Defending yourself after the collapse of society

[prof_fate]

Not to add to your paranoia but back in HS english class we had to read "no blade of grass" http://www.amazon.com/No-Blade-Grass...7977772&sr=8-7 - set in england if that increases it's appeal to you.

Anyway - you have a couple of things to consider:

defense/attack against people - since we're talking mad max times you want deadly force, not wounding. 223 and army weapons are often aimed at maiming, not killing, for geneva convention reasons. Skip them. Get hunting rifles or 12ga shot guns. You probably don't need sniper capability and semi auto will likely waste bullets. I chose a 30-30 lever action (aka cowboy rifle), but a 45-70 would also be a good choice for a caliber. You'll have to find what's available in your area - for trade purposes or for scavenging purpses.

22Lr/rimfire - not a great defensive arm but anyone can use it (kids, newbies) and it's not loud and it's great for small gaime (rabbits and simiar) for food. Ammo is cheap and small so you can have lots and lots of it. Here 500 rounds can be had for $20. A 30-30 rifle round by comparison come in a box of 20 for $15 to $25.

Pistols are handy to have as you can wear them on your belt - even antique arms if you're allowed (black powder if you have to go back that far) would be handy to have.

[Juker]

Originally Posted by The Duke

Alpo....And there is NOTHING more intimidating than looking at the business end of a pair of side by side 12g double barrels...

Got this in an email - caption was "How a Texan winks at an illegal alien."

[norahc]

Originally Posted by raven818

I can't think of the name of it right now, maybe somebody else knows...they've started a new reality show. It's about folks who are living toward their worse dooms-day scenarios. What they have, and what they think they still need when the SHTF.

If I see the commercial again, I'll post it.

Doomsday Preppers on NatGeo (http://channel.nationalgeographic.co...sday-preppers/)

[AL MOUNT]

Originally Posted by Juker

Got this in an email - caption was "How a Texan winks at an illegal alien."

Cock them damn hammers... Tex.....

[raven818]

Originally Posted by norahc

Doomsday Preppers on NatGeo (http://channel.nationalgeographic.co...sday-preppers/)

Yep, that's the ticket. TY.

[prof_fate]

Originally Posted by DixieLandMan

I have told my wife that when the SHTF, guns, gold and crops will be what people need. I say that because the American dollar does not buy as much as it once did but gold will always hold at least some value. Crops (food) I can grow on my farm and guns to defend it all.

SOunds good but who knows what gold is? I mean, yes, it's a shiny yellow metal. Can you tell 14k plate from solid 18k? So someone offers you gold jewelry for the crops you have...in the field that they could take at 3 am...

See my point? "Money" is based on trust and 'gold' will be the same thing - it has value only when and if someone will trade you goods/services for it, be that paper or gold (or diamonds, etc). sorry, but i've no way to tell good gold from crap gold...perhaps my powder scale can weight it though.

[permafrost]

Originally Posted by Juker

Got this in an email - caption was "How a Texan winks at an illegal alien."

There's just something extremely intimidating about staring down the barrels of a "coach" type SXS shotgun with exposed hammers. I'm sure thinkin' about getting one. Someone was saying they can be reloaded very quickly with practice. I always considered the two shot limit a serious handicap. I'm rethinking that.

[rustyfugger]

I agree w/ most who suggested the shotgun & .22. I would also inquire about a maybe finding a weapon that will shoot a NATO round. That type of ammo can be aquired after the world craps out, and you may be forced to defend yourself, therefore collecting the fallen ones weapons & ammo. Just thinking out loud.

[jeffadaklin]

I always figured a hi-cap 22 rifle, a hi-cap 9mm and a pump shotgun (higher capacity the better) to be the perfect trio. If it's not limited to 3 guns I'd do like rusty- add the 7.62 rifle.

[ryan42]

dont know the name but it starts febth on natgeo channel

[Carne Frio]

Shotgun: versatile, reliable and very effective.

[jeffadaklin]

New GUN WORLD mag has an article about new ammo for .223 rifles that won't overpenetrate any worse than a handgun, less than some handgun ammo. Only one they mention is PDX1, sounds kinda lilke frangible ammo. I keep #4 shot in my SD Mossberg, they say it's less likely to be an overpenetration problem, but at in-the-house range, plenty powerful..

