Aviation Talk

Discussion in 'Vietnam Memories Forum' started by Guest, Mar 6, 2003.

  1. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Copr6
    Senior Chief Moderator III
    Posts: 147
    (5/11/01 6:47:30 am)
    | Del All Aviation Talk
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    I thought I would re-post this link due to the aviation posts.

    www.manchu.org/sounds/




    dap22
    Senior Chief Moderator II
    Posts: 491
    (5/11/01 9:10:23 am)
    | Del Re: Aviation Talk
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    Larry......listened to a couple of them...brought a few chills back and raised the hair on the back of my neck. Guess I know too much now and didn't know shit back then.. ah.....the beauty of youth.

    homer4
    Moderator
    Posts: 566
    (5/11/01 12:42:21 pm)
    | Del Re: Aviation Talk
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    Thanks!,the last time they were here I'd periodicaly would go back and listen to some...lots of stuff comes flooding back.
    ...and two hard boiled eggs.

    longshot1
    Moderator
    Posts: 26
    (5/11/01 4:35:22 pm)
    | Del Re: Aviation Talk
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    I just listened to the gunship tape. It rattled me to my bones. I couldn't finish it. I felt that same
    block of ice in my stomach.
    . I forgot what we all willingly did, without a second thought.
    After I calm down, I'll give it another go. Jesus!

    NickG

    Copr6
    Senior Chief Moderator III
    Posts: 148
    (5/11/01 4:52:03 pm)
    | Del Re: Aviation Talk
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    Dave...good perspective on the "then and now". In my civilian job there are times I look back and think..."why in the hell did I do it that way"?
    Nick...this is sort of easy for me to say but there comes a times when you look any evil in the eye and say..."f*ck you"!! I have had to do this in order to help control my Panic Attacks.

    longshot1
    Moderator
    Posts: 27
    (5/11/01 6:14:03 pm)
    | Del Re: Aviation Talk
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    I thank you for posting it. I will never forget those events, but I think it may be a good thing to be reminded of their intensity. They were life altering events. One thing I didn't mention as it sounds a bit corny, but listening to it also made me feel as I always have about it --proud. My God it took me back.

    It was probably a good thing that we were all too young to know any better. lol

    NickG

    Copr6
    Senior Chief Moderator III
    Posts: 153
    (5/11/01 6:23:09 pm)
    | Del Re: Aviation Talk
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    Nick...You got it whipped with that post!!

    dap22
    Senior Chief Moderator II
    Posts: 497
    (5/11/01 7:25:35 pm)
    | Del Re: Aviation Talk
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    Maybe you're right....we were too young to know any better. I agree about the flashbacks, Nick, listening to the taking fire and the panic in one guy's voice seeing another helicopter go down......been there and done that just too many times.....but it seems like it was only yesterday. That's the scary part.

    dap22
    Senior Chief Moderator II
    Posts: 503
    (5/11/01 8:33:44 pm)
    | Del Re: Aviation Talk........Losses
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    As much as I don't like to think about it, one fact that came out of Vietnam (and it's not very well publicized for obvious reasons) is that most helicopter crashes were not as much a result from enemy action as much as from pilot error. Let me clarify by saying that the electronics that the Army saw fit to supply us with were extremely crude by today's standards and were even then crude compared to what the Air Force and Navy aircraft were outfitted with. My unit was very fortunate to have a nav system called Decca which was, I believe, the front runner to Loran. The problem with it was that it was extremely finnicky and although we had our own Decca rep with us, many units would malfunction in the middle of a mission and that rat bastid wouldn't ever leave the compound. But anyhow, in dustoff, many of our missions were during the night and often in IFR conditions (instrument flying required). The Army did not adequately train most pilots to fly instruments (there are those who'd suggest that a Huey wasn't the best instrument aircraft anyhow....slightly less than a 2 hour useable fuel load). As a result, many crashes were realistically attributable to pilot error although were most often attributed to a combat loss.
    The bottom line is that most of us who went to Vietnam had had only the experience of flight school (200+ hours) and then OJT (on the job training in Vietnam). Not to say a shit load of aircraft didn't get shot down but, many of us were either very lucky or just didn't go beyond the level of our capabilities or, if we did, got away with it. Once again, the wonder of youth......invincible and indestructible....atleast we thought so.

    Edited by: dap22 at: 5/11/01 9:35:43 pm

    longshot1
    Moderator
    Posts: 28
    (5/11/01 10:26:39 pm)
    | Del Re: Aviation Talk........Losses
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    I recall two occassions when ships went down, both having stuck their tails in the trees.
    In both instances we were told to gun the downed ships. (all parties removed). One we
    had to destroy, which is a story on its' own, and the other to cover it up.
    Everyone was doing their best under extreme circumstances, but there were always those
    hard asses who were looking to hang someone. No need for that kind of trouble in the middle of a
    damned war. As I write this I am remembering some of those sorry A/Os.
    Anyway it felt damned odd shooting up our own ships.
    OK OK it was fun at the time.

    NickG

    Copr6
    Senior Chief Moderator III
    Posts: 156
    (5/12/01 5:48:56 am)
    | Del Re: Aviation Talk
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    Dave/Nick...I don't know anything about choppers. But, I did take a chopper from Long Binh to Saigon...once!! I don't recall the flying time but it wasn't long enough. I really liked the openess about the experience. When I finally got out of the Army and went back to work I checked into obtaining flight lessons. I was told that I would have to get fixed-wing first. That ended that!

    dap22
    Senior Chief Moderator II
    Posts: 504
    (5/12/01 9:25:31 am)
    | Del Re: Aviation Talk
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    Larry, that's the normal route but......I did it just the opposit. Of course, the Army provided my helicopter training and I then went out and got my fixed wing ratings. Of course, later on during my career, the Army decided to send me to fixed wing school......go figure. I always preferred helicopters over airplanes, even during the years I was flying half decent twin engine airplanes.. just a lot more comfortable in a helicopter. Of course, there are those who would call me crazy for thinking like that but hey.......it's a comfort thing.
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