Failed 30-06 cases

[LDBennett]

My 30-06 M1 Garand ammo batch had two case separation today at the range. They have only been reloaded maybe 6 or 7 times and are head stamped LC 43. Maybe they have passed their "use by" date?

It is amazing that nearly 70 year old cases did not degrade long before now. The whole lot is finally going in the trash. I think I got good use out of it as it was given to me as stained loaded ammo which I broke down some 20 years ago and only used the cases.

LDBennett

[Brisk44]

Thats pretty good use.

[Bindernut]

I think you got pretty good life out of them too...especially in an autoloader.

Was it original factory load when you got them or was it "mystery ammo"? It might've had several loadings before you got the brass...

[Alpo]

With it being LC43, it was corrosive primed, originally. Possibly the brass was not washed after the initial firing, and the priming salts deteriorated the brass.

[JLA]

still tho, 6 or 7 cycles for autoloader brass is good.

Now grab you some new brass and see how long it lasts.

[The Duke]

Brass will get brittle with age...I bought a tin of Russkie 7.62x54R that was maybe 30 years old...Many of the necks were cracked...Berdan, so it was fire and forget.

[JLA]

As a handloader, anytime I can fire and forget is awesome! I hate lookin for brass from an autoloader. especially the mini14, that stupid thing slings em 40 feet.

[JohnTheCalifornian]

Thats the one downside to being a reloader. Sometimes I think I spend more time looking for brass I shot than I do shooting. And, every time I get to the range, I'll spend at least 1/2 hour looking for brass others didnt pick up or missed. You know you have it bad when you rummage through the garbage cans to see if anyone threw their brass in the trash!

[Alpo]

Doesn't everybody do that?

[JLA]

ha ha, hell yeah. I have found alot of great brass that way.. Heck last time I went to CENTEX with charles and chris we found a box full of .338 lapua mag. and a partial of 7mmSTW. who the hell tosses that stuff???

[The Duke]

Yeah....Hunting for brass can be a real trip...I had an HK 91 that would chunk them into the next county...Today I shoot a lot of semi-auto pistol and rifle...Just at the time my back and knees are telling me to STOP all that bending over... 20 years ago, I was shooting only revolvers and bolt guns...It didnt hurt then..

So yesterday the little white truck dropped off a package or two...Called a 'Brass Wand"....Cant give you a first hand range report, but watched a couple guys police their brass with one the other day...Slicker than snail snot...I had to have one...so now to go make a lot of reloads into empties and try it out...

I believe it was designed for pecans and other ground nuts, but anticipate it will work well for my brass collecting..and give my back some relief.

[JLA]

nice. post a report please!

[The Duke]

I cant make it to the range until Mon or Tuesday....but this weekend Ill dump some empties on the ground in the back yard and give it a spin...The guys using theirs at the range were very enthusiastic about it...In fact, one reached into his bucket and scattered a handful of 9mm...Couple rolls of the thing and he had them all in the cage...They send you a little wire gizzmo that you put on your bucker that pops the cage open and the empties all fall into the bucket....You can even pick up individual cases one at a time, or roll it along and get everything...

I got mine from Dillon, but there may be cheaper places to buy...Local Farm Co-op may even have them. Midway maybe??

[medalguy]

I went out to my favorite shooting spot on BLM land the other day, and someone had been there apparently just prior to my arrival. They very kindly left over 200 rounds of factory Remington .223 and about a hundred rounds of factory Remington 7.62 x 39, not to mention all the .45 and .40 brass I could pick up and put in a 2 gallon bucket I always carry out there. Thankee very kindly whoever you are. Come back real soon.

[joncutt87]

You can make one of those out of a slinky, a piece of 2x4, and a broom handle.

[LDBennett]

Yes this bunch of 30-06 brass was originally corrosively primed but those primer went in the trash even before they were used.

Some 20 years ago I got loaded ammo from the friend, picked up at a gun show as unfired MIL surplus ammo in a cloth bandolier, some heavily water stained. I pulled it all apart including removing the primers. The first shooting of the brass was with modern Winchester primers, Hodgdon powders, and Winchester bulk bullets. These cases never were fired with corrosive primers. They are (were, as they are now trashed) almost 70 years old with many reloads in a semi-auto gun. They need not make any excuses! They did their job admirably!

LDBennett

[gdmoody]

LD, I will say that you got some good service out of that brass. I don't shoot my Garand as much as I should and I will try to remedy that soon. I have some 8mm (VZ-24, Hakim, and M48) rifles that I need to take out and exercise, too.

Speaking of picking up brass, I have an L1A1 that throws the stuff 30 or 40 feet away if you don't regulate the gas right. I also go through the trash cans at my range every time I go and have gotten very lucky at times. Not too long ago I picked up about 300 .223 brass out of one of the cans. Most likely it was once fires because of the empty .223 boxes in the can with the brass.

[Alpo]

Originally Posted by LDBennett

Yes this bunch of 30-06 brass was originally corrosively primed but those primer went in the trash even before they were used.

Some 20 years ago I got loaded ammo from the friend, picked up at a gun show as unfired MIL surplus ammo in a cloth bandolier, some heavily water stained. I pulled it all apart including removing the primers. The first shooting of the brass was with modern Winchester primers, Hodgdon powders, and Winchester bulk bullets. These cases never were fired with corrosive primers. They are (were, as they are now trashed) almost 70 years old with many reloads in a semi-auto gun. They need not make any excuses! They did their job admirably!

LDBennett

How did you do that?

I've got some Korean ought six that's corrosive. My plan was to deprime and reprime with new primers, but I'm having trouble with the depriming.

I'm a little leery of doing it at normal speed, and doing it slowly does not seem to want to push the primers though the crimp. Instead it stretches the primer.

[LDBennett]

Alpo:

Of course pulling the bullet (and discarding them) is easy. De-priming is harder.

On MIL Surplus brass the primer pockets are crimped so getting the primers out can be difficult. I just lean hard on the handle using the sizing die. Getting a run on the primer is absolutely the wrong thing to do as the live primer is certain to go off. A long steady but heavy pull is the way for me.

I do NOT recommend this to others but it is what I do. If you choose to follow my process do clear the bench and the surrounding area of any powder or new primers. I suggest very heavy safety glasses or even goggles. Also wear hearing protection. I have removed many hundreds of live primers over the years and have yet to have one go off but better safe than sorry.

You are then left with empty crimped primer pockets. There are many tools that will re-form them to accept new primers in a normal fashion. I have used a primer forming tool by Dillon with mixed results (more on that if you wish via PM). I have used a garage countersink tool but you have to go pretty deep to get all of the crimp removed. I had to use a plug gage to be sure the crimp was all gone. There are specific tools by RCBS and others that can do an adequate job as well. If all the crimp is not removed it may screw up new primers as they enter the pockets and get caught on the remainder of the crimp.

LDBennett

[Alpo]

I use the RCBS tool. Been using it with great results (except when it attacks)
http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/show...&highlight=bit

and I've deprimed mucho live primers. It's just that the deprime of the crimped in live primers was causing me trouble.

[jim brady]

OUCH!!!!! "Pulling the bullet and discarding them is easy"....... (Hard to type with tears in your eyes).

I pull-down old German 8X57mm ammo - 1935 and 1936 production. I use the powder charge and bullet, just a new commercial primer and case. The primers are corrosive and most are hang-fire, so I don't use the old cases. Guys at Gun Shows love to buy them up, so I recoup my expense. Still have six sealed cases for future use.

Just to add - these reloaded charges and bullets perform very well, even figuring on the old powder. I just have an old 98K with issue sights, but they all stay in the black at 100 yards within 3 or 4 inches.

On de-priming live crimped in primers, that's a different critter. I think I'd snap the live primers in one session in an easy-to-clean bolt action. I'm on your side when it comes to depriming live primers, except in this situation where they are crimped in.

[Alpo]

Oh. I didn't even see the "discarding them" part. Ouch is right. Yeah, I've pretty much come to the conclusion that I'll just pop the primers in an ought three. Not what I want to do, but better than shooting corrosive through the Garand.

[LDBennett]

A couple of things on this gift ammo from 20 years ago:

Pulling bullets often leaves them marked and distorted. For that reason alone I would not re-use them.

The primers were, of course, corrosive and I would not use them in any of my guns.

Most all of these 1943 cartridges had suffered some kind of water intrusion as most hard clumped up powder. The only reason I accepted these cartridges was for the cases. The outside of the brass showed signs of bad storage of some kind. This would be another reason not to use the primers.

Hey, we do what we do for our own reasons and while I may not do what you would do, I reserve the right to do it my way. But I did explain my reasons above.

LDBennett

[jim brady]

I'd NEVER question you or your reloading practices, LD. I have learned to respect your opinion and experiance. I pull my bullets with one of those kinetic pullers - leaves no marks. Shame about that old powder. That German stuff must have been stored pretty well as the powder is still fresh.

Had some old Spanish 7X57 years back, Was gonna pull it down, but the powder had an ammonia smell to it so I dumped all of it. Couldn't believe the strong acidic smell that stuff had. Even began to corrode the brass cases.

Sounds like that old GI .30 brass served you well. I love reloading the LC cases. Have had to switch over to Korean KE stuff recently. Good brass, too. Like I've told you many times before, I reload all my .30-06 to GI specs (M1 and M2). Jim

[The Duke]

I rarely discard pulled bullets unless they are deformed ...I use an inertia puller for everything... Some of the old mil-surp rounds have a bullet sealer applied that effectively holds like super glue...

I found that screwing the seater collet down on my die, then using it in the press to push the bullet downward just a little, will break this sealent and a good whack with the puller drops it out....

Of course the bullets are contaminated with the asphaltic sealer...tumbling doesnt get it all off...So I give them a soak in some laquer thinner...outside of course...Take them out after about 30mins soak...rub off the now softened sealant with rough cloth or steel wool and then put in the vibrator with a little polish...They will come out shining like new....Good bangers or for foulers...

Ive tried the RCBS Trim Mate for clearing the primer crimp, but found the Dillion Super Swage tool faster and more accurate...The Trim Mate is super for cleaning primer pockets, deburring and champhering, and cleaning the necks...I love it..