1962 italian shotgun id PICTURES ADDED 9-5-02

Discussion in 'The Ask the Pros & What's It Worth? Forum' started by warpig, Feb 24, 2003.

  1. warpig

    warpig Guest

    dksdks
    Member
    Posts: 1
    (9/1/02 1:48:47 am)
    Reply | Edit | Del All 1962 italian shotgun id PICTURES ADDED 9-5-02
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    I would appreciate any help with the identification of the makers and origins of these two guns. They were proofed in italy in 1962 at standard pressures. (magnum pressure testing was only started after 1962 in italy) they both have preliminary proof marks on them, so I assume they must be of decent enough quality. They are 12 caliber s/s. I assume they were made by one of the many independent makers of the Gardone area of the time, but I do not know which ones.

    1st gun: Appears to have german?? barrels: Inscriptions=>
    on the top of barrels: LAUF STAHL KRUPP F.SSEN Anybody know what it means?

    On the sides of barrels: OFF <<S. MARCO>> GARDONE V.T-BRESCIA

    On the bottom of the barrels In addition to details on the chroming of the barrels, the proof marks, caliber, id number) barrell weight kg 1,500 followed by 18,3 followed by 17,2 followed by a cross in a circle, and on the other barell 20,3/70 followed by 18,3 followed by 17,7 followed by a Y.

    On the bottom of the barrels and the reciever there is the inscription GARDONE V.T.-<BRESCIA) and a of a lion standing next to a book with BG on the book and S. MARCO under the lion and the book. I would also appreciate any help with identification of the choke of this gun. The bores must be 18.3.

    note: the at the bottom of the rib, where it joins the two barrels is different than the nuber on the block and the reciever and is 8641.
    The gun is decorated with hunting scenes

    The 2nd gun:
    on the rib it says: < S. REMO BIS >

    On the top side of the barells it says: ACCIAIO E.S.C Gia' VICKERS & C and below that G. GAMBA-GARDONE V.T

    On the block it has the proof marks and the chokes * and **. It also has a stamp that looks like a fish going towards the left.

    On the reciever it has the same standard drawings and also:
    a bird (hawk??) flying and holding a gun with its claws with the inscription FUSIL SPECIAL underneath. it also has in a rectangle : FLLI (the lli is in smaller letters) and next to it GAMBA GARDONE V.T

    The gun is decorated with flower scrolls









    edit to post pictures

    Edited by: warpig883 at: 9/5/02 11:07:48 am

    Xracer
    *TFF Senior Staff*
    Posts: 2648
    (9/1/02 7:58:57 am)
    Reply | Edit | Del Re: 1962 italian shotgun id
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    Hi dks.....and welcome to TFF!

    A lot of people are gone for the holiday weekend, but keep checking back. One of our shotgun experts should be around before long.

    dksdks
    Member
    Posts: 2
    (9/1/02 9:46:48 am)
    Reply | Edit | Del will do so
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    will continue checking

    Tac401
    Administrator
    Posts: 5866
    (9/2/02 2:03:51 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del
    ezSupporter
    Re: will do so
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    dksdks,

    You should put this in our "Ask The Pro's" forum where
    it will get the proper responses and quicker too, I'm
    sure Doc can answer your questions to this.

    Tac
    TFF VMBB Email Tac

    dksdks
    Member
    Posts: 3
    (9/3/02 11:34:14 am)
    Reply | Edit | Del picture
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    Thank you for the help
    I will try and send a picture, as soon as i find out how.

    warpig883
    *TFF Staff*
    Posts: 4581
    (9/3/02 4:26:30 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del
    ezSupporter
    Re: picture
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    If you need a picture posted you can email it to me or I can give you a lesson on how to do it yourself.

    warpig883@yahoo.com


    dksdks
    Member
    Posts: 4
    (9/5/02 11:03:56 am)
    Reply | Edit | Del MANY THANKS
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Many thanks to warpig for the posting.

    the pictures can also, hopefully, be seen at

    (delete)gallery.alloutdoorschat.c...ml(delete)

    gallery.alloutdoorschat.c...age098.jpg

    AntiqueDr
    *TFF Senior Staff*
    Posts: 3046
    (9/5/02 11:39:32 am)
    Reply | Edit | Del
    ezSupporter
    Re: picture
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    OK, here you go.

    The San Marco shotguns were not commercially imported into the US, so guns with this marking are seldom seen. Many continental manufacturers used barrels made by the famous German manufacturer Krupp and this is what was done here (BARREL STEEL - KRUPP - ESSEN (Germany)).

    It is a 12ga, made in 1962, with 2 3/4" chambers. The chokes correspond to a very tight Modified and a very tight Full.

    There seems to be quite a bit of wear to both metal and wood, and the wood itself looks fairly utilitarian. The game scene is quite nice, and the sidelocks are a plus although they are not hand-detachable.

    I would market that gun at $1500.00


    Filli Gamba (Gamba Brothers) is the predecessor of today's Renato Gamba (who bought out his brother in 1967). It is also very tightly choked, IM/F. G Gamba and Filli Gamba shotguns were not commercially imported into the US, so you would have to compare quality and engraving to current Renato Gamba guns in order to arrive at a value. I am guessing somewhere between $1000-$2000.
    We Buy Guns! 1 - 100, Antique or Modern!
    www.apaxenterprises.com
    Master Dealer for Kimber, Wilson Combat and Dan Wesson

    Edited by: AntiqueDr at: 9/5/02 12:47:44 pm

    dksdks
    Member
    Posts: 5
    (9/5/02 2:00:53 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del Here is the next gun
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    Using my newly acquired knowledge I have placed some pictures of the Gamba Gun, which may help more.

    It is in better condition than the San marco Gun and seems to have Vickers barells.

    One question for your experts: Is the San Marco related to Armi San Marco?

    Here is the PROPER Gamba site:

    gallery.alloutdoorschat.c...gamba.html


    Edited by: dksdks at: 9/5/02 3:15:24 pm

    nitroproof
    Member
    Posts: 1
    (9/5/02 5:32:20 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del I have a Italian SxS hammer gun of the same era...
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    it was made in 1963 by Zanardini, it too is only identified by the maker on the watertable. The barrels are marked: Vickers English Steel. Mine has magnum proofs and 3" chambers.

    nitro

    warpig883
    *TFF Staff*
    Posts: 4613
    (9/5/02 11:23:46 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del
    ezSupporter
    Re: Here is the next gun
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    I posted this question on a site I am a member of that specializes in old double shotguns. Here is a link


    www.gunshop.com/cgi-bin/u...1&t=004203




    dksdks
    Member
    Posts: 7
    (9/9/02 6:35:53 am)
    Reply | Edit | Del Thanks to all
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    Thanks to everybody for their help so far.
    If there is anything more you can tell me feel free to do so.
  2. safaritours

    safaritours New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2010
    Messages:
    5
    Hi folks, old post I know but seen it while reserching myself, here is a reply I got from Gamba re a San Remo, anybody else looking it may help, cheers from Australia.R: Information F Gamba shotgun‏
    From: Gamba Macchine Utensili (info@gambamacchine.it)

    Sent: Wednesday, 16 June 2010 7:08:54 PM




    Dear john,
    congratulation for your great purchase. The model of Your gun is “San Remo”.
    It was built in Jenuary 1959 and it is completely handmade.
    Our evaluation could be 3.000,00 € .
    Kind Regards

    Tommaso Gamba
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2011
  3. Charlie the sniper

    Charlie the sniper New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2008
    Messages:
    751
    Location:
    England, thats the USN aircraft carrier near europ
    I have a 1962 San Marco side by side Hammer gun (12g), but mine is fitted with English barrels by Vickers.
    It's a pleasure to shoot.

    Attached Files:

  4. safaritours

    safaritours New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2010
    Messages:
    5
    I like the Gamba San Remo so much think I will sell the Greener and the Browning and find another Gamba to play with, also looking for any Gamba vests or patches if anyone out there has any
  5. safaritours

    safaritours New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2010
    Messages:
    5
    some photos, hope I did it right, the missus said I never could, that why she left, what a great day that was, but back to the Gamba, any bits any info let me know, you never know when I may be able to help you with hunting in Australia or New Zealand lol.

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Oct 7, 2010
  6. safaritours

    safaritours New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2010
    Messages:
    5
    The other San Remo s/s 12 gauge I have is this one was made by G Gamba serial no 8646 1975with Acciaio Boehler Blitz barrelsand identical to the one above, again fully hand made and hand engraved, this time engraving looks like daisys not roses like the other one, fantastic, pulled it apart and you can see the hand file marks from manufacture, these realy are incredibly well made shotguns.
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2011
  7. BLT325

    BLT325 New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2010
    Messages:
    2
    I have repeatedly entered every word on this firearm into search panes and haven't gotten very far until I see you pix.
    Hopefully I can get good enough images to tell what this thing is if you guys know. It looks very similar.
    Hope I got the attch right.
  8. BLT325

    BLT325 New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2010
    Messages:
    2
    Let's try this again.
    Is this a similar firearm to the San Remo you have pictured
    PC121523.JPG

    PC121521.JPG

    PC121520.JPG
  9. safaritours

    safaritours New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2010
    Messages:
    5
    Dont think that is anything like the San Remo and I doubt very much that it is a Gamba, are there any other markings :)
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