Trouble with semi autos

[wng-2]

I am having trouble with my .45 ACP and 9mm. They don't cycle properly. Fairly frequently a round will get caught in the slide. I am still very much a novice, and this is primarily a winter hobby. Last winter in the interest of saving money, I purchased some Rainier plated bullets. For the .45 ACP I bought 200 grain round noses. For the 9mm I bought 147 grain hollow points. I am using Unique powder, (because I have a bunch) RCBS dies along with the Lee factory crimp die. I apologize for the lack of specifics as I don't have I-net at home anymore. I'm on lunch at work and I finally remembered to ask you guys for help as I hope to be able to successfully load these rounds this winter. I know I was using low to mid range listed loads, and tried to duplicate factory overall lengths. Thanks in advance.

[smlranger]

I'm certainly no expert since I've only been reloading for about a year. However, with my 9mm I discovered that low range loads did not adequately cycle my Ruger SR9c. I had to use at least mid range loads to ensure good function.

[RandyP]

Without knowing your load specifics it is difficult to answer your question. Are you using published data, including OAL for those specific rounds? Comparing them to factory length only works if the factory used the same or very similar bullets.

[wng-2]

I'm using published data. I want to say 5.9 gr of Unique for .45, and 4 for the 9mm. I will measure the rounds tonight.

[JLA]

I would recommend you use mid range data for both loads. Especially the 9mm. The .45 may do ok with a starting load but the 9 will probably shortcycle and hang the ammo up in the slide.

Also, make sure you reloads fall freely into and out of the chambers. Disassemble the weapons and use the barrels to test the loaded rounds just like you would a cartridge guage. and then ensure theyll function freely thru the magazine. I know single stack 1911s are picky about seating depth with certain bullet styles. The hdy XTP for example, hangs up in the mag when seated longer than 1.250" and the MAX listed COAL for the .45ACP is 1.275". just gotta verify all this before loadn 500 rounds and headn to the range.

Best of luck to ya wng!

[Caneman]

what about the mouth of the cartridge? if you don't debur/bevel the outside of the mouth can it cause the catridge to hang up?

[wng-2]

Originally Posted by JLA

I would recommend you use mid range data for both loads. Especially the 9mm. The .45 may do ok with a starting load but the 9 will probably shortcycle and hang the ammo up in the slide.

Also, make sure you reloads fall freely into and out of the chambers. Disassemble the weapons and use the barrels to test the loaded rounds just like you would a cartridge guage. and then ensure theyll function freely thru the magazine. I know single stack 1911s are picky about seating depth with certain bullet styles. The hdy XTP for example, hangs up in the mag when seated longer than 1.250" and the MAX listed COAL for the .45ACP is 1.275". just gotta verify all this before loadn 500 rounds and headn to the range.

Best of luck to ya wng!

Very good, thank you.

[JohnTheCalifornian]

Originally Posted by Caneman

what about the mouth of the cartridge? if you don't debur/bevel the outside of the mouth can it cause the catridge to hang up?

When reloading pistol cartridges there is no need to de-bur the case mouth. And the case mouth gets beburred only after trimming has been done. Generally, 45 and 9mm cartridges do not require any trimming.

[PanhandlePop]

You pretty well have your options laid out above. My experience would suggest the load is too light for the weapon, the OAL is too long or the crimp inadequate, or the recoil spring needs replaced. If the guns don't have too many miles on them it shouldn't be a spring issue. See JLA's comments and start with the "plunk test." If they fit the chamber and freely fall out, load up ten rounds with about 0.2 gr more Unique to see how they function.

[myfriendis410]

The load you listed for the .45 is mid range now. I'm going to suggest that you might be holding the auto too lightly. No offense intended; but this is called "limp-wristing". There had to be adequate resistance in the hand/wrist/arm to allow the slide to travel fully rearward with adequate velocity. The fact this is happening with two pistols leads me to think that might be the case.

[CampingJosh]

Originally Posted by myfriendis410

The load you listed for the .45 is mid range now. I'm going to suggest that you might be holding the auto too lightly. No offense intended; but this is called "limp-wristing". There had to be adequate resistance in the hand/wrist/arm to allow the slide to travel fully rearward with adequate velocity. The fact this is happening with two pistols leads me to think that might be the case.

This was my first thought, too. It is something that I myself had trouble with when I was a newbie, and it has to be corrected for autoloading handguns to function properly.

Proper grip on the gun goes a long way to correct this. Check out these articles and videos for more information.
http://cheaperthandirt.com/blog/?p=3977
http://www.armystudyguide.com/conten...sed-with.shtml
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nm9uG5bPubw
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...32856867071363

[dbennett48]

I was thinking the same thing. I had this problem with my Glock 19, years ago. I very quickly learned to hold the pistol FIRMLY, and no jambs or failures to clear.

