PM

well any sabot design is still going to be highly inaccurate if it's not fin stabalized or by some advanced method rifled I don't think the plastic sabots stand up well to the rifling in that they don't really catch well. Most of the commercial sabots are just sub calibers encased in a plastic sleeve. a far cry from the abrams APFSDS

12-29-2010, 08:21 PM	#1
gendoikari87 Former Guest Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 361	Crazy little sniper shotgun Idea? so we all know we can get slugs for shotguns, and that's nice and all, they come in a small sabot to increase accuracy and all... but what about those of us wanting a rifle... something so increadibly high velocity that the standard .308, won't do it. I'm talking about making a true sabot shell for a shotgun. Nothing you'd want to hunt with or stake your life on but a shotgun shell converted to fire a 3-5mm sabot rod much like the abrams does. (only ten times smaller) Granted it's just an idea and would require extremely high tech equipment to make but what do you guys think? Abrams Sabot in your home. Cool idea if utterly useless for hunting/home defense, or even plinking, unless you want to plink at two miles away (like my crazy ass would do if I could find a two mile long strip of land. --> Last edited by gendoikari87; 12-29-2010 at 08:23 PM..

12-29-2010, 08:38 PM	#2
Boris Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 607	Re: Crazy little sniper shotgun Idea? I'll have what you're drinkin........ all funnin' aside, sounds cool, for nailing a tree rat to the side of a tree. I gather there would not be enough weight to carry it very far at all. Maybe in a 410. Anything larger would be too much bore to sabot ratio, if that makes any sense........

12-30-2010, 08:33 AM	#3
gendoikari87 Former Guest Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 361	Re: Crazy little sniper shotgun Idea? well it would have very little weight but also a very little cross sectional area so I wouldn't quite that bad, but it would be worst than most. Could still probably hit a rat at a 1/2 mile though. Edit: oh and what i'm drinking is called absinth Last edited by gendoikari87; 12-30-2010 at 08:35 AM..

12-30-2010, 10:26 AM	#5
22shot V.I.P. Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: U.S.of A. Posts: 376	Re: Crazy little sniper shotgun Idea? Don't know if you guys are old enough to remember; but a "sabot" bullet was made for the .30/06 and the .30-30. These smaller caliber bullets were encased in plastic. Kind of like the equivelent of a .22-250... They were marketed for "varmit hunters". They were pulled by the BATF; no tell tale rifleing left on the bullet; couldn't be traced. So far; the saboted "Black Powder" bullets are safe... Last edited by 22shot; 12-30-2010 at 10:33 AM..

12-30-2010, 02:42 PM	#7
gendoikari87 Former Guest Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 361	Re: Crazy little sniper shotgun Idea? Dang a .308 lapua in sabot, that's nasty.

12-30-2010, 10:25 PM	#8
armedandsafe Former Guest Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Moses Lake, WA Posts: 10,344	Re: Crazy little sniper shotgun Idea? Roy Weatherby played with a .223 built on his .300 Magnum case. He was pushing 125 gr solid bronze, copper coated bullets at about 4500 fps. He told me that he was getting about 800 to 1000 rounds out of a barrel, so he didn't think it would sell very well. Pops

12-31-2010, 08:51 AM	#11
carver TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: DAV, Deep in the Pineywoods of East Texas, just west of Shreveport, LA Contributor Posts: 11,283	Re: Crazy little sniper shotgun Idea? The Black Talon ammo was pulled by the company that made them, not by the BATF. __________________ Y'all be safe now, ya hear! Lamentations Chapter 5: 1. Remember, O LORD, what is come upon us: consider, and behold our reproach. 2. Our inheritance is turned to strangers, our houses to aliens. 3. We are orphans and fatherless, our mothers [are] as widows. 5. Our necks [are] under persecution: we labour, [and] have no rest. 16. The crown is fallen [from] our head: woe unto us, that we have sinned! 21. Turn thou us unto thee, O LORD, and we shall be turned; renew our days as of old.

12-31-2010, 10:35 AM	#13
carver TFF Moderator/Host Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: DAV, Deep in the Pineywoods of East Texas, just west of Shreveport, LA Contributor Posts: 11,283	Re: Crazy little sniper shotgun Idea? Really, you can make your own, paper patch. The concept has been around just about as long as firearms. __________________ Y'all be safe now, ya hear! Lamentations Chapter 5: 1. Remember, O LORD, what is come upon us: consider, and behold our reproach. 2. Our inheritance is turned to strangers, our houses to aliens. 3. We are orphans and fatherless, our mothers [are] as widows. 5. Our necks [are] under persecution: we labour, [and] have no rest. 16. The crown is fallen [from] our head: woe unto us, that we have sinned! 21. Turn thou us unto thee, O LORD, and we shall be turned; renew our days as of old.

12-31-2010, 10:55 AM	#14
RustyBarrel111 Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 22	Re: Crazy little sniper shotgun Idea? This whole thing spells disaster.

12-31-2010, 12:54 PM	#15
gendoikari87 Former Guest Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 361	Re: Crazy little sniper shotgun Idea? well any sabot design is still going to be highly inaccurate if it's not fin stabalized or by some advanced method rifled I don't think the plastic sabots stand up well to the rifling in that they don't really catch well. Most of the commercial sabots are just sub calibers encased in a plastic sleeve. a far cry from the abrams APFSDS