[Zane71464]

Good Coach Gun with sling,
Good long range shooting varmint rifle with good optics, and sling,
Good semi-auto pistol with plenty of mags,
Plenty of ammo for all,
and, visit the range on a regular basis and master EACH weapon.

[ryan42]

your thinking of doomsdaypreppers its on natgeo tonight at 9

[JLA]

I have come to realize in my relatively short time on this earth that nothing EVER happens the way you plan it. So, Only advice i can offer is get alot of practice and secure as much ammo and firearms as you can afford, In a doomsday situation youre not going to be using your weapons primarily for food, you will be using them to defend what valuables (to survival) you have in your posession, and it will be against your fellow man. Go get aquainted with shooting at the 'T' so you will destroy the 'apricot', afterall, each bullet saved is another meal in a survivalists world.. And learn to dehydrate any meat you kill, Jerky will sustain you as well as fresh meat will and it will last a whole lot longer without refirgeration.

[Rhuga]

I watched the 2nd episode last week of Doomsday Preppers. And speaking of gold to barter with...how about the guy that was buying up all kinds of booze for the same thing. And he didn't drink. It's on my calendar for next week to watch.

When we get our income tax refund. The list contains:
2 each pump shotguns, 12 gauge, 3" chamber
2 or more shotgun shell bandoleers
Lots of bullets (i.e. .38 special, 12 gauge, and 9mm)

I am the guy that has a Hi-point 9mm for carry and a Jennings J22 for back up. I worry about this. I do have a .38 Special for carry and a .38 Special Derringer for back-up and this is most likely the way I will go and then add a shotgun.

[Inthewind1976]

I have always felt that the "fewer shots without reloading" concept of a double is pretty much made moot by how quickly you can reload those 2 shots versus trying to cram 5 shells into a pump while running, or simply being "adrenalized' by the conflict in the first place.

[Neverhome]

I have a few thoughts on preparing for a doomsday scenario but first let me set the stage. I firmly believe in it and have been adding a little to preparations each week for a long time now. I am very well prepared to survive and defend myself and family, both physically and psychologically. I also have a bug out bag just in case too, my truck camper stocked with supplies. Having said that, I think the majority of us like to think we are perfectly capable of surviving on our own no matter what. I am sure many of us can. But the reality is very few of us have had to do that and even if we could, how willing would we be to leave our families and loved ones alone if they were not physically able to join us? Very few I think. I have modified my thinking somewhat on bugging out.

A lot if not most,or even all of us, have worked very hard to get where we are in life. We have food, shelter, warm homes in the winter, medicine in our cabinets and the companionship of loved ones and friends. Why would we give that all up to go run to the willy wags, sleep in tents or shelters, scramble to find food and water, run the risk of infections when we are cut or worse, and freeze in the winter for those of us in the Northern sections of the country? Even if our elderly, sick and children came with us, would we want that for them? Not this man. I am prepared to defend all that I have and all whom I love, right where I am, to the death if necessary.

I think we place too much emphasis on individuality in bug out situations. The Bible tells us that man was not mean to live alone. In my advancing years I have come to embrace that. A prior post was made, which one escapes me as I write this, that there will always be a man when survivors gather who will seek to take control and direct the activities of the group. That does not surprise me. Even wild horses have a stallion whom they follow. I supsect many of us do not need a leader, but the reality is most people are followers, not leaders, and an effective leader is crucial to the survival of any group.

What I think we should consider as a group, instead of trying to run, is to infact unify with our neighbors. All have different talents to contribute. Those who can fight should fight and be supported by those who cannot. Meals have to be cooked, look outs are essential, medical knowledge is a must have, clothing needs to be mended, wounds sewn up. I could go on but you get the point. I think most Americans abhore the thought of an end times scenario. I do. I want to see my granchildren grow up happily, well fed and adjusted. But if that cannot be, than we need to join with others to protect ourselves and our country. For those who, for whatever reason, finds a doomesday scenario exciting and have none to care for, they could join our armed forces in protecting our country from all foreign threats. I often wonder if the gun control people realize how formidable an army this country has other than our standing military, who love this country, most likely have served it, and would gladly stand up and defend her. It boggles my sensabilities why they would want to strip those of us who feel that way of our firearms.

