760 remington game master pump

Discussion in 'The Ammo & Reloading Forum' started by raysmithson1, Jun 17, 2010.

  1. raysmithson1

    raysmithson1 Member

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    some reloads 30- 06 are not cycling the round hangs up mid way having to force the round into the chamber , one of the fellows that I shoot with said Lee makes a die for this problem any one had this or heard of the problem I am having thanks Ray
  2. 199er

    199er New Member

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    Welcome to the forum. I also shoot a remington 760 as well as a Savage 170A pump and in the past I've experienced the same cycling difficulties as you describe.

    At that time I was shooting factory ammo in my 760 so I was pretty sure my chambering problem wasn't ammo related. The first thing I did was to thoroughly cleaned my chamber, bolt and all other internal parts but after I did I still had first round (and subsequent rounds) chambering problems. I noticed that my brass cases were scratched and come to find out the lips on the top of the magazine were too tight and were causing the scratches, and likely contributed to the repeated mis-feeding. I bent the magazine lips a little more open and then cycled my rounds through the action. A couple of minor adjustments of the lips and the weapon cycled correctly including on the range the following weekend. So the first thing I would recommend doing is check the magazine to insure it's serviceable.

    First, work the magazine follower up and down to see if it slides smoothly. Clean and lightly oil if necessary. Then load the magazine and try to cycle the rounds out checking to see if the lips of the magazine are scratching and the brass more than looks normal. If so then the lips are possibly contributing to the faulty feeding and you'll have to adjust them as I did or buy a new one. Also, check to see if your reloads are not too long for the magazine (and that they feed upward in the magazine easily). The inside length of your magazine will dictate your cartridge overall length and you should allow approximately fifty thousandths (.050) of clearance from the tip of your bullet to the forward wall of the magazine.

    You indicate you're reloading for your 760 but if you're neck sizing your cases you shouldn't be. Pump rifles as well as lever and autoloaders do not have near the "caming power" to chamber and lock a a round like a bolt action does, so trying to feed a necked sized fired formed cartridge (rather than a resized one) into a pump rifle chamber using only the strength generated by the forward motion of a nonfiring arm is not going to insure correct & flawless chambering/cycling and could cause a dangerous situation if you somehow are able to fire a round not completely chambered and locked by the bolt.

    All the reloading references advise when reloading a pump, lever or autoloader to full length resize that brass with Small Base Dies. These dies (if you adjust them to do so) will full length resize your brass to a smaller dimension than the 'regular' resizing dies will. These same reloading references say that Small Base Dies will insure your reloads will cleanly fit into your chamber and will prevent any cycling difficulties.

    This is true but I've also found that I don't need to resize the brass for my pump rifles with Small Base Dies. I use regular resizing dies to resizing my brass but I just Partially Full Length Resize (PFL) it. I set my dies up to only "bump/move" the shoulders of my brass back two thousandths (.002). This resizes my brass enough for my reloads to cycle cleanly though my pump rifles plus, the PFL resizing operation only minimally works my brass and enables my brass to last longer.

    If you have a set of regular 30-06 resizing dies (or are able to borrow one from a friend), try full length resizing a few reloads and see if they cycle OK in your 760 before investing in a set of small base dies as they are a little more expensive than regular resizing dies and you may not need them for you 760 to cycle properly.



    I hope this helps you find and correct your feeding problem and again, welcome to the forum.
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2010
  3. LDBennett

    LDBennett Well-Known Member

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    199er's advice is good as far as it goes. If the gun still feeds commercial ammo OK but not your reloads then it is not the gun's magazine that is the problem.

    A common problem is the crimp. If done too extremely then the neck of the case bulges making it not go into the chamber easily or at all. Measure up some of the reloads to see where they are different from commercial ammo to pin point the problem.

    If it is the crimp then the fellow shooter was referring to the LEE Factory crimp die. But it does not fix the bad cartridges. It keeps the crimp from bulging and makes a much more uniform crimp on brass that may not all be trimmed to the same length (it does not alleviate the need to trim but only makes the crimp more uniform between cases that are at the two extremes of case Over All Length specifications).

    The LEE Factory crimp die uses an internal collet to push the brass into the bullet horizontally unlike a regular roll crimp that pushes the case vertically where it can bulge if over done.

    You may want to read the sticky on crimping on this forum:

    http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/showthread.php?t=76154

    LDBennett
  4. Bindernut

    Bindernut Well-Known Member

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    Yup, as 199er mentioned, the 760 action doesn't have as much camming action to finish chambering a round that a turn-bolt rifle has. Even though the 760 is a rotating bolt lock-up style action, the cam on the bolt carrier that does the lug turning doesn't have as much oomph as your hand pressing a regular bolt handle down.