[wng-2]

[QUOTE=JLA;822365]
Also, make sure you reloads fall freely into and out of the chambers.
QUOTE]

If they don't fall in and out freely, what have I done wrong? The crimp?
Thanks.

[steve4102]

[QUOTE=wng-2;822696]

Originally Posted by JLA

Also, make sure you reloads fall freely into and out of the chambers.
QUOTE]

If they don't fall in and out freely, what have I done wrong? The crimp?
Thanks.

Hard to say, but that is a good place to start.

Lets talk crimp for straight walled pistol rounds that headspace on the case mouth,taper crimp. The taper crimp die is not really a "Crimp" die. It is more of a flare removal die as you do not crimp the mouth deep into the bullet like a true roll crimp. The taper crimp die is used to remove the flare applied by the expander die plus maybe a .001 more. Your 45 ACP rounds should measure about .470 at the case mouth.
To much taper crimp can distort the case and cause feeding problems, to little crimp can leave some of the flare and cause similar problems.

[myfriendis410]

From what he described he's getting a stovepipe, which lead me to suggest "limp-wrist" as the proximate cause.

[wng-2]

Originally Posted by myfriendis410

From what he described he's getting a stovepipe, which lead me to suggest "limp-wrist" as the proximate cause.

This is in an interesting theory which I will pay attention to next time I shoot. However, the only time there is ever a problem, is with rounds that I have hand loaded. This has never happened in either of these weapons with factory rounds. I'm pretty sure there is something I'm doing wrong in the process, just need to figure out exactly what.

[myfriendis410]

It could be a combination of things that together manifest in a feeding failure. Most factory stuff is pretty hot in 9mm and usually the factory .45 acp is a 230 gr., which is going to cycle with more authority than a 200 grainer.

Looking at your hold and form can't hurt; we can all be better shooters.......

I look forward to hearing what you find out.

[JLA]

[QUOTE=wng-2;822696]

Originally Posted by JLA

Also, make sure you reloads fall freely into and out of the chambers.
QUOTE]

If they don't fall in and out freely, what have I done wrong? The crimp?
Thanks.

Youve got to put a little more crimp on them to take the flare out of the case. This is where I really like the Lee die sets for handgun cartridges. the crimp die has a carbide postsizer ring that ensures all your ammo will function in your weapons.

the OD at the case mouth should measure .469-.471 (.470 is nominal) for the .45ACP and the 9mm should measure .374-.376 (.375 is nominal)

[TheGunClinger]

I am far from an expert, but I feel the limp-wristing thing might play a part in this. I have a Walther P-22 that my wife just loves to shoot but she had problems with FTE and stovepipes. When this occured I would grab the gun and fire 10 rounds as fast as I could. The gun worked just fine. I deduced that with a low power .22 long, that there just wasnt enough power to shoot the bullet and also rack the slide back if you didnt grip that sucker real tight. Now she grips it tight and never has a problem. Might not be your problem, but you might just try and hold it tighter. Try and shoot my DE .50 and even if you think you are gripping it tight, guess what...stovepipe! Jmho.

[TheGunClinger]

[quote=JLA;822952]

Originally Posted by wng-2

Youve got to put a little more crimp on them to take the flare out of the case. This is where I really like the Lee die sets for handgun cartridges. the crimp die has a carbide postsizer ring that ensures all your ammo will function in your weapons.

the OD at the case mouth should measure .469-.471 (.470 is nominal) for the .45ACP and the 9mm should measure .374-.376 (.375 is nominal)

I love the Lee dies and the crimp dies, but I think that you know that we will soon be inunudated with anti Lee crap just because you mentioned the name LEE.

[JLA]

eh I aint too worried about it clinger. LEE is the red headed stepchild of reloading equipment and itll always be treated as such, especially by the 'smurfs'. It does great by me and thats all that matters.

[wng-2]

[QUOTE=JLA;822952]

Originally Posted by wng-2

Youve got to put a little more crimp on them to take the flare out of the case. This is where I really like the Lee die sets for handgun cartridges. the crimp die has a carbide postsizer ring that ensures all your ammo will function in your weapons.

the OD at the case mouth should measure .469-.471 (.470 is nominal) for the .45ACP and the 9mm should measure .374-.376 (.375 is nominal)

Thanks, I'll be looking into this during the dark evenings in the coming weeks.

[chubcobear]

When I started loading .45 for a Taurus MilPro, I found that when I loaded low power rounds that they did not cycle the gun properly and caused light strikes on the ammo about 25% of the time. Loaded up to military hardball power and all the problems disappeared. Fed, set and fired well. Some striker-fired guns have to have a certain minimum power it seems. Lee dies work great for me.