Neverhome

[Iron Eagle]

Rhuga, I had one of those once. Load it up with CCI Stingers. They pack a wallop.

[Iron Eagle]

Neverhome, I feel like you do. As a veteran, I willing to whatever I have to do to protect my family. I know that Father God has a good plan, and He always takes care of His kids, no matter what! If it comes down to it, we will be standing when the smoke clears!

[Iron Eagle]

I have to add this- get an AK in 7.62x39. Ammo is cheap, it will keep running no matter what, and whatever you shoot at will drop.

[Neverhome]

Originally Posted by Iron Eagle

I have to add this- get an AK in 7.62x39. Ammo is cheap, it will keep running no matter what, and whatever you shoot at will drop.

Iron Eagle,

Glad to see I am not alone. Too bad the distance between us is so far. I'd be proud to stand shoulder to shoulder with another veteran.

I have owned an AK for a long time. Love its ruggedness and availability of ammo. I have topped it with a scope with see through mounts, and can keep the rounds in a coffee cup at 100 yards which is not too bad for an AK.

Neverhome

[Double D]

Originally Posted by Neverhome

Iron Eagle,

Glad to see I am not alone. Too bad the distance between us is so far. I'd be proud to stand shoulder to shoulder with another veteran.

I have owned an AK for a long time. Love its ruggedness and availability of ammo. I have topped it with a scope with see through mounts, and can keep the rounds in a coffee cup at 100 yards which is not too bad for an AK.

Neverhome

I am not going anywhere. First of all, I believe what the bible says anyhow and if I believe that well, I dont need to run. I will do what ever I need to do right where I am at and believe me, thats alot. When all of that runs out, well, I know of a much better place with streets paved with gold. I dont wish to die but I certainly dont fear death. I am ready every day to meet my God.

[carver]

If any of you intend to stay in your home, and defend it, make sure it's bullet proof! Brick it on the outside, or add sheet steel to the inside. What ever it takes. As for me, I'm not going anywhere, but I won't be in the house!

[Kent Detective]

As most of you chaps in the good ole USA will know, the concept of owning a firearm for self/home defence purposes is not recognised here in the UK. In fact Brits posting on USA gun forums like this one must always be very careful when discussing such things!

Our local FEO's (Firearms Enquiry Officers) will be aware of forums like this one and particular threads which originate here in Engerland (Britland). Yes it stinks but those of us entrusted to possess lethal firearms must operate within the bounds of the law of our land. It agrieves me that I can't talk openly about such things however I would add my own reason for owning firearms is ONLY for sporting purposes (pest control).

Here in the UK 99.9% of firearms which are used to hurt people are in fact unlawfully held by criminals. Licensed firearms are rarely used for such a thing (Dunblane, Hungerford, Cumbria). In my opinion it's all about breeding - if you have been bought up to respect human life then it's unlikely you will ever use firearms in a manner contrary to law (self defence accepted). The few incidents where licenced guns have been used to hurt others is the result of people becoming utterly MAD. I can't help but think these nasty evil ruthless people should never have been given a licence in the first place....

Then again anyone can hurt someone if they really wish to - simply go the the kitchen drawer and take out the carving knife! I can't see the UK government ever licensing kitchen knives can you?

For an "end of the world type situation" (something I can safely discuss), someone in the UK should aim to own 2 guns - a 12g shotgun and a .22LR rimfire rifle. Our current feeble anti-gun laws stop us from owning anything else...

I'd love to say more but alas it's simply not possible the way things stand here at the present.

It was said that Hitler advised his generals NOT to ever consider invading the USA mainland because so many citizens owned guns. Progress would have been very difficult indeed (almost every citizen would become a sniper). Here in the UK we were invaded years ago by foreign cultures and they have no need to beat us with weapons they simply outbreed us with their womens wombs (10 to 1). We are well on the way to oblivion....