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Another H&R question

Discussion in 'The Ask the Pros & What's It Worth? Forum' started by mle1, Nov 20, 2006.

  1. mle1

    mle1 New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2006
    Messages:
    2
    Dear B.Goforth
    Having read your response to the gentleman in the H&R firearms forum I think you may be able to help me date this pistol I recently inherited. I read in your reply that only the third model was suitable for smokeless powder and I need to know if mine is older or newer than that. My gun is identical to his but my barrel patent dates are different and my serial no's are different and in different places.My barrel top says HARRINGTON & RICHARDSON ARMS COMPANY WORCHESTER MASS U.S.A.
    PAT.MAY 14 & AUG.6.89 APRIL 2.95 APRIL 7.96

    The barrel side says AUTO EJECTING 38 S&W CTGE

    Under the barrel strap and bottom
    of the handgrip ( not under the plastic handle)
    The metal is stamped with 6 digit serial 1283xx

    The ejector and rear cylinder have the same
    Last 3 digits of the serial Number 3xx
  2. b.goforth

    b.goforth New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2003
    Messages:
    3,174
    Location:
    houston, tx
    mle 1,
    these four patent dates were used on the third model (1905-1941) between 1905 and 1908 only. the serial number list i am working on puts 1283XX in 1908. some of the early third model have the serial number on the frame twice, on the bottom of the butt and on the left side of the grip frame. i have yet to determine when the third model started markin on the bottom of the butt strap only.

    as a third model it was manufactured for smokeless powder pressures but it is at least 98 years old so please be careful with it.
    bill
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2006
  3. mle1

    mle1 New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2006
    Messages:
    2
    Thank You for the info, I just took it to a local gun smith while I was awaiting your reply and he informed me that it is a very unsafe gun to have because the cylinder free wheels and that the cylinder has some play in it that could cause it to shave lead if it doesn't allign with the barrel every time it rotates. The lock on top is tight however and it is in nice condition except for the surface scratches and worn blueing.He said many people may want it just to hang on a wall as an ornament, or use it for parts. I think it may be worth more in a gun buy back program than to a collector. Some times they will give you a $50.00 gift cert. for it and that may be better than someone getting hurt or killed with it. I have many nice guns I don't need one that may have problems. From everything I've heard It's probably not worth $50.00. Thanks again!!!! Mike
  4. berto64

    berto64 Active Member

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    Jan 31, 2001
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    7,511
    Location:
    Owyhee County, Idaho
    Sounds like a plan, mle 1. Do the buy back.

    Those old H&R and Iver Johnsons are kinda dicey when it comes to shooting them.
  5. southernshooter

    southernshooter New Member

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    Mar 5, 2006
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    5,956
    Location:
    Deep South Mississippi
  6. beamer

    beamer New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2007
    Messages:
    1
    Dear B Goforth,
    I just checked your website and found you're into H&R this time. I was trying to fill up the form you put in there but can't. So I ill just have to ask you about my H&R rifle in mle1's thread hoping to get you attention..
    Ive been seaching info about an H&R rifle that I recently acquired

    It's Markings:
    H & R Arms
    'Leatherneck' model 150
    .22 cal. long rifle only
    Sn # 1881

    there is very few mention about this in some searches that Ive done.
    things that I learned to far:
    It may have been manufactured between 1945 to 1950.
    It was used as a training rifle by the marines hence the marking "leatherneck"

    I omitted the serial number info in my past searches but have included it now
    hoping to know more about it and how it ended up in the philippines in the first place.

    considering its age, it still works great, and I also need to know it's true worth,
    if it is a collectors item?

    thank you so much in advance for any info..

    beamer
  7. b.goforth

    b.goforth New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2003
    Messages:
    3,174
    Location:
    houston, tx
    beamer,
    the model 150 'leatherneck' was manufactured between 1948 and 1952. it was the last mass produced eugene reising disigned 22 semi-auto that H&R manufactured. the model 165 (same design except for butt stock and target sights) was in very limited production between 1959-1961. even though these rifles were manufactured after the post 1940 serial number system was started they do not have a letter code to give a year of manufacture. your serial number is one of the highest i have information on but i would expect it was manufactured at the earliest in 1950.

    the series of 22 semi-auto rifle designed by reising and manufactured by H&R was started in 1944 with the civilivan model 65 and the military version model 58C. these were the same rifle heavy stocks and peep sights. the military version model 58C handles very close to the M-1 Garand. it is still unclear if the H&R ever marked the military version with model 58C as most seen to day will be marked model 65 but will have military acceptance marks on them. i have not seen any of the later model 165 or 150's with military acceptance marks. i believe it is safe to say that only the model 65 was sold to the government and then only used by the Marine Corp.

    the time line for these eugene reising designed rifle is as follows:
    model 65 (58C)=1944-1945 called the 'general'
    model 165= 1946-1947 called 'leatherneck' target grade semi-auto
    (very limited production also too place between 1959 and 1961)
    model 150= 1948-1952 called 'leatherneck' sporter grade

    there was also a model 151 differing only in the type of rear sights form the model 150. two magazines were available for the model 150 a 5 round and a 10 round

    H&R did a lot of exporting but most likely your rifle came to the philippines via way of some former owner.
    bill
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