    I've never had to use small-base dies when loading for my grandpa's 7600 (and a friend of mine has used a few of those reloads in his 760 with good results too). They're just full-length resized with standard dies set up as 199er describes.

    Small-base dies would be your other option, but whether or not your rifle needs it depends on how tight your chamber is.

    I don't know of any Lee dies specifically for this problem (I don't think they make any small-base dies).
    Besides small-base dies, RCBS also has their X-die collet resizing die available in both standard and small-base. Maybe this is what your friend is thinking of?

    LD beat me to it, but an overcrimped case will have a slight bulge at the very end which can also cause hard chambering. The Lee "factory crimp" die will help prevent this.
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2010
  5. LDBennett

    LDBennett Well-Known Member

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    I will also add that my Remington pump in 35 Whelan does not require small base dies. I also do not use the LEE factory crimp die because I have yet to have any problem when using the crimp in the seating die. But all my brass is correctly trimmed and the crimp is setup to not be excessive. If I were setting up for this caliber today (I have had this rifle for at least 15 years or more) for reloading I would get the LEE Factory Crimp die. It is probably the best product LEE makes, and there is little that LEE makes that I like.

    The RCBS X-Die is a entire new system of trimming that minimizes the need to trim brass and makes ammo no different in sizing than any other die set. It is just a special seating die used with a different case prep procedure. It supposedly allows case life of up to 20 or so reloads without trimming except for a special trimming initially. I think that is not the problem here.

    LDBennett
  6. raysmithson1

    raysmithson1 Member

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    YOU HAVE AFFIRMED MY SUSPICIONS ON CLIP THE ROUNDS ARE SCRATCHED THAT WAS WHAT I FIRST SAW DID SOME MODIFYING ON THE FRONT OF THE MAG, EHH,,, BUT THE LIPS YES WILL DO, ON THIS RIFLE I DO USE FULL LENGTH DIES,, GOOD RIFLE LOVE TO SHOOT NICE TIGHT GROUPS,, THANKS ONE NINTY NINER,,GOOD BUSINESS RAY
  7. raysmithson1

    raysmithson1 Member

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    thanks LD that's what's good about this forum good advice from all you guys,, I consider myself a good reloader, and do all the neccesary time consuming things ,, know what i mean ,, but it's a good hobby will use your advice along with the others well worth the price of member ship Ray
  8. raysmithson1

    raysmithson1 Member

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    In the end my friend that shoots with me said that the lee die was the answer but I will do all that was explained to me in the other posts to me thanks for all the help bindernut,, all is appreciated Ray
  9. raysmithson1

    raysmithson1 Member

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    most of my 06 rifles are for the one only cartridges or perfect for that gun case size OAL, this is a rifle that has been in my safe for yrs ,, too many not enough time to shoot them all, so it is a little earitating to have this happen thanks for bending my ear Ray
  10. 199er

    199er New Member

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    You're right about the 760 pumps shooting well but many hunters don't believe they're capable of being accurate. Granted it is not benchrest rifle but wasn't designed to be, however, if the "nut behind the bolt is tight" it will shoot 'minute of deer' out to 200 yards easily. In the past I've owned one in 35 Rem, .308 & 30-06 (carbine). All were well balanced, pointed well & shot accurately, once I became used to those "8 lb triggers". Yup, love those 760s and hope you have continued good luck with yours.
  11. Bindernut

    Bindernut Well-Known Member

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    Yup, the 76 (and 74 autoloader) series are pretty darn good for accuracy considering they're not a bolt-action in a full-floated, tip-bedded, or full-bedded one-piece stock.
    As 199er said, that heavy trigger pull weight is the toughest thing to get used to. But even as heavy as they are they're usually a pretty clean trigger.
    I have a heckuva time adjusting back to it when I pull grandpa's old 7600 out of the case for a little range time. I don't use it in the field since I don't like the long slide-action, but mine is a family rifle so it's still a keeper.
  12. 199er

    199er New Member

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    I know what you mean, I acquired the same problem after shooting my newer weapons for a period of time without, shooting my pumps. The newer triggers were all between 4 & 4 1/2 lbs and basically 'ruined' my ability to have any consistent trigger control with those heavier triggers.

    So with about 40 minutes of work with a hard wetstone, some 600 grit sandpaper, & toothpaste (to polishing my stoning work) my pump gun triggers are now approximately 4 1/2 lbs. Problem solved......and I always take one of my pumps to shoot whenever I go to the range shoot other weapons